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Posted by: subieguy180 ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:25PM

The reason I'm posting this is because the bishop told me to make a list on why I should go on a mission and why I should not go on a mission and I know there is more reasons I should not go on a mission but I need to make the "Reasons NOT to go" list stronger than the "Reasons to go" list.

Reasons NOT to go:
-Step Dad was going to join the church and he decided not to because he couldn't drink tea,coffee,or Beer
-Friends are non-mormon and they know the church is messed up
-The Army will pay for college
-I can go to college after high school.
-I can make more friends in Army and college
-The prophet didn't go on his mission

Reasons to go:
-My Patriarchal Blessing said I should go on mission
-I get to be married in temple
-I get to be Elder
-I get to talk to other people

***NOTE:I'M PLANNING NOT TO GO ON MY MISSION BUT I SHOULD NEED MORE THINGS TO NOT GO ON MISSION***

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Posted by: freewill ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:29PM

Pretty sure you won't find a patriarchal blessing given to a young man these days that DOESN'T say they will go on a mission...

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Posted by: subeamnotlogedin ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:30PM

Because the church is FALSE!!! Don't spend 24 months of your life lying to people.
Polyandry
The Book of Abraham
The list of how wrong the church is goes on and on it is plain and simple not true and they take so much time and $$$$ from there members.

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Posted by: subieguy180 ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:33PM

I do have a conscience I don't want to spread lies to people and there lives become miserable

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Posted by: Bite Me ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:51PM

Let me re-phrase this for you...

In one word: "No."

In two words, said as if a New Yorker: "F*ck off."

In two words, but more polite: "Blow me."

In three words: "It's a cult."


Hope this helps.

:)

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Posted by: eunice ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:58PM

Be careful with giving the response of "blow me"...the bishop might take you up on the offer ;-)

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Posted by: Bite Me ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:23AM

Bwahahaha!

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Posted by: nationalnewscampaign ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:30PM

just for the record....this was back when dinosaurs ruled the earth but

a guy & a girl I went to high school with got married in the temple right out of high school. He didn't go on a mission.

Surprised a lot of people....but it's not actually true that a guy has to go on a mission to be married in the temple.

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Posted by: L Tom Petty ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:31PM

Reasons not to go:
The church is a fraud

Don't want to be a salesman for 2 years

Not comfortable being in the mission field with all the people who have come home early due to health concerns

Think could accomplish more doing something else

Can still be an elder without going on a mission

Can still be married in temple without going on a mission

Can't be guaranteed will learn a foreign language on a mission anymore, most missionaries are going stateside now

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:32PM

You don't need to make a list. You don't need to meet with the bishop. You don't need to explain yourself in this matter to *anyone*. Why do you keep beating yourself over the head about this?

You want to know what response unnerves people more than anything? Silence. Seriously, just stare at the bishop in complete silence if he starts blathering to you about a mission again. Don't say a word. You don't need to anyway, because he doesn't give a rat's patootie about your opinion. Let him blather on to himself. He loves the sound of his own voice. Let him hear it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/19/2014 10:32PM by summer.

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Posted by: subieguy180 ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:35PM

I will do that..If I ever meet with the bishop again..

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Posted by: madalice ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:32PM

You only need one reason. Either the church is what it claims to be, or it isn't.

Hint: After 3 years of study and 50 years as a member, I can safely say the church is NOT what it claims to be.

You need to know this for yourself. You need to read some books. Maybe start with reading MormonThink.com from beginning to end. You'll be secure in your decision when you have the facts.

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Posted by: Stray Mutt ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:33PM

Reasons not to go:

1. I think Mormonism is a cult
2. I think the leaders are frauds
3. I think the doctrines are harmful
4. If I went on a mission I would just goof off and waste everyone's money and time
5. See reason 1

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Posted by: gentlestrength ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:34PM

I do not feel it is honest of me to bear witness to something I have yet to know is True. I know this is expected of missionaries and I should not become a missionary until I know the Mormon church claims are a fair and honest representation of the Church.

