"Technically, in spite of the fact that hardly any Mormons believe it, [the god created by Joseph Smith] is supposed to have been Adam, and has apparently been Adam many times, on each planet where he brought Wife No. ## as Eve."

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,904862,905156#msg-905156

Now I don't know much about Adam-God, other than it was taught by Brigham Young. I don't recall having heard of it in my teenage forced churchgoing, though Dadbotaz may well have mentioned it. He was always bringing up weird stuff that he'd heard in Priesthood or read in the scriptures. He was trying to convince himself, I think, and would have been all over the internet if it had existed. I remember him saying Adam was the Archangel Michael.

I'm sure I hadn't heard that Adam-God was Joseph Smith's idea, or that Eve was really our anonymous Heavenly Mother and AG had populated other planets with other Eves.

Regardless of whose idea this was, imagine the ego behind it. I can do this almost naturally, having spent a couple of years learning how scumbaggy con-man stories work and then realized that Mormonism is also a scumbaggy con-man story. It's easy to spot the personal fantasies and agendas of the storyteller.

Holy mother of man-god! Dude is picturing himself populating the entire universe.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/25/2013 01:42PM by munchybotaz.

I hate that man Brigham Young. To be one of his non-cared for wives would have been hell on earth. If ever I could hate a dead man who lived centuries before me, he is the person I hate the most. Even the mention of his name repulses me. I read the Journal of Discourses. His sermons are pure evil against women and black people. I hope he's lost in the cosmos falling through an eternal black hole somewhere.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/25/2013 01:38AM by snuckafoodberry.

and a lot more industrious, or ambitious, or something. Maybe he was just more practical. I'm not sure how I feel about him. I wouldn't exist without him, since he baptized one of my six great-great-gullible grandpas and brought him and the other five to Utah along with the gullible widow and children of a seventh great-great grandpa. The eighth one came with the railroad.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/25/2013 01:40PM by munchybotaz.

One, Brigham Young didn't bring the widow, my great-great-gullible grandma Francis Jemima Sweatt Ferrell, to Utah quite as directly as he brought my great-great-gullible grandpas. Francis came in 1889, following some of her children who had joined the church along with her a year earlier in Illinois, and she wasn't a widow when she got to Utah. Well, she was, but she was also married to her second husband, John Bell Ferrell. I could never find anything about him and assumed he had died in Tennessee. But now there are records online, and it turns out he died in Utah. He came with his wife and was baptized after he got there. So make that seven great-great-gullible grandpas, not six.

Two, I'm suddenly a lot surer how I feel about Brigham Young, having started reading Wife No. 19. OMG, what a scumbag! Much worse than I thought, and I think even worse than Joseph Smith--even if I assume the author is embellishing, which she may well be. But it turns out she was born Mormon, just a couple months after Joseph Smith was killed in 1844, and in Utah from 1848 on. I'm finding her believable because she was there, and because I've read about some of BY's dastardly deeds elsewhere. The others are not a stretch. So many dastardly deeds--it's really quite shocking to read them all in one place, and I'm not even halfway through the book. She hasn't even married him yet!

Brigham Young was so bad and so brazen that I'm thinking it's not unreasonable to compare my x-great gullible grandparents and especially those who were around in the 1850s, trapped as they were, to Germans who looked the other way during the holocaust.

Yeah, he was that bad--fortunately, on a much smaller scale. There's really no defense. This is the start of a big rethink for me.

Over and over again my poor dyslexic mind kept reading "hot-taters." I couldn't figure out where you were going with that. I must be oxygen-starved.

of his Adam/God doctrine.

but I've also seen other instances where Brigham Young attributed things to Joseph Smith as a way of legitimizing himself. I'm thinking about reading Wife No. 19 as a way of learning more about him.

The LDS religion used to teach (at least in Seminary and Priesthood during the late 1960's) that Adam and Eve were born on another planet and brought to Earth to start the human race here.

The Garden of Eden was not actually a place on earth but where Adam and Eve lived (space ship) while being transported from their home world to Earth.

We need Captain Kirk or Spock to explain how this works.

with everyone knowing the Garden of Eden was in Missouri and we were all gonna walk there and everything. How do you know it was taught?



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/25/2013 05:25PM by munchybotaz.

I have never heard this... I have a feeling that this was a one off person who thought they had things figured out, they also obviously never went through the temple as the location is plainly stated as earth and that God created Adam and Eve to live right there on Earth.

In the Temple, they teach quite plainly that Adam is Michael the Archangel. As Adam wakes, the narrator states "Brethren and sisters, this is Michael, who helped form the earth." This is the current official doctrine, at least for temple goers.

Brigham Young, for some reason taught that Adam and God were the same, perhaps, Michael goes on to become God? I'm not sure how that would work. But I do believe that this is in print somewhere, maybe the Journal of Discoures? Not sure off the top of my head.

pewsitter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> The Garden of Eden was not actually a place on
> earth but where Adam and Eve lived (space ship)
> while being transported from their home world to
> Earth.

Are you remembering this correctly? It was taught that the earth was created near Kolob, and Adam and Eve were on this earth (near Kolob) and that when A&E fell, the earth fell also and was removed to it's present location. But I'm unfamiliar with just the garden being transported.

I've heard that Adam was the archangel Michael too. What I find interesting is that Mormons don't believe in the Trinity, but Adam can be God and possibly also archangel Michael (?).

Never heard what Pewsitter says about the Garden of Eden. I thought the Garden of Eden was in Missouri. Who else heard that the GofE was not on earth?

from BY:

“Though we have it in history that our father Adam was made of the dust of this earth, and that he knew nothing about his God previous to being made here, yet it is not so; and when we learn the truth we shall see and understand that he helped to make this world, and was the chief manager in that operation. He was the person who brought the animals and the seeds from other planets to this world, and brought a wife with him and stayed here. You may read and believe what you please as to what is found written in the Bible. Adam was made from the dust of an earth, but not from the dust of this earth. He was made as you and I are made, and no person was ever made upon any other principle.”

http://journalofdiscourses.com/3/46

On that page, do a search for "dust".

Actually, there is no documentation, other than the words of Brigham Young in The Journal of Discourses:

http://journalofdiscourses.com/1/8

that Joseph Smith ever taught it, so my apologies. I was guilty of light-mindedness, which just goes to show you the dangers of fucking with your temple covenants.

:)

But that's the sermon where he gives this bizarre quote:

"Now hear it, O inhabitants of the earth, Jew and Gentile, Saint and sinner! When our father Adam came into the garden of Eden, he came into it with a celestial body, and brought Eve, one of his wives, with him. He helped to make and organize this world. He is Michael, the Archangel, the Ancient of Days! about whom holy men have written and spoken—He is our Father and our God, and the only God with whom we have to do."

He goes into greater detail, to the point where what is taught in the temple becomes more of a metaphor, at least to me. I figured that the temple film was largely a morality play, seeing as Peter, James and John (i.e. Larry, Darryl and Darryl) and a mid-twentieth century Christian minister showed up. But the stuff that was doctrinally "factual" (Michael is Adam) became more of a circus act. I did mental acrobatics to tell myself that sometimes God takes on the role of Elohim, sometimes Michael, and sometimes Adam.

Therefore, sometimes Brigham Young is Joseph Smith. And sometimes I'm a peanut butter sandwich. It's all relative. Thank Adam I'm out of this goddamned church.