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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 06:16PM

I will take her totally out of context and agree with her.

http://ashley-nance.com/an_open_letter_to_ordain_women/

"I’m talking stark raving mad."

Yes, Ashley Nance you are talking like you are stark raving mad.

I thought this was parody when I was reading it.

But I think it is for real.

http://ashley-nance.com/about/

And she probably represents the kind of member the brethren love.

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Posted by: blueorchid ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 06:35PM

You actually read all that? Wow! Just skimming was painful.

She's too late for me. I already broke up with the monster. Have you broken up with your monster? Hahahahaah ha.

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 06:39PM

Wow. That blog reeks of the cult.
Have to clean the house to watch conference, so the "spirit" will show up (which, of course, won't happen if there's dust on the windowsill).
The representative of the Lord on earth asked you not to do something, and you did it! How dare you!

At one point she says, "Once upon a time, I was in a relationship with a psychopath."

You still are, dear. It's the LDS church.

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Posted by: Raging ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 07:30PM

Every time I read something written by a mormon I think, this is so f***ing embarrassing for them. They sound truly ignorant, breathtakingly judgmental and self-righteous, yet they're usually bleating about how they need some old man to tell them what to do and YOU NEED to do that as well.

My favorite part of this diatribe is when she tells these uppity disobeyers that the people of ordain women don't know or love them so don't follow them. Good god woman, Monson and the gang know you and love you? Oh ya, they don't know you. As for love, does this silly woman believe anyone who tells her they love her? (To be honest, she probably does considering her stalker story.) Plus, they say they love you, are concerned about you, and to show just how dedicated they are they'll take 10% of everything you have. She has no idea that not only do the "brethren" not care about her one whit, but they are lying to and robbing her to boot! Not only that, they also have convinced her to do their dirty work and write something this stunningly stupid. I would feel sorry for the mormon peons, if only they didn't behave like jackasses at just about every turn.

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Posted by: peaceinfreedom ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 08:01PM

Posted this for her, at least this forum will see it before her blog followers ever do.



"It’s so good to see a true woman of God who truly loves and cares so much for her fellow man (and woman) by putting up her own strengths for the rest of those deeply flawed to see. I love how you are upholding what you’ve been taught in the church. How dare they even consider joining the Ordain Women organization and making the Prophet himself hurt! I bet God cries so much over their sins and it’s only signs that the second coming must be so close!

Or is it?

No, in actuality, I find your self righteousness and need to place yourself on a soapbox and proclaim judgement upon others, quite unpleasant. Unfortunately, this is what comes when women who have been taught very well at the hands of men who seek to control them do. You try and sympathize with others by using a story of your own (dating a psychopath) but do not actually understand that you yourself are following men who don’t actually care about the women of the church. It’s sad really, to watch someone so willing to fight and protest the men’s cause, thinking it’s correct, but not able to see it happening.

Please continue to flaunt your righteousness, your Christlike nature, your perfect home, your baked cookies and wonderful memories of your children in a peaceful setting for Conference. Want to know the real reason the church leaders looked sad? Thousands of members are resigning their names because they found out the truth about the church’s history and figuring it out (faster than you) than it’s not true and sadly false. BUT, it will take probably your entire life to figure that out. Maybe you should tone it down, cut it back, learn real empathy, and figure out what Christlike really means in the bible (hint: it’s not faked or ranted). Good luck with life, you’ll need it if that’s how you choose to “love” people. Me, I just like spreading the real truth. I left the church and thank goodness, because I used to be like you and once I realized the whole thing was a huge scam, I was gone. Might be time to start ignoring your leaders and reading up on history before you make a decision to keep wasting your blog to their effort."

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Posted by: emeraldtigress ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 11:14PM

Pineapple, thank you for copy/pasting it in. You saved me the trouble of doing it myself. I came over at PeaceinFreedom's suggestion to see what was going on, and am glad I did. Not because I think I can change anyone's minds about the church, the prophet, or myself, but so I can explain why I took the post down. I actually left it up for as long as I did because it was bringing so much traffic to my blog, but I realized that this LDS-specific post really didn't match the purpose of my blog, which is to offer a safe place for people of all faiths to discuss their beliefs about God and learn from each other's varied perspectives. From your comments, it seems you agree it doesn't fit the bill there! So I may move it to a different blog or just repurpose and repost as something more fitting. But thank you for your interest - I was floored by the number of page views it got. As for your commentary, I am just grateful God allows us all to have our own opinions and choose our own way. Your comments neither cut nor convince me. I follow whom I follow based on the whisperings of the Spirit to my heart. I know God loves his children. May the future bring you peace.