To do so would be to bear false witness which is a sin (even for Mormons). Please support me in my need to be an honest person with my fellow man Bishop.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/19/2014 11:49PM by gentlestrength.

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Posted by: newnamenephi ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:22PM

"I do not feel it is honest of me to bear witness to something I have yet to know is True."

This is exactly what our 15-yr-old son said to my DW and I when he was about to go for his Priest interview and we were realizing the church was a fraud. Our incredibly honest son said, "I don't thinks it's right that I pass the sacrament to true believers when I, myself, don't believe."

We were blown away by his integrity (this was before he knew we were questioning our faith).

NOT GOING ON A MISSION:
*you can still become an Elder
*you can still be married in the temple
*you can still have children in the covenant
*you can still contribute to tithing
*you can still be a good example
*you can still be charitable
*you can pursue an education/career
*you can still be a good member of the ward
*you can still "keep the commandments"
*you can still live a "christ-like" life
*you can still be a good son
*you can still be a good "child of God"
*you will not bear false witness
*you will not blaspheme Christ's name (even if you don't believe in Christ)
*you will not throw away your, the church's, or your parent's, hard earned money
*you will take the time to grow into a critically thinking adult who will truly act on sound principals
*you will be a leader and not simply a follower
*you will show integrity by waiting or not going at all when you're doubting
*thousands of good LDS members have not gone on missions
*there's no reason to add undo stress and emotional depression into your life
*you can still be a righteous Latter-day Saint
*you can be an honest influence for others who have legitimate questions.
*you don't effin believe that God would command someone to statutorily rape a 14-year-old girl

There's a few reasons not to go. The last one opens up a can of worms against the entire freaking gospel!!

Vicariously, I'd love to relive part of my life through you. I was duped into this religion because I was born into it. I've been reading your posts and I really feel for you. I wish (like many of us here) that I could stick my brain in your body so you could understand the perspective of someone who has already been through everything you're going through.

If you want, and have the time, you can read my family's exit story on mormonthink.com under personal stories, Lance (M)(i)(l)(e)(s).

The decisions you make now will influence the rest of your life....choose wisely and good luck my young friend!

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Posted by: releve ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:36PM

You only need one reason. You don't want to go.

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Posted by: gentlestrength ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:42PM

This is what I most wanted to say, but went with a discussion reason in case he really wants to intwract with his Mormon bishop. As soon as he decides he is done with the Church, he no longer has a Mormon bishop--just a nosey neighbor on a power trip.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/19/2014 11:48PM by gentlestrength.

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Posted by: presleynfactsrock ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 10:52PM

How about:

1. Missions need to come later in a person's life if they decide on their own that this is what they want to do. I need to first study and learn more about all subjects, including other religions. At my age I have not had the opportunity to check things out on my own as I have been told that the mormon way is "the" way.

2. I do not want every minute of my live planned out for me.

3. I have the enthusiasm and desire to explore. This is what I want now. It is not being selfish as I need to know what makes me happy and deserve to have this happiness as every other person does too.

4. I do not want to go to a country where there is not proper medical facilities or where I would have to take chances with my health in anyway.

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Posted by: sayhitokolob4me ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:00PM

If you do not want to go, don't make a list, and don't meet with him again. He will simply deconstruct your list, convince you that your reservations are not warranted, and you will end up going on a mission.

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Posted by: Heartless ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:02PM

Under reasons to go: Strike off married in the temple. A mission is not a requirement to go. Strike being an elder. They made me one before my first tour in the military. Talk to people? You are doing that now.

Reason not to go: your heart is not in it.

Also...no more need to meet a bishop. Tell him you are done discussing a mission.

When does your enlistment start?

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Posted by: subieguy180 ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:13PM

I'm currently talking to a recruiter and I'm almost finished being processed. My grandma said she could careless if I went on a mission I'm 18 and I decided to join army reserves,go to college, and become an officer I want a Mechanical Engineering degree.

