I grew up in OR and graduated from BYU. Moved away as quickly as possible (still devout but didn't care for the bubble in Provo).

Within two years I researched my erstwhile faith and discovered how fraudulent it is (not to mention how poor faith is generally as an epistemology). I resigned immediately. Today I would describe myself as a militant atheist (militant in the sense that I actively argue against faith).

Two years later I'm considering graduate school. I had a great mentor at BYU to whom I would like to return but that's simply not going to happen (for a number of reasons).

UoU has a great graduate program in the subject in which I'm interested--also relatively close to my former mentor in a place in which I have a network in this area of study and work. Other benefits: I have a sister and her husband in the area and my wife and I really like them (sister is my best friend). We like the outdoors and UT has plenty of that. SLC is a happening town (within some limits!). Other extended family and some friends in the area.

What are the cons? Both with respect to UoU and SLC area generally?

I loathe the church. Will this be a problem? I know how omnipresent it is but I wonder if we can't make it work for a few years...

Does living in UT drive you nuts? Do you love/hate it?

Thank you.

I, personally, enjoy living in UT - others hate it.

I despise the church as much as anyone, but for me, that doesn't mean I despise the members - I feel bad for them.

I immensely enjoy the ex-mormon communities in Utah - you can find something pretty much every night of the week if you want to.

The UofU is, as I understand, a mix of Mormon and non-Mormon so you can easily gravitate whichever direction you prefer.

I love the mountains if northern UT and hate the cold winters - especially when an inversion settles in.

Been living in SLC for 15 months now. A nevermo from SoCal.
Yes, the mormon culture is omnipresent and takes some adjustment.
But if you are comfortable in your own skin, and you don't depend on the approval of others to define your self worth, and you are able to make your own decisions without fear,
you'll be fine.
SLC is great place to live.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2014 12:02PM by newtoutah.

This is true. Accept that there are some certifiably crazy TBMs. Aside from that, there are lots of "normal" people who keep their heads down because they are afraid of the religious wacko minions. Just stand up and own your opinions and be yourself. TSCC is crumbling as we speak. You have all the nevermos and exmos and then you have lots that are forced to go to church who are looking for an excuse and a way to stop going.

If you live closer to the downtown areas of SLC, I think you will like it more. There is not much difference between Utah Valley and some of the South Salt Lake suburbs.

You still can not get away from the Mormons and the control they have over the state and it gets old real fast. But there are some super neat non-mormon/ex-mormon/could-care-less mormons in Utah. And you have the mountains during the few months of the year that it is a plus.

I second NormaRae on this. I live near downtown and the culture has really evolved here due to many people moving in from out of state. I moved from out of state and it took awhile to get used to, but I have seen my neighborhood and surrounding areas evolve before my very eyes.

Overall, I think you will be fine at the U of U.

Thanks to everyone who has replied thus far. Hoping for more responses/experiences!

The U of U isn't a bad school, but let me give you some unsolicited advice. Find out what recent graduates of the program you are looking at are doing. Are they employed in the field, did that get top jobs? If you want to be very successful apply to the top three schools in your field and go to the school where you fit in the best, where you have a professor you really want to work for, and a school that has a good record of placing graduates in top jobs. If you are not good enough to get in the top three schools, reconsider getting a Ph.D.

Do I really need to answer that ?

Don't

Live there

Wow, that was weird...

I think I'm past getting a laugh out of their reactions to "my lifestyle." I live in Hyrum and I live with my gay husband (not divorced, but "separated" 19 years), my son, and my boyfriend lives a few miles away.

My neighbors treat me very well. The neighbors aren't the problem where Mormons are concerned. My daughter would be a problem, but she is out of state right now for another 4 months.

Sundays are GREAT here--especially going skiing. My boyfriend refuses to go skiing on Saturdays here. He is from Colorado and loves the fact that he can ski SO MUCH in a day rather than standing in lines and taking 5 hours to drive home from the resorts there. He is 40 minutes from skiing here.

I don't mind living here. I am surrounded by mountains. The nearest canyon to my house is 1.5 miles.

It depends on if you have a lot of TBM family/friends who live in UT.

Park City is a great place to live, but, the commute wouldn't be very fun. At this point, I would only comfortably recommend Park City though.

Having said that, I think Utah was much worse for me as a TBM (who grew up outside of Utah) than it is now as an exmo.

On second thought, if you have other choices I would stay away from Utah. :)

CON: In the winter time SLC is one of the most polluted places on the planet.

In the winter time it's really cold.

There is really ugly graffiti on the mountains which were already kinda ugly even before the graffiti.

Raising a child in Utah is a bad idea (you didn't mention kids but throwing it in just in case) Even the best public schools in Utah are mediocre when compared to schools in California. The mormon culture poisons the childhood experiences of mormons and non-mormons alike.

Politics in Utah - are controlled by the mormon church.

PRO: You can get out of the pollution if you go skiing at a resort above the pollution line.