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Posted by: pineapple ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 11:36PM

1 - You're welcome, glad I could save you the trouble.

2 - Psycho = "break-up" experience when you're a week from marriage (but hey, not everyone has the guts to call it quits when it's time to move on).

3 - If I wanted to cut or convince you, I would have tried contacting you directly via your blog.

4 - You claiming you were going to paste your anti-OW article on an exmormon forum is as believable as the entire history of the LDS church.



I could keep the list going, but I don't want to perpetuate personal attacks, as I understand how difficult it is to be in your position.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 14, 2014 09:29AM

emeraldtigress Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Your comments
> neither cut nor convince me.

I posted your blog posting for the members here. I knew you would see the traffic but I didn't do it to lure you here to cut or convince you of anything. I think your post a perfect example of a train wreck recovering Mormons can read and feel relieved that they aren't like you.

I've read a bunch of Muslim women's postings defending Islam's treatment of women and your post shares more with those sentiments than much of what I've read from Mormon women. The Mormon women seem deluded out of equality but not like you who seem angered that Mormon women would even entertain such notions.

> I follow whom I
> follow based on the whisperings of the Spirit to
> my heart.

What exactly are those? Voices? Feelings?

> I know God loves his children. May the
> future bring you peace.

I'm going to guess you know this because God blessed you?

Peace be on you too. From reading your post you look like you need it to come to grips with other Mormon women who don't follow their prophet to your degree.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: October 14, 2014 05:52PM

The next time you walk into a voting booth (hopefully this November,) you can thank all of the uppity women who made it possible for you to do so. Women never got change to happen by asking nicely or accepting the status quo. They agitated for change. They organized protests. They drew the ire of the men in charge.

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Posted by: goldenrule ( )
Date: October 15, 2014 03:20AM

AMEN

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Posted by: pineapple ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 09:25PM

She's psycho. It appears as though she just deleted her post, so maybe she realized how hypocritical she was.

In the words of one of my friends, "What would happen if we all died and went to heaven and realized the only lesson we had to learn in this life was to love others? Most mormons would be so upset because of all their wasted efforts trying to be better than each other."

I don't know much about Kate Kelly other than what's in the news (which probably is only half-truths), but I bet a million bucks she has more ethics and morals than 99.7% of LDS folks.

*I don't have a million bucks, so I hope this is non-binding

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 11:02PM

pineapple Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> She's psycho. It appears as though she just
> deleted her post, so maybe she realized how
> hypocritical she was.

She said this. "My heart longs to reach out to those of my sisters and brothers who still identify with the movement. This kind of sharing can be lonely so, wherever you personally stand on these issues, I thank you for your company."

I'm sure there are many here who identify but she isn't thanking you by deleting her post.

hypocritical = 1, non-hypocritical = 0

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Posted by: sparty ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 09:40PM

Anyone able to cut and paste her post? Looks like the verbal schelacking she got from this board prompted her to torpedo her post.

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Posted by: pineapple ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 09:43PM

Someone should teach Ashley about google's cache...


"An Open Letter to “Ordain Women”
by ASHLEY on OCTOBER 3, 2014 · 4 COMMENTS

It’s Friday. Conference Friday. And this year, I’m more concerned about Conference than usual.

Author’s Note: Before I go on I want to give a little background for those not familiar some of the terms I use here. After all, this is not a “Mormon Blog.” But I am a Mormon, and I hope you’ll allow me to share some of my thoughts today in light of this weekend’s sessions of General Conference of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in this space. (You are welcome, by the way, to watch the conference live along with us from www.lds.org starting at 10AM Mountain Time on Saturday should you feel so inclined.) During General Conference, leaders of the Church speak to members and friends of the Church worldwide on various subjects via live and recorded broadcast. It is held twice each year, in April and in October. Since the March of this year, a group and movement called “Ordain Women,” which is lobbying for the ordination of women to the Holy Priesthood of God, has received quite a bit of media attention. I deeply disagree with this movement, for the reasons I describe below, among others. I have added links to more information about a few items that may require extra context, but most of the points I make here could be understood by anyone and applied to many things.

