It's a subtle thing that has bugged me. The man always speaks last. When I did the Sacrament Meeting program, I did a subtle protest and put the women last and the man first :) they never told me who was speaking when, so I did it. :P Of course they changed it.

Can't have people going away with the last words they hear being from a woman! Can't imagine anything worse....

I realized that years ago. My husband despises speaking in public, even though he's quite good at it.

He would get up first (ignoring the announcements and program) say he had to speak right then or he'd be running out of the room from fear of speaking. Nobody ever told him to sit down.

I always had the last say. Apparently they didn't like that in our last ward. We only spoke once in 10 years.

Yeah, the priesthood holder is always the grand finale.

Women do in our ward regularly.

great :)

I've seen it done as well...but probably only a few times in 1,500+ sacrament meetings.

It depends on the bishop. My ward used to always have the man last. Then we changed bishoprics and women started occasionally speaking last. I pointed out the change to a TBM woman as I saw it for the first time, and she didn't have any comments. It seemed to me she never noticed it before.

Unless they are being called to serve a mission like in my ward yesterday. Otherwise no but it seems that women get to do the closing prayer though! So in essence maybe they speak last!??

I went to a mission farewell for a women recently and she didn't get to speak last. It really stole the moment from her when the Sunday School president got up after her talk and spoke on the new Sunday School curriculum. At least your ward allows a sister missionary her moment in the spotlight.

Didn't the church outlaw missionary farewells and homecomings a while back? They used to always have the missionary and their family speak on a topic of their choosing, but now they just put the outgoing or incoming missionary into the regular program, assigned topic and all.

Yes, you're right. They're still farewells in the sense that family and friends come to hear the missionary speak before he/she leaves. But, the whole meeting isn't dedicated to the missionary like it used to be.

I remember a few meetings where women spoke last - I can remember one clearly, because I was asked to say the closing prayer. When I would give the closing prayer, I would always try and include an idea or a key phrase from each of the talks given - in this particular meeting, I got frustrated because the woman who was speaking last kept drifting from one topic to another, without really giving me anything to work with. I have very few memories of individual meetings, but I can very clearly remember sitting in church, feeling a combination of pure anxiety over having to speak in public and great irritation over this woman's complete lack of structure in her talk. So yeah, I think it can happen, just depends on how muchof a pricked the local leaders are.

They wanted to make a quiet statement.

In my last ward they let a woman speak last a several times. I know it's rare, but it does happen. That ward was also, hands down the most conservative ward I was ever in. If it was an edict from SLC that a PH holder had to give the closing talk they wouldn't have deviated from it.

wrong!!!


On July 20 a woman was the final speaker in the ward I have to attend

I'm female and have been the closing speaker more than once.

Me too

When I was in the Branch Presidency, I was instructed by a member of the Stake Presidency that when assigning talks, I should assign them in this order:

1. Youth Speaker
2. Female Speaker
3. Priesthood Holder (concluding speaker)

This was the "ideal" arrangement.

There is nothing official that demands this, but it is generally done by convention. It definitely underscores the inequality of men and women in the church.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/28/2014 04:44PM by The Oncoming Storm - bc.

The patriarchy also pervades the business community in Utah.

I tried to apply for a loan for my business and the bank said no. My husband goes in with the same exact situation and they say yes.

Later, when I had to refuse a delivery of an enormous printing press my husband ordered without my permission, I had to produce my Articles of Incorporation to prove I was the president, not him.

They couldn't believe it.



Kathleen Waters

No, I don't go to Mormon church. Haven't been for a long time.

Why do women tolerate this culture? Some of the most devoted and entrenched Mormons I know, that teach both their sons and daughters that Mormonism is the One True Church, are females.

A while ago I asked my TBM husband who was in the bishopric at the time about why women never speak last. His instant answer: "women don't feel comfortable speaking when the time is open-ended." (You know how the last speaker may have to lengthen or shorten their talk depending on how much time has been taken by the other speakers.) This really offended me. I asked, "Oh, and do you feel this is true in the corporate world (at work) also?" His answer: "No."

I often wonder how the pen*shood can rectify their patriarchal view of women in the church with how they see the women that they come in contact with in their ordinary non-church lives; you know, the ones they work beside who are doing the same work they do and are just as capable, or the women bosses, doctors, judges, lawyers, police, etc. that they may come in contact with.

Gotta find a way to support the idiotic utterings of the cult - no matter what kind of BS it takes.

Like mormonrealitycheck said- there is a particular order that is commonly "prefered" and generally followed.

Women don't speak last because a man always decides who speaks, and when, and who "closes" with the prayer, so, no matter what, a man has the last say.

Last week a woman was the last speaker in my sacrament meeting. I think that men are more likely the last speaker, but I don't think it's any sort of policy.

It is an unwritten order of things, but yes, if they have all women speaking, which at times happens, a woman will be last. It is "supposed to" be the youth speaker, woman, man

Never really noticed but now that you mention it.....

One time I was asked to speak, I was then serving as RS president. Someone spoke first, then it was mine turn and the closing speaker was young man, probably around 20 but still a YSA. It kind of bothered me that I was not the last speaker but I also thought I was being proud and letting 'the calling' make me feel special. Must have been one of those cog dis thingies I told myself to ignore. LOL

Men have the priesthood and are wiser. :-) In case the woman doesn't bring in the spirit, the man's presence and authroity on which he speaks is sure to bring in the holy ghost home run by speaking last.

My spouse asked to speak last one time when we were asked to speak on Sunday. Yeah, she was turned down. I just laughed. We were a year away from never coming back.

Of course, most Sacrament talks are very boring and very rarely do you crack a true smile and chuckle over the stories shared. At least in my old ward.

I sometimes rehashed stuff from the lds.org website and didn't put too much effort in some of my talks. I did share some funny stories and had people wake up from their slumber. I always laughed internally when members of the congregation thanked me for my words and how spiritual it was. I would thank them and sometimes follow up what they enjoyed. It was so wonderful, or spirturual, or just the right thing for them to hear that day. haha! Fucking cult.

I was told once it was policy to have a melch priesthood holder end. Then I was told that was bullshit. Just one of those Mormon things that varies on a whim.