My grandma is full of joy that I'm wanting to go to college,join the military, and doing things I want. I love my grandma at least she's open minded about things.

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Posted by: nanone4nw ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:03PM

I WANT TO LIVE!!!!

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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:05PM

Mine list would have been thus:

1. I don't F'king want to!

But I never got to the bishop interview part...after Dad asked me.

Ron Burr

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Posted by: AngelCowgirl ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:13PM

Say you fasted and prayed about it and the answer was no.

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Posted by: Greyfort ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:19PM

I don't quite understand why you're playing his game. As long as you don't simply say to him, "Look, I've already made my plans. I'm not going. I do not have to justify this to you," he will feel that he has the power to make your decisions for you.

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Posted by: verilyverily ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:27PM

I agree with Greyfort, but if he insists..........
These need some fixing:
Reasons NOT to go:
-Step Dad was going to join the church and he decided not to because he doesn't believe in it
-Friends are non-mormon and they know the church is messed up but more importantly YOU know it is a disaster
-The Army will pay for college
-I can go to college after high school.
-I can make more friends in Army and college
-The prophet didn't go on his mission - this implies that you believe he is a profit - call him Monson and let them know he won't stand up for the church and go to England like he should so why should you give a crap about it and spend two years of your life on it

Reasons to go:
-My Patriarchal Blessing said I should go on mission - this is some fairy tale
-I get to be married in temple - YUCK! Do you really want to pretend to kill yourself?
-I get to be Elder - you'll be an elder - just wait until you are older
-I get to talk to other people - you are talking to us now...this doesn't work. you can talk to people anywhere.

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:31PM

Spending two years trying to find the right shade of lipstick for this pig is a waste of time.

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Posted by: Glo ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:35PM

He wants you to make the list so he can knock down your reasons one by one - it's an old salesman trick.

You don't owe him any effing list.You owe Mormonism NOTHING.

Refuse to meet with him, refuse to talk to him.
Whatever his requests are, let your answer be NO.

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Posted by: Elder What's-his-face ( )
Date: March 19, 2014 11:44PM

1. I'm old enough to make my own decisions.
2. I don't believe that the church is true.
3. I will not go, please see #1.

4. Dude, you're just a Bishop in a false church. Who the hell cares what you think.

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Posted by: Pooped ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:01AM

Reasons Not: Teaching Mormonism means promoting a scam.
While on a mission you subjugate yourself to people with false authority over you and pay for the privilege of having them abuse you. While on a mission you are getting further and further behind on education and career goals and learning nothing of substance except possibly a second language and culture. While on a mission you are wasting your and/or your parent's hard earned money selling a bogus philosophy to unsuspecting listeners. While on a mission you are giving credence to a corporation that falsely presents itself as a religion in order to receive beneficial tax positions and avoid having to provide transparency for its shady business dealings.

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Posted by: whatiswanted ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:05AM

How about "I do not want to be a traveling minister" "I do not want to teach the gospel" "I believe same sex marriage is not a sin and will not be silent on this matter"
" I refuse to live my life for anyone else"

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Posted by: MexMom ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:08AM

You do not need to explain yourself to anyone. You are not going on a mission!!!! Period!!!!

It is pointless to try and talk to the Bishop or any other TBM, they won't understand anything you are trying to say. They are just too much under the influence of mind control.

Stay strong and stand your ground. You are not going on a mission. You are your own person.

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Posted by: hayduke ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:09AM

All of the above.
Paying for being a volunteer.
Safety/health/liability concerns.

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Posted by: Greyfort ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:11AM

The only answer which needs to be said, if you must give one, is, "I do not believe and I cannot, in all conscience, go out there and try to convert people to something that I don't even believe in myself. My sense of honesty and integrity will not allow me to do that. I've made my plans. I'm sticking to them."