This post is my attempt at expressing the result of the many prayers and ponderings I have had over the past several years on this subject. My heart longs to reach out to those of my sisters and brothers who still identify with the movement. This kind of sharing can be lonely so, wherever you personally stand on these issues, I thank you for your company.

My children and I are taking some time today to tidy the house get ready to have the Spirit of God in our home for General Conference weekend. I am borrowing this tradition from a friend of mine who home-schools her three children, and who I know is taking the whole day off today to clean and bake cookies and other treats that they can enjoy together as they listen over this special weekend.

I want to be excited about Conference, but it’s especially hard this time. I am struggling against anxiety for a long-time friend, as well as hundreds of my sisters all over the world who are still hanging onto the Ordain Women movement with both fists.

My husband and I both watched the replay of the General Women’s meeting and noticed something concerning. You probably noticed it too. President Monson was not happy. He and President Uchtdorf looked terribly concerned about something. President Uchtdorf looked old and gray, and stumbled over his English as he began his talk. Not even talking about his lovely wife brought out more joy than a tired smile. He did eventually warm up and get into his usual upbeat talk-giving groove, but it took a while – like he was distracted by something unpleasant. President Monson was quick to leave at the conclusion of the session without his usual warm smiles and waves to the congregation.

The main theme of all of the talks in the session was clear: “You are daughters of God, so get serious about making an keeping covenants with your Father and quit crying about stupid stuff,” with a smile and a hug. Like what I used to get from my Mom when I knew exactly what I needed to do and she said “I know you’ll make the right decision,” with a smile and a hug.

My husband said it felt like Priesthood Session.

I’ve got a feeling that this Conference is going to be a rough one.

I know that you want to be a disciple of Christ, and even believe it is possible to do so and still be an Ordain Women sympathizer. But you also know that the General Authorities asked Kate Kelly and her followers not to gather on Temple Square. And that she and many others gathered anyway, in direct rebellion to God’s personally-appointed representatives. You have also been asked by your Bishop as part of a temple recommend interview, “Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Letter-day Saints?” If you answered “No,” that means that you do not support, affiliate with, or agree with Ordain Women or any other group like it.

Lay aside all of the emotional arguments and deconstructionalist come-backs you’ve learned from strangers online who neither know you nor love you, and you can see that there’s a problem here.

In fact, if you’re honest with yourself, you’ll admit that the most difficult thing about Kate Kelly’s excommunication – after she was invited to but refused to repent of her own rebellion several times – was wondering what that meant for you, and whether you might be next.

If you feel like you are a disciple, and you also agree with the “Ordain Women” movement, you have two separate selves, and they can’t co-exist forever.

My invitation is that as members of the Church all over the world finish up their last-minute preparations for Conference weekend, you and I both prayerfully decide what our primary identity is.

Am I a feminist first? Or am I a Daughter of God first?

Let me share a personal story.

Once upon a time, I was in a relationship with a psychopath.

Of course I didn’t realize this about him at the time. I know now that he was controlling, two-faced, patronizing, scheming, manipulative, and self-serving, but at the time I could only see that he was thoughtful (if self-righteous) and lonely. I also knew he cared for me and loved being with me. I couldn’t see myself ever marrying the man, or even dating him seriously, but feeling welcome in someone’s life is a wonderful feeling. Not wanting to lead him on, I reminded him regularly that my feelings for him were strictly platonic. But no matter how many times I told him, every time he assured himself that some day I would come around and all would be sunshine and roses forever.

Thankfully, he lived far away from me, so I had time to plan how to tell him that I was dating someone else when that time came. I was actually engaged by the time I found the courage to break it to him. Then one night, over the phone, in a car four states away, with my fiancé next to me holding my hand and my Mom in the front seat driving us somewhere, I told him I was moving on. Can you sense the power this man had over me? I never even agreed to go on a date with him, but I had to work at least as hard to not be his girlfriend as I ever worked to stay with someone I actually wanted to be with. And yet I put off this “break-up” experience until the week before I was to marry the man of my dreams, and it still filled me with anxiety and trepidation. This was not a healthy relationship!

It didn’t go over well, but I still completed the task successfully. I’ll spare you the details, as it would distract from the point I am trying to get to.

Even though I still wanted to show this man I cared for him, it soon became clear that our relationship was no longer a benefit to either of us (it wasn’t until much later that I could see it never had been a good thing by any definition). So I went through and deleted everything. Every email in every account went away. Later I lost his blog address, a blog I now suspect he created to hang onto me, and got rid of the notes and cards as well.

