"The people are nicer here than in Stockholm, or at least that's
what I think. It's a little more of a small town here and people
aren't in such a big hurry. Sweden is so green, I LOVE IT! So
beautiful. I have taught a couple different investigators now.

Most of our investigators are African. The Africans are so much
more humble and open to our message. It confuses all of us,
because the Second Harvest says that Swedes will accept the
gospel, but all we can find is immigrants who want to hear our
message. But hopefully we'll be able to find more Swedes who
will listen."

I found these heartbroken Swedes so genuine and passionate, sincere and real. They were entertaining these Mormon shills in their second language almost begging them to help them understand how the leaders can maintain an air of credibility as to their Mormon positions and actions.

I fell in love with this group and hope they are separated from Mormonism and on there way to better days without any more cost than necessary.

I'm on their team, not the Mormons or the NOMs. I care about what they have been put through.

https://archive.org/details/FiresideInSweden



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2014 10:27PM by gentlestrength.

Oh if only my great grandfather and g-grandmother had known when the elders accosted them in Sweden all those years ago all which they should have known.....

wtf, I wouldn't be here today typing my ass off!

:o)

True story

I sometimes wonder if they should not have stayed in Stockholm. They came to SLC in 1922 when my grandpa was a baby.

I have Swedish convert ancestors, too. They joined in the 1850s--they loved the idea of being reunited with their dead loved ones, especially their children.

Then they came to the US, walked across the plains, arrived in Utah, found out about polygamy, and had all their carpentry tools stolen. They then were sent to northern Arizona, where they and their posterity were rebellious and grumpy forever after.

Page?

First Snowflake, then what became Lakeside/Pinetop.

A message on a Swedish forum made me laugh: you can tell a swede but you can't tell him anything! I laugh with my husband over that one as we both have Swedish ancestry.
It is a shame that TSCC will take advantage of anyone they can (thinking of the immigrants).

The immigrants will take care of themselves and vanish when they realize the church isn't donating, or helping them move to the States.

If only that were the case 100 years ago.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2014 11:49AM by axeldc.

ipo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Most of our investigators are African. The
> Africans are so much more humble and open to
> our message.

Right up until they find out that, not only will they get no money from the church, they are expected to *pay* money to it.

Just wait until they learn they used to be expected to whiten up if they got righteous.

Because their beautiful black skin is a curse from God.

Inspiring message, no?


Anagrammy

My niece is also on a Swedish mission. She had already studied there for 2 summers on scholarship, so she is quite fluent. She seldom uses her Swedish; he investigators are mainly Muslim immigrants.

Guess the Swedes have become wiser than they were back when my ancestors decided to join the Mormons.

Anyone who thinks that Swedes are cold-hearted doesn't know much about Swedes and should probably not be there. Are they Americans? No. Should they act like Americans? I hope not.

I'd like to know what the second harvest is too. Did somebody tell the missionaries a flood of people would listen to them and join the church?

The "Second Harvest" is something the LDS mission presidents in Sweden have been harping on for years. It is a reference to something Monson or Hinckley supposedly said, something about a new, or second, harvest of the Swedish people. Thousands would join. It would be just like in the early days of the church when so many joined in Scandinavia.

Well, that hasn't happened. Never will.

It was talked about at every zone/district conference when I was a missionary in Sweden 11 years ago.

I don't think the Brethren have fully come to terms with the fact that the white and delightsomes aren't signing up anymore.

... or is it the second most? I can never remember.

Of my eight sets of great-great grandparents, only the ones from Sweden did not fall for Mormonism. The other seven sucked it up like Hoover.

No, wait--I have to qualify that. I always forget that one of my other great-great grandmothers was from Sweden. She was the third polygamous wife of my great-great grandfather from Norway.

This is from a writeup about her that I found on some distant relative's website:

"In 1862 when she was twenty-one years of age, she joined the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Her parents were infuriated that she should claim membership with such an unpopular group. They were so bitter that she was disowned. They forbade her to come into their home, and threw her belongings out of the house. But undaunted she decided to go to Utah ...."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2014 12:30PM by munchybotaz.

