When I was 15 years old, a Stake leader (a member of the High Council or Stake Presidency) taught my Sunday school class during Ward Conference. To start the class, he walked to the front of the room and wrote a big “10” on the blackboard. He said “Ten. Ten years. I don’t see how it can POSSIBLY be more than ten years until the second coming of Christ.” Even though ten years seemed like a very long time to a 15-year-old, that got my attention, and stoked the fear that I had known my entire life.

Ten years passed; and 20 and 30, and…..well, that happened 43 years ago. As far as I know, Jesus hasn’t returned.

I have been inactive for several years now, but it seemed to me that as we approached (and even more so after we passed) the year 2000, the LDS church backed away from the strategy of using the second coming to scare everyone into obedience and loyalty. I knew so many TBMs who seemed to need the fear of Christ’s return to keep them on the “straight and narrow.” My own mother saw so many world events as a reminder that the second coming was near. Anytime a president of the church died, she though it was so he could be spared the turmoil of the second coming. When blacks were given the priesthood, she called the news “earth shattering” and said she needed to get herself prepared.

For those of you who still attend, is the implicit (or explicit) threat of the second coming still used to get people in line?

10 > 43 when 8 = accountability.

^ for the win.

Thanks, I actually thought of a better one.

12(Deacon) is Greater than 40(Mother) when Mormonism = True.

I hate mormon math !!

I remember when Hinkley died my own Father told me he always felt that Monson would be Prophet during the second coming.

It should be happening soon since Monson's health isnt the best.

CrispingPin Wrote:
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> As far as I know,
> Jesus hasn’t returned.

JWs had an even bigger problem, having *officially* made specific year predictions.
What did they do?

First they denied they'd made them. Oops, people still had their printed materials showing they had.
Then they simply declared Jesus *did* come back...but he was invisible. Problem solved.

Never underestimate the religious mind :)

ificouldhietokolob Wrote:
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> Then they simply declared Jesus *did* come
> back...but he was invisible.

Well, that is how God traditionally works. Only Mormons make God appear before their boy prophet after he blacked out and was suffering from double vision.

ificouldhietokolob Wrote:
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> First they denied they'd made them. Oops, people
> still had their printed materials showing they
> had.

Good thing the LDS church doesn't have that problem. ;)

Somewhere there's a book titled "The History of the End of The World." It's on my to-read list. Jesus supposedly said that there would be men alive then who would see it. Some Christians, including Mormons, still manage to believe this by supposing there are people who are here now who are still living after 2000 plus years! The religious imagination is boundless.

I guess you've never heard of the 3 Nephites?

who supposedly taunted Jesus on the way to the crucifixion and was condemned to wander the Earth until Jesus' return. Some say he's still out there. It's a staple of legend and literature in all Christian countries:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wandering_Jew

Not as often, but occasionally. As I've pointed out on other threads, BRM used an 1843 prophecy by JS to establish a 2000 benchmark. But as time passes, the SC recedes ever farther into the future.

The Church of JC of Something-or-Other-Day Saints.

Neil Andersen's infamous address in the last GC included this: "The negative commentary about the Prophet Joseph Smith will increase as we move toward the Second Coming of the Savior. The half-truths and subtle deceptions will not diminish…"

So they still play that card once in a while.

There's nothing half-truthy or subtle about the negative commentary surrounding JS. Pedophile is pretty stark.

Yes. The bible is replete with commentary about the evils of the deniers. Of course, JS included such in his concoction when he and his buddies wrote the BOM. Korihor is the example. They try to cover all the bases by including cautionary tales of the unbelievers. "Fools will say," etc. But this fact remains; Prophesy is not reliable. We cannot know the future, and should be wary of those who say they do. There lies deception.

He did come back, to Denver Snuffer and other chosen of The Remnant. Hahaha.

Jesus is like a bad, sadistic parent. Says he will be back with a treat, then he lurks just out of sight until you grow weary of waiting and do something normal. Then, he jumps out of hiding to smack you down for being unfaithful and impatient. "No treat for you, you weak child".

14>60 or so.

That is why the lard choose Joe to restore his one true church to the face of the earth.

Ask yourself how could the lard put his trust in a 40,50,60 or 70 something year old man/woman to get the job done? Their wisdom and life experience would just get in the way thus 14 was the right number.

I used to know people that would get excited when a GA talked about food storage because it meant that the second coming was nigh.

I knew a guy that genuinely believed that every priesthood session might be the one where the prophet tells everyone to pack up and head to zion.

My ex-SIL would talk about how she and her family were so safe because they lived in Utah where there were churches and temples everywhere and god wouldn't destroy his buildings... I told her that based on Jesus's treatment of money-changers and hypocrites that I thought when Jesus returns Utah would be the first place to be burnt to stubble. She didn't like me much.