I don't know about high school, but I'd say the elementary schools are better in Utah. We make fun of Mormons as a family, which helps the kids' perspectives a lot.

wastedtime Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't know about high school, but I'd say the
> elementary schools are better in Utah. We make fun
> of Mormons as a family, which helps the kids'
> perspectives a lot.


As someone who teaches the graduates of the California public school system (at a large community college), I have to say that I can hardly believe that the average Utah public school could possibly be worse academically than the average CA public school. (There are obviously some standout schools here, but I am speaking generally.)

1. In 60 seconds of research you could have discovered how wrong you are.

2. I hate to be the one to break it to you but the kids who can't get into 4 year colleges are not the best and the brightest. Yes the bottom 20 percent of California High school students might not be as smart as the top 20 percent from Utah schools BUT, that's not remotely what is being discussed. We are talking about school quality, not whether or not every single HS graduate from CA is smarter than every single UT HS grad.

But you would be wrong.

"There is really ugly graffiti on the mountains..."

Yeah, kind of like that big letter "Y" on the mountainside east of Provo

Been here 2+ years, nevermo, and I still like it. I live in the suburbs of Davis County, and I have never been bothered by missionaries. I did get one visit by a neighbor specifically to find out if I was LDS (I said no quite emphatically), and two older guys in suits and ties stopped by one evening. I made it very clear I was happy in my own religion, and that was that. I have lots of exmo and nevermo friends, and we do what we like. I am on good terms with my (mostly) LDS neighbors, but we never talk about religion. The outdoor activities in Utah are phenomenal, and the weather is much better than that in the upper Midwest where I moved from. The January inversion is truly dreadful though.

I love Salt Lake. It's very different than Provo. The only con is the City Center area. It has a bad, oppressive vibe to it. When I lived in Salt Lake, the downtown area was not a very mormon area and I loved it. I lived right downtown too. Now, that whole area where I lived is horrible! That's the only con that I know about Salt Lake City. I didn't know any mormons while I lived there.

Mormons certainly have a presence at the U, but they seem content to let people seek them out instead of proselyting/recruiting, for the most part.

In fact, other Christian groups proselyted much more often than any mormon effort last year there.

I wouldn't worry about mormons at the U if I were you. The quality of your education and health should be the main things on your mind.

issue is a bigger problem than the Mormons. Air quality can be extremely bad along the Wasatch Front in the winter, and unfortunately it is unlikely that it will ever get much better so long as this area remains habitable.

If you like easy access to the outdoors and skiing, then it's hard to do much better than SLC as to markets its size.

There are plenty of militant atheists in SLC, so you certainly wouldn't be alone. That said, the political and social climate here is still very much influenced by the LDS Church. If you are the kind of person who needs his or her lifestyle validated by the majority of the people around them, or by the political climate, then do not move here. That is not going to happen and you will be miserable.

Yo...im a nevermo in grad school at BYU. I never associate with undergrads on campus, and my experience seems MUCH different than theirs. I don't live in BYU approved housing, don't have to go to church or do anything religious, etc etc. My program is pretty liberal socially. It's not that bad at all. Compared to undergrad, there are much more non-LDS folks and less religious LDS people

living in utah county? hell on earth. oppressive, isolating, judgemental. I'm not prone to depression and that place made me suicidal

living in slc--it feels pretty great actually.

Good thing you graduated BYU before going AWOL or you would have never got the Eccleastical Endorsement I missed out on. Have all the academic credentials but being held hostage by the inactivity. LOL Woe is Me!

If you're going to have kids or have them, no, Utah sucks. Adults can deal with the culture and get away from most of the Mormon crap, except politics. But kids are stuck dealing with the worst of the culture and absorbing the idiotic Mormon repression and active aggression against women, sexuality, and overall free thought.

It is not worth it.

I'm rarely bothered by Mormons and I rarely hear about their church activities. Statistically they aren't around much anyways.

I also teach up at the University of Utah. It isn't a very Mormon school and you won't see it much there. You'll encounter Mormonism here, but only if you go looking for it or if you have Mormon family.

I love living in Utah.

The weather is perfect.
The people are smart, informed and friendly.
The economy is strong.
The university system is world class.
The air is clean.
The art scene is superb.
Lots of local organic produce.
The best wines and weed in the world.
Liberal government.
And Mormons have virtually no impact on society.

Wait.

I'm not living in Utah.

I live in Northern California.



Never mind...

My wife just took a much needed vacation in Bodega Bay. She called me up and said the Pacific Ocean brought her to tears when she saw it. The fog rolls in and out every day there like a catharsis. My son and I will greet her with open arms when she returns tomorrow. We love living in California.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/04/2014 10:22PM by donbagley.

Bodega bay is spectacular. So much open and undeveloped land right on the coast was an incredible surprise for a boy raised in Southern California.

Glad the Wife had a great vacation here.

Perhaps someday I'll have the opportunity to buy you a whiskey when you take a trek west?

Trust me man, downtown SLC is a bubble all of its own. Whole different animal than Provo. I grew up in Provo and now live in SLC. Only old people and a few scattered families are Mormon in downtown SLC. The Aves and Sugarhood/house is very liberal. Utah kicks ass as far as recreational activities go.