Now, what does this have to do with General Conference?

Once upon a time, you knew the Church was true. All of it, and all the way. You didn’t question the speakers at General Conference, because you knew they represented God and that your Heavenly Father would never lead you astray.

Then something happened.

Whether you experienced abuse, family tragedy, neglect, doubt, offense, or something else, the foundations of your faith were battered and broken.

It’s easier to blame God and/or priesthood-holders in your life for your suffering than bring it to God and lay it at his feet, with faith that Christ’s atonement is big enough to heal even your broken heart. Blame helped numb the hurt and fear for a while, but you can’t shake the feeling that you’re missing out on something.

You’re still in turmoil about it.

In the meantime, you’ve entered into the spiritual version of a rebound relationship with a psychopath. A controlling, two-faced, patronizing, scheming, manipulative, and self-serving entity that is taking advantage of the fact that you are thoughtful (if self-righteous) and lonely.

Don’t think so? Let’s read this Korihor-esque statement, which I found as a Pinterest pin tweeted on Ordain Women’s Twitter page:

“To care enough about the church to want to see it better, to cherish the past without denying the future, to love and respect the brethren while recognizing their limitations, to be willing to speak when no one is listening — all of these require faith.” -Laurel Thatcher Ulrich

Very carefully chosen words! I bet that took her hours to perfect. Not one of those points can be discounted out-of-hand if you take them at face value. That is part of “the cunning plan of the evil one” – to state something with words that are true and a meaning that is rebellious, low, sinister, hateful, and false.

Your Daughter of God self who wants to love people and serve God likes those words. The people of the church could be better, couldn’t they? But by the time you’ve read that far and are thinking along those lines, the monster inside of you has recognized a friend in the intended meaning there, and has started talking over you. You’re used to listening to the monster, you’ve even started to trust it, so you just let it enjoy itself.

And boy, does it ever! It knows what is intended here. The monster reads:

“As long as you care about the church as an institution, as long a you believe Joseph Smith was a prophet, as long as you still think that God’s chosen prophets, seers, and revelators are basically good people who are right about some things, then speaking up for the cause of ordaining women does not make you a bad person, and anyone who judges you as otherwise is simply ignorant or unenlightened. In fact, supporting this cause is difficult, which makes it noble, and being willing to do hard things makes you a good person.”

You see how sneaky that was? The monster inside you sees it too, and self-righteously relishes in diabolical glee at how clever and cunning it is.

And it grows a little more, because you listened to it again.

This is why I feel supporting the Ordain Women movement is like dating a psychopath.

How do you feel when I say that?

My guess is that the part of you who knows she’s a Daughter of God feels sad and maybe even hopeful, but that the monster that’s been growing inside you for so long is furious.

I’m talking stark raving mad.

This monster I speak of knows just what to say and who to quote when entering discussions on Facebook about the blessings of the Priesthood in the lives of women and children. This monster likes to talk about Esther, Emma Smith, and Eve, but you can’t remember much about Moroni, Helaman, or even Nephi, because every time you try to read the Book of Mormon, the monster rages and stomps its feet so loudly that you can’t hear the Spirit. This monster mumbles in your ear when you pray, until it’s hard to tell which answers are coming from where. It’s grown to an alarming size, to the point where if it wants to say something, it does, before you even have a chance to think about whether or not its message is kind, fair, or even true.

I am not talking to the monster. I am talking to YOU. And I need you to understand that one of you has to go.

The monster running your life and preventing you from enjoying the blessings and protection that come from scripture study, heeding the whisperings of the Spirit of God in your heart, repenting, and reaching for the goddess you are meant to become, needs to die.

And if you wait too long to kill it, I’m afraid it might kill you.

So who will you be? A Daughter of God first or a feminist first?

If you choose to allow Daughter of God to be your primary identity, you have no time to lose.

If having support would help you break up with your monster like it helped me to break up with mine, get a loving, supportive spouse or friend on the phone or into your home. Then drink some water, pop some popcorn, and say a little prayer. Then get on the computer, and throw out all of the monster’s food:

UNSUBSCRIBE from every feminist blog you follow, even the ones that take a pro-Priesthood stance. There may be some you come back to later after you’ve reclaimed your true self and the atonement has rooted the monster out of your soul. But for now don’t skip any, no matter what. This is important.