So yes, the 'latter-day' stuff is still very much a part of the cultural and religious identity of Mormons.

She does know that the "prophecy" says it's one the first places to get hit by disasters and man made destruction. Hence the need for a years supply and the trekking back to Missouri to build the temple and re-establish Zion. Utah is not Zion and never was meant to be.

?
how they gonna transport their 1 yr food supply to Missouri?

U-Haul?

Like many Americans they have almost a complete years food supply around their waist.

I'm pretty sure she stopped studying the gospel when she was in primary.

One day on Kolob is 1000 years our time.

One Kolob years 365,250 years our time.

Ten Kolob year 3,652,500 years our time.

It is all a matter of perspective.

In Jain cosmology the Sirsapahelika is the highest measurable number in Jainism which is 10^194 years. Higher than this is the Palyopama (pit measured years) which is explained by an analogy of a pit 8 x 8 x 8 miles tightly filled with fine hair particles of a seven day old newborn (a single hair from the above cut into eight pieces seven times = 20,97,152 particles). If one particle is emptied every 100 years, the time taken to empty the whole pit = 1 Palyopama (a Palyopama = "countless" years). Hence a Palyopama is at least equal to or greater than 10^194 years. A Sagrapoma is 10 quadrillion Palyopama -- that means a Sagrapoma is more than 10^210 years...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2015 11:49AM by anybody.

I'm certain you can find plenty of people who would tell you they're Jesus. Some might even look like his pictures. Mostly likely, Jesus wouldn't be invisible, he would be locked up.

So that's why we haven't had the second coming yet. Jesus did come, but he got locked up in an insane asylum, so he is still unable to make that happen until he gets out.

Yes it is still very much part of the MORmON mindset. Got this today from a family letter email from my BIL:

"Tonight for FHE I taught about the Last Days and how we are to prepare for the 2nd Coming of the Savior. We looked at some of the symbolism in the Revelation of John. [SIL] and I have recently been studying a little about the destruction and turmoil which will grip the earth prior to the 2nd Coming. I really see everything collapsing when this time comes. All of our financial system and societal organization and utilities and communication coming to an end as we know it. It's enough to make one depressed and scared for these events. [11 yr old paranoid nephew] expressed this fear."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2015 01:00AM by eunice.

I have no confidence at all that if Jesus came back (wait... was he ever here in the first place?), the last people--the VERY last people--to recognize him would be Mormons. He would not wear what they wanted him to wear, would not look like Red-Robed Jesus outside the bishop's office in the church corridor, and would be talking about other stuff that is totally foreign to Mormonthink. They just wouldn't get it and call him an impostor.

(And ironically, Joseph Smith would also not be welcome.)

I wonder how many mormons aren't putting anything into their 401k because they think the world will be ending soon.

Putting money into your 401(k) shows lack of faith in Jesus' second coming.

Correct. You should just give it to the brethren instead.

the only restoration math I can remember is:

how do you put 37 into 14?

I see what you did there!

wowbagger Wrote: "the only restoration math I can remember is: how do you put 37 into 14?"

With a flaming sword and a promise of exaltation for the entire family.

I figured 1959 was to be the year. Wrong. Now I have no expectation of being present even if I pass 120 (which I expect). BTW, one can postulate that whenever one sees someone in need, they see Jesus and also see him in every brother and sister of faith, that Christ dwells within us. Indeed, one can so conclude from the scriptures. After all, the apostles did not recognize him on the Road to Emmaus, Thomas had to touch the wounds, the people in Nazareth let him walk away in their midst, and the soldiers needed Judas to identify him - even though Jesus had appeared and taught at the temple. The Bible indicates, contrary to art, that Christ did not look special, was not outstanding on appearance, and is not the handsome, tall, blue-eyed Adonis of paintings and statues. I would conclude that the Christus at the SLC Temple is not pleasing in God's sight.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2015 12:03PM by rhgc.

I met Jesus just the other day.

As I recall, his last name was Hernandez...

To my ninth grade seminary teacher...fuck you. It was pure child abuse to talk to a fearful, anxious, hyper vigilant teenager every damn day about getting the call to pack our things and head to Jackson County Missouri in preparation for the second coming.

Oh cripes! I'm just now putting two and two together! A couple of months ago I was conversing with a coworker about retirement, and he was mentioning how he really wanted an early retirement. I responded that I would be around for a while, and he replied by questioning, seriously, if the company would be around very much longer. I thought it was weird, considering that the company is large, doing well, and been around for 100 years. I gave him a quizzical look. He then seemed a bit embarrassed and changed the subject, as though he remembered suddenly that he was talking to an apostate who didn't share his TBM fears of iminent apocalyptic destruction. Of course this is conjecture, but this hypothesis sure puts an otherwise strange comment into perspective.