I keep seeing on the Internet that one of the major news rags has accused Joel Osteen of $50 million dollar fraud. What are your thoughts on this? Is he guilty? Should be go to prison.

I have watched him on TV. He is a tornado of abundance theology. I think the fraud is kind of implied. Mormon leaders put on an act as well--they prefer the slumped and weepy approach to the oldest form of beggary. It's for God.

Only $50 million?

...could be tax fraud/evasion.

What is the fraud? I see other ministers get cranky about his preaching and claim what he preaches is fraud. Sounds like sour grapes.

Good lord, how are people still taken in by this guy? I work at a local bookstore, and many people come in for his books. There is a new one every few month, it seems. Imagine if all those people pulled their hears out at once! What a noise it would make!
Bluuuup!

I am not even a Christian but like his positive thinking sermons and the Christian music they play at his church. This is free over the internet and he sends me a thought daily for free. I have one of his book I found at a thrift shop for $1. Totally agree he is a fraud but he does have some value to me.

Many are right above that most other Christian preachers (frauds that just don't know it) are extremely jealous as Joel never attended a church school and really doesn't understand Christian doctrine very well. He also keeps saying positive things that are totally absurd like he thinks Obama has done a good job ----- this type of stuff will really hurt his weekly church donations. Sometimes it is not a good policy to always say something nice.

However, he does understand marketing and sales!

Positive bullshit is at least one step above negative bullshit. I'd rather see his pretty white teeth smiling at me than the stinky dentures on general conference.

Whatever ever he is selling, plenty of people are buying. It's a message of hope, and very universal. He is a master of reaching his audience.
If people like what he says they can listen, buy his books, etc., just like any thing else.
He's working a message that is working for people, it appears.

TSCC can learn a lesson from this guy.

You get a bigger following, and in the long run more money, by making people feel good about themselves while giving them the freedom to live and be as they are...than you do by breaking the spirits of a select elite, and draining them of their money and energy.

Sure, the TSCC's net worth is still higher...but whose stock is truly rising?

Money aside (as well as my own opinion about the guy...), how many people on this globe can say that Joel Osteen's words have been a source of inspiration, compared to Tommy Monson?

Does Osteen hold tithing settlements each December as if he owned the members?
Does he demand 10% of people's gross income?
Are members of his congregation forced to clean toilets?
Wear weird underwear?
Does he bang multiple women, some of them the wives of his friends?

If not, he is a good guy.

I agree. He is a fake also but in the grand scheme of things, a relatively harmless one. He makes money off foolish and gullible people but at least he doesn't teach the hate theology that so many televangelists do.

The old adage "a fool and his money are soon parted" is still true and if people are going to throw their money away on a televangelist, I would rather they do it with this guy than the knobs that created such hatred and bigotry towards others not like themselves.

Cult leaders are very often (I'll venture, "usually" here) not very well educated, especially in theology and the liberal arts. BUT they are very good at assimilating a wide, if superficial, amount of information, knowledge, and anecdotes. Their gift is repackaging it in an appealing way, and feeding it to people's needs and desires.

They are also VERY good at reading people, whether it be an audience (congregation), a small group, or individually. Each person feels he is addressing him in a very individual, personal way. "That's just what I needed to hear!" is a common response. "I felt he was speaking/preaching to me, just me, personally!"

Olsteen is just another prosperity preacher. People feel good about themselves, and he downplays repentance and faith in Christ. He follows in the footsteps of Marianne Williamson, Jim Bakker, Mary Baker Eddy, and so many others. Bakker, incidentally, renounced the "health & wealth gospel" in his autobiography, "I Was Wrong."

Bakker has renounced the 'health and wealth' gospel in place of selling ridiculously priced survival of Armageddon packages. Sounds rather like calling 12 eggs something other than a dozen.

I concur with SusieQ#1. I don't know what this "Fraud" is about, and I will look it up shortly, but his message is positive and inspirational, and many people want to hear it.

He's probably living a higher lifestyle from book sales, rather than from tithing.

He's no theologian. There is a place for his style in an otherwise rigid religion.

anyone selling a connection with an imaginary super hero is a fraud. He is just better at it. His punishment is that he married a harpie.

I think any money he is given is given freely. He's not my cup of tea, but I suppose other people just love him so who cares. Comparing him to Marianne Williamson though is a WTF? moment lol. Where the hell did you come up with that? And Jim Bakker? wow.

The National Enquirer is a "major news rag"?

http://www.nationalenquirer.com/celebrity/joel-osteen-caught-50-million-scandal

There is no specific scandal being alleged, only that his church in general seems to be a maketing front for hi for-profit books, website, etc. Which is scandalous (Which I agree with btw).

The 50 million dollar figure is an estimate of the total value of Lakewood, so the lead sentence says this "scandal" could put his $50m empire at risk. Tabloid headlines at their usual game.

I don't like this guy at all, but I don't like bad journalism either.

The NE has broken some stories that others in the mainstream news decided we did not need to hear. After they were shown to be right, and people were interested, the rest of the media jumped on.

It's true that the majority of their stories are tabloid fodder, but they seem better at investigative journalism than many of their so-called "betters".

Love him or hate him, he's taking a financial path that can really only happen when you get a lot of people who like you.

He takes no salary from the church and pays all his own expenses. And he is listed as one of the church's top donors. Of course the TV show helps feed his personal income through book sales, so there's certainly a synergy at work there. But he's different from most of the big-hair televangelists who regularly glean from the coffers of their churches.

I see no difference between this and Phil McGraw using his CBS show to constantly push his book and family businesses.

In case anyone has missed, his son is now a book publisher, which he mentions ad naseum in most shows.

Additionally, his wife Robin, now has a line of skin care products that every audience members receives along with some of CBS' TV time to promote the product.

I refer to Phil McGraw not as Dr. Phil, because in the US we expect actual doctors to have a license, which Phil does not since the State of Texas yanked his in 1989 for having an inappropriate relationship with a female client.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2015 12:55PM by deco.

Anyone who has earned a doctorate is referred to as "Doctor." Phil McGraw has a doctorate in psychology and is appropriately addressed as "Doctor," at least in professional and academic contexts.

Same goes for historians with a doctorate in their field, and they are not licensed at all.

Screen Name Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anyone who has earned a doctorate is referred to
> as "Doctor." Phil McGraw has a doctorate in
> psychology and is appropriately addressed as
> "Doctor," at least in professional and academic
> contexts.
>
> Same goes for historians with a doctorate in their
> field, and they are not licensed at all.

Historians rarely counsel their clients in important life matters, and they certainly do not attempt to trump actual licensed physicians in changes in medication prescription as Phil McGraw does.

He may claim title to the word "doctor" based on his academic achievements, he certainly has no business giving the appearance of practicing.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/08/2015 02:00PM by deco.

I was asked to volunteer for World Vision at a Joel Osteen event. I was prepared NOT to like it....but I did. It was positive, uplifting and, well, fun. The merch (t-shirts, books, etc.) were VERY reasonably priced. They had box dinners and comp. books for the volunteers.The only "begging" for money was for World Vision. Was it a little hokey? Yeah. Was it a little over-the-top? Yeah. But, hey, it was hate-free and life-affirming...fun.