LEAVE every Facebook group and UNLIKE every page. Don’t say good-bye. Don’t offer an explanation. Just leave.

DELETE every email you’ve gotten from any social sources on the subject (actual correspondence from actual in-the-flesh friends and family can stay).

UNFOLLOW every board and group on Pinterest and Twitter and Instagram…I don’t know what you have. Don’t stop until you’ve gotten them all. You may be surprised how pervasive its become – and how few prophet-promoting sources you hear from in comparison.

Next, read your scriptures until you can’t stand it anymore, and then pray. Go on a walk or a hike and say it out loud if you can. Tell your Heavenly Father EVERYTHING. Scream and shout if it helps. He’ll be patient, and He’ll listen.

You listen, too.

Listen to how you feel, what the monster feels, and which of you says what in that prayer. Read more scriptures if you can. Pray more. Pray like Enos. Pray until you are filled with the Holy Ghost, and your greiving, broken heart can finally rest. Pray until you can look forward to Conference, with faith that the prophets will counsel you as the Savior would, and with a firm resolve to follow the instructions you receive at their hands.

You may still be afraid, but you will know God is with you and will help you follow through. Write down your questions and concerns (you will still have some – we all do!) and prayerfully listen to every talk, expecting answers. I know that if you do this, God will heal, bless and instruct you in ways that neither you nor I can now imagine.

Addiction is, as psychopathic partners are, like cancer, so you may find after a while that there were some links or blogs you missed. Get rid of them too, as soon as you find them.

Listen to yourself – your Daughter of God self. Listen to the Spirit’s whisper, and tell the monster to be quiet. You can grow stronger than it is and, while it may be a life-long struggle to keep it in check, I know that the atonement of Jesus Christ is big enough to heal you – and me – and make us whole.

You know it’s true, too.

God loves you. You are not alone. He will help you.

Those who know you best and love you most are praying for you.

I’ll be praying for you – us – too."

Amen.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/13/2014 09:43PM by pineapple.

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Posted by: Queen of Denial ( )
Date: October 14, 2014 05:37PM

Nothing like some Mormon arrogance and ignorance to provide a little reminder of what I am not missing.

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Posted by: AZanon ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 11:26PM

I didn't have the strength to read entire nauseating soapbox, but did catch this line:


"Don’t say good-bye. Don’t offer an explanation. Just leave."


Pretty much describes my exit from the cult altogether.

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Posted by: GNPE ( )
Date: October 13, 2014 11:55PM

her post:

the usual blather / palp.

If the GAs ever made any substantial claims about the benefits of living Christ-Like lives (Not including the WoW)... I think I'd faint.

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Posted by: no mo lurker ( )
Date: October 14, 2014 09:42AM

Hate to tell her, but Jesus was a son of God and a feminist too. It can be done.

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Posted by: shannon ( )
Date: October 14, 2014 10:35AM

Water and popcorn? Ick. I think she *is* batsh!t crazy ...

;o)

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Posted by: madalice ( )
Date: October 14, 2014 06:04PM

Now I remember why I used to get migraines on Sunday.

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Posted by: Calico ( )
Date: October 15, 2014 12:29AM

She is so full of hate, but doesn't see it. What a mess she is.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 15, 2014 06:59AM

The irony is she thinks she is doing these women a favor. And I love the "I was in a bad relationship" appeal. It is such a convincing argument - not.

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Posted by: escapee nli ( )
Date: October 15, 2014 12:57AM

"Am I a feminist first? Or am I a Daughter of God first?"

Why can't we be both? What is this either/or stuff? Why can't God have feminist daughters? This humanoid parading around as a woman is really selling herself short.


"President Monson was not happy."
He's got dementia. He was probably unhappy about having to leave his apartment and not getting to have his Diet Pepsi. I can appreciate that. I'd rather stay home and drink Diet Pepsi instead of having to sit in a great and spacious building for hours.

I'm sure if there is a God, he'd want more for his daughters and sons than what the Morg is offering.

Other Susan

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Posted by: seekyr ( )
Date: October 15, 2014 01:50AM

I think she deleted her post because a MAN told her she was misguided. That's all she needed to know.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/15/2014 06:54AM by seekyr.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 15, 2014 11:37AM

I'm lost. Who is the man who told her she was misguided? One of the comments in her blog post?

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