Native Swedes are a bit difficult to get to know and warm up slowly. If you ever make a friend you will discover they are a friend for life. However they have had Mormons as guests knocking on their doors day and night since the 1850s. Most Swedes have talked to Mormon missionaries many times and many have taken the challenge and prayed about the church. Many have received the answer that the devil is behind mormonism, and yet they still treat Mormons kindly and allow them freedom to preach their fraud. Think carefully about exploiting the down out illegals from Africa, they are only looking for a place to belong, once they learn how Mormons treat people of color they will soon have nothing to do with the Church.

If not for illegal Africans in Western Europe, the Mormons would be having no (so-called) "success" at all there. The African illegals are the down-and-out, the illiterate, and those most bereft of education and information in all of Europe. It's low-hanging fruit and their "conversions" are a sad indictment of the Mormon effort there. But it does show that tithing and the bottom line are not the only things that Mormons think about. Sadly, raw numbers are so important to them that missionaries have even been known to glean names off of tombstones and send them into the mission president new contacts.

"The Africans are so much
more humble and open to our message. It confuses all of us..."

Humble is a code word for "less valiant", eh?

How fluent are recent african immigrants to Sweden, and how well do the mishies communicate the "restored gospel" to them?
I think the theory that a ticket to the Untied States may be a big part of the appeal, among other thinly veiled promises.

My sister and BIL went on a couple mission to Denmark. He complained the Danes were too happy to care about religion. He said they needed some sort of large scale trouble to "humble" them. Ah, I thought, so the church is only for miserable people.

I know someone on a mission in Finland. He has the same issue. He's nearing the end of his mission and was "super excited" that he just got to talk to an entire Finnish family for the first time, even though the father told them not to come back. Most of his investigators are Nigerians, who often disappear before baptism, single unemployerd people, or figments of their imaginations.

I am absolutely fascinated by TSCC presence in Europe.

I only lived there (Spain) for a bit but I love hearing all the stories here on the board. . .

My only point of reference is when I was in Spain I attended the local ward a few times. If I recall, there were like 3 sets of missionaries that did pretty much all the running of the meetings and a very small congregation. Only one traditional LDS family (mom, dad, herd of kids, wearing garmies) was there. There was one newlywed couple that was a spanish guy and a gal from Idaho. I think that must have been a missionary conversion. There were a fair amount of single people of all ages and definitely a crazy lady who one day cornered my in the hall and told me that her kids brought over a whisky flavored cake and she was so despondent because of it.

I guess it's just inertia that keeps the church sending mishies there. Well, and they're white. There was nothing for me to do in Germany in the 70s. I walked around, or for 6 weeks rode a bicycle, then came home. My roommates who went to Denmark and Switzerland had the same experience. I can only imagine how pointless it is now.

I like that potential converts are referred to as a harvest. It shows what the church is all about.

What bs!

My best friend is Swedish, and he is the most warmhearted, caring, nurturing, most kind, most helpful person I know.

But he is not stupid. He would never fall for a cult. He was raised atheist by atheistic parents. He is very close with his family. He loves his family, & his family loves him back. They are close & loving without having to be brainwashed into a cult!

So I guess "humble" means gullible? The Swedes aren't humble enough to fall for the cult, I guess that means they aren't gullible enough.

It may also mean (unintentionally, of course) "less informed", and hence more gullible. Anyone who had even cursorily heard about Monson fraud case, or seen mormonthink or similar (similar sites are available also in native Scandinavian languages) is not going to give them even a chance. Not to mention that the general attitude toward religions in general is much less accepting than in the U.S. In Scandinavia "being religious" is often somewhat synonymous with "having a few screws loose". It's an uphill battle for TSCC there.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2014 10:29PM by Facing Tao.

Nordic people don't believe things without thinking about it. They also don't like pushy people and are very sensitive to lying or hiding truth. They are usually quite frank and expect that of others. I'm not a Swede, but 1/4 Norwegian. I have no idea if I have any traits from my Nordic roots, but I've always been sort of a skeptic, and never one to jump into anything without a lot of consideration.

I've heard stories about people from poorer countries who will join lots of churches to hedge their bets. If one's good, more is better.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2014 10:00PM by rationalist01.