Don't even give him the chance to sales talk you, as Glo mentioned.

Again, as an adult, you do not need to justify anything to him. That drives me crazy about Mormonism. It takes time and effort to break away from that training, but we are not little children, as they always taught us to be. Child-like and teachable. Ugh.

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Posted by: libor nli ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:18AM

Here's a thought: Jesus didn't start his ministry until the age of thirty; are you more advanced than Jesus?

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Posted by: Brethren,adieu ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:23AM

Yet another reason not mentioned yet:
100. The church won't pay me enough money to be a salesman for them.
But seriously, going on a mission will eliminate 2 years of your income-earning ability. That's alot to give up.

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Posted by: The 1st FreeAtLast ( )
Date: March 20, 2014 12:39AM

First, it's your life, subieguy180, not the bishop's or anyone else's. You don't need to explain your decisions for your life to anybody, and you certainly aren't obliged to provide any person with a list of your reasons to leave the dishonest, dysfunctional and VERY rich Mormon Church.

The best reason to not waste two years of your life as a missionary marketing lies-based Mormonism is that it's cultic. Who says so? Steven Hassan, America's leading cult expert. The church is listed on his website at http://www.freedomofmind.com/Info/infoDet.php?id=140

If you wish, you can show a New York Times report from last July, "Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt", to the bishop: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/21/us/some-mormons-search-the-web-and-find-doubt.html?_r=0 (I strongly suggest you read it.)

In January 2012, Reuters, one of the largest news services in the world, reported:

"A religious studies class late last year at Utah State University in Logan, Utah, was unusual for two reasons. The small group of students, faculty and faithful there to hear Mormon Elder Marlin Jensen were openly troubled about the future of their church, asking hard questions. And Jensen was uncharacteristically frank in acknowledging their concerns.

"Did the leaders of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints know that members are 'leaving in droves?' a woman asked.

"'We are aware,' said Jensen, according to a tape recording of his unscripted remarks. 'And I'm speaking of the 15 men that are above me in the hierarchy of the church.'"

"'My own daughter,' he then added, 'has come to me and said, "Dad, why didn't you ever tell me that Joseph Smith was a polygamist?" For the younger generation, Jensen acknowledged, 'Everything's out there for them to consume if they want to Google it.' The manuals used to teach the young church doctrine, meanwhile, are 'severely outdated.'

"These are tumultuous times for the faith founded by Joseph Smith in 1830, and the rumbling began even before church member Mitt Romney's presidential bid put the Latter-Day Saints in the spotlight."

(Ref. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/01/31/us-mormonchurch-idUSTRE80T1CM20120131 )

In the same week, ABC News in Salt Lake City, reported:

"The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is losing a record number of its membership. A new report quotes an LDS general authority who said more members are falling away today than any time in the past 175 years.

"At meetings like General Conference, Utahns may be used to seeing members of the LDS Church show up in record numbers. But according to a recent Reuters article citing LDS General Authority Marlin K. Jensen, for the church as a whole, the record in going in a different direction.

"Elder Jensen told the news outlet times have changed, and 'attrition has accelerated in the last five or 10 years.'"

(Ref. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/2840941/posts )

Why would people leave the Mormon Church "in droves"/at a greater rate "than any time in the past 175 years"? Because Mormonism is a demonstrable fraud.

For starters, Joseph Smith created conflicting versions of his First Vision fable (lie). Details are at http://mit.irr.org/joseph-smiths-changing-first-vision-accounts

Even the LDS Church's Joseph Smith Papers website provides a version of JS' supposed First Vision (from his journal, no less!) that doesn't square with the official, 'faith'-promoting version. Details are at http://www.postmormon.org/exp_e/index.php/discussions/viewthread/38350/

You could ask the bishop used a hat to "translate" the Book of Mormon. I imagine that he'd say no. Well, here's what Mormon apostle Russell Nelson included in his July 1993 Ensign article about JS "translating" the BoM:

"Joseph Smith would put the seer stone into a hat, and put his face in the hat, drawing it closely around his face to exclude the light; and in the darkness the spiritual light would shine. A piece of something resembling parchment would appear, and on that appeared the writing. One character at a time would appear, and under it was the interpretation in English. Brother Joseph would read off the English to Oliver Cowdery, who was his principal scribe, and when it was written down and repeated to Brother Joseph to see if it was correct, then it would disappear, and another character with the interpretation would appear. Thus the Book of Mormon was translated by the gift and power of God, and not by any power of man."

(Ref. https://www.lds.org/ensign/1993/07/a-treasured-testament?lang=eng )

And here's what the church's Friend Magazine said in one of its article for Mormon kids:

"Joseph also used an egg-shaped, brown rock for translating called a seer stone. The translating was done at Peter Whitmer’s home, a friend of the Prophet’s where Oliver Cowdery, Emma Smith (Joseph’s wife), one of the Whitmers, or Martin Harris wrote down the words spoken by the Prophet as soon as they were made known to him.

"Martin Harris said that on the seer stone 'sentences would appear and were read by the Prophet and written by [the one writing them down] and when finished [that person] would say "written;" and if correctly written, the sentence would disappear and another take its place; but if not written correctly it remained until corrected, so that the translation was just as it was engraven on the plates.'”

(Ref. https://www.lds.org/friend/1974/09/a-peaceful-heart?lang=eng )

A small rock supposedly imbued with a supernatural power in JS' hat that magically generated a "piece of something resembling parchment" - really?? LOL!! What about the purported BoM gold plates that JS said he was given by the angel Nephi (later changed to Moroni)?? LMAO!!

Here's the motherlode of info. about Mormonism: http://www.utlm.org/navtopicalindex.htm

Here's info. about the massive corporate/business aspect of the financially opaque LDS Church: http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-07-10/how-the-mormons-make-money

Here's more info.:

1. "An Insider's View of Mormon Origins" by Grant Palmer (M.A., American history, Brigham Young University), "a three-time director of LDS Institutes of Religion in California and Utah, a former instructor at the Church College of New Zealand, and an LDS seminary teacher at two Utah locations. He has been active in the Mormon History Association and on the board of directors of the Salt Lake Legal Defenders Association." (Ref. http://signaturebooks.com/2010/02/an-insiders-view-of-mormon-origins-2/ )

2. "Early Mormonism and the Magic World View" by Dr. D. Michael Quinn, "a professor of history at Brigham Young University, and a visiting professor of history (2002-03) at Yale." (Ref. http://signaturebooks.com/2010/02/early-mormonism-and-the-magic-world-view/ )

3. "Losing a Lost Tribe: Native Americans, DNA, and the Mormon Church" by Dr. Simon Southerton, former LDS bishop and "Principal Research Scientist in the Applied Biotechnology and Genomics area of the Commonwealth Scientific laboratories (CSIRO) in Canberra, Australia" (Ref. http://signaturebooks.com/2010/02/losing-a-lost-tribe-native-americans-dna-and-the-mormon-church/ )

4. "The Changing World of Mormonism" by Mormon history experts Jerald and Sandra Tanner: http://www.utlm.org/onlinebooks/changecontents.htm

5. "Early American Influences on the Book of Mormon" by researcher Tom Donofrio: http://mormonthink.com/influences.htm

6. "The Lost Book of Abraham": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcyzkd_m6KE

Want even more info. to add to your list? Check out my posts at http://www.postmormon.org/exp_e/index.php/discussions/search_results/d9ad38a03d4d9355d0a3bf0bde4ec23f/ and http://exmormon.org/phorum/search.php?2,search=,author=The+1st+FreeAtLast,page=1,match_type=ALL,match_dates=0,match_forum=2,match_threads=0

Finally, you can resign from the dishonest Mormon Church via email. Instructions are at http://www.exmormon.org/remove.htm

Best wishes!

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