How competitive is admission to BYU for females?

I know a lot of women who got into that school who are pretty intellectual lightweights if not down right stupid. The thing that they all have in common is that they are all very good looking.

One of the most blatant cases I know of were 2 sisters. One was attractive the other not as much. The less attractive one was artistic, bright, outgoing. The prettier sister, not as much. Guess which one got in, and which one had to settle for BYU-Idaho?

From a LDS leadership point of view, I can see that making sense: Have lots of attractive young women around for the guys to hitch themselves too. It doesn't matter a damn if the women are smart, since their job is to be in the home and make babies.

Has that been your observation?

A few years ago, when one of my kids was applying to BYU, we noticed the same trend: the good-looking ones got in with lower GPAs, mediocre activities, etc., while quite a few of their peers with higher GPAs, better test scores, and more impressive extracurriculars -- but who were less physically attractive -- didn't.

Admittedly, this is not first-hand information, but said child was informed by a friend with BYU connections in a position to know about their selection process, confirmed that admission is weighted towards those who will make "good ambassadors" for TSCC after graduation, and yes, looks matter.

Does BYU require a photo with admissions applications? If not, how do they know what female applicants look like?

Doubting Thomas Wrote:
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> Does BYU require a photo with admissions
> applications? If not, how do they know what female
> applicants look like?

Yes, they do now (according to their on-line application). :)

how do you know what their "GPA" was? Or how would you know what their ACT/SAT scores were. Since that's what they acutally look at. IF they didn't do extracurriculars, what kind of jobs did they have outside of that? All Mark Zuckerberg did in highschool was tinker with computers....it's not always about extracurrirulars as it is about passion,hobbies,interests.


Part of being good ambassadors is...getting good jobs, making lots of money, getting good internships which....you need good grades to get.

I get that people are mad at the church sometimes but please....try and look at this stuff realistically. This whole discussion is just dumb.

Kids are very open about their GPA's with their peers and others. Sometimes it's because they are proud or they may be worried or think it's a joke--whatever.

So, I think the OP has a valid point if the more academically qualified young woman with a stronger record in community and school activities is passed over for a "prettier" young woman. Many people have spoken on this forum about how women who are not as physically attractive are referred to as "sweet spirits" and not valued as highly in mormon society.

Kids are oftened counseled to be active contributors in the community along with achieving highly because these are valued by universities in the admission process. All kids know this going in.

So if looks are important in the admission process, the admission officials should come right out and say so. If not, they are being dishonest.

Aren't these young girls there for their MRS degree? They don't even have to graduate to get that.

They apparently had no knowledge of my appearance when I applied for admission to Ricks in '66. I'm 6'4" and was overweight then....and had absolutely no intention of using Ricks to grow my testimony in preparation for a mission. I imagine, had that been known by the poobahs in the Spori building, I would have gotten a rejection letter.

Ron Burr

Sounds like you should have been on the football field Ron. No interest or no team at Ricks?

My first high school had no football program back in 1963-64 and then I was recruited to play at another school for grade 12k, the coach treated me like a punching bag for the other linesman so I challenged him as to what exactly was the point of my being there and he replied "to do whatever I tell you". Well, if you've followed my posts here over the years you know I don't obey well, so I told him he was an asshole and walked off the field and concentrated on schoolwork.
Ricks indeed had a football team (and full athletic program back then) but I had no interest in it.

Ron Burr

No wonder I only got a half tuition scholarship. I thought that guy who interviewed me from the Y was coming on to me, I guess I should have blown him off.

:-)

Dammit, that didn't post right.


Blown him



off.


:-P

:-P

I found that my classes at the Y's were easier than my high school classes. Intellect is not a high priority.

This whole arrogant process of membership and control is out of hand.

It has to be part of the membership decline.


My suggestion would be "Stay the hell away from from any kind of church school no matter what religion runs it"

All of my female family members who got in had looks and brains. A male family member who doesn't have much in the way of looks but had good grades and high test scores got in and a scholarship. This family member went into mechanical engineering and took his work serious and the other students were pretty crappy to him. So, even though the school didn't judge my relative by looks but intellect everyone else did. I'd also like to add that the Y effectively destroyed the little self esteem he had left that the mission missed. I spit upon the Y.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2015 01:47PM by brandywine.

Times change, I guess.

Back in the 70's the word about campus was that 90% of Mormon girls were beautiful-the other 10% went to BYU.

No.That would be illegal my friend. BYU-provo is a legitimate school. With good programs. With good professors. I'm surprised you would even ask this.

Just because someone acts dumb doesn't always mean they are. It might just be an act. Just because someone is a good student, doesn't always mean they are smart either. Being good at school means you are just good at school. My cousin is a total goofball. Doesn't seem smart at all. But he got great grades, sailed thorugh college and dental school. He just knows how to do what the system wants you to do to get the grades.

Hate to burst your buble but most likely the more creative young lady who wasn't as atractive just didn't have the grades or the scores. If she truly is a creative person, I would bet she doesn't get very good grades. Creative people typically don't do well with the structure of traditional education.

Dear john,

While you're position MAY have merit, I'm very put off by the tone of your post. It smacks heavily of mo-speak and condescension. If you have left the church, you probably should learn to write without the Mormon accent. Just sayin'...

I miss my StalkerDog™!

For your information. Being condescending isn't exclusive to mormons. Being condescending comes from being insecure. Which I am. I am not just condescending because I was mormon. This comes from other aspects of my emotional development.


If you have left the church, you might want to consider the fact that there isn't any shame in still having aspects of your personality that come from being mormon. OWN your past. Get over it. Just ignoring it, and pretending it never happened is extremely unhealthy.

and I didn't mean to come off as condescending. I don't know where I did

I said it would be illegal to do this(it would)
I said byu has good programs(they do)
I said byu had good professors(they do)

I talked about how you can't judge how smart a person is based off how they look and act(you cant). Some girls think they have to act dumb to be liked because our culture is always portraying smart, indepednent woman as "intimidating".

I talked about how his creative niece might not get good grades. THis is really the only thing that might sound condescending. I say this because I am a creative person. I always got poor grades. After self reflection, therapy and my own research I've learned that often times the structure of many educational settings aren't really conducive to people with creative personalities. And people like me INFTP generally get poor grades.

I apologize. I should have let it go. I am very sensitive to the jargon and tone that TBM's tend to use. To this day, as you can tell, I react poorly when I am lectured by anyone that uses typical Mormon phrasing such as 'get over it', 'just because...', '...my friend', 'burst your bubble', etc. These phrases are signals that I am being talked down to, usually and it dredges up a lot of deep-rooted pain and subsequent anger.

I shouldn't have said anything. Sorry.

Thanks for bringing it up. I really appreciate you pointing out what specifically seemed condescending.

It's very important to me that I am always aware of how I use speech. Now that you've brought it up, I agree that using those colloquialisms aren't helpful and can be kind of hurtful.

Like I said, part of it is that I actually am insecure.

How would this be illegal?

I was stunned at how ignorant SOME female (& male) class/ward members were at BYU. History, politics, science, vocabulary, common sense... The notion that some of those people were reproducing was frightening.

While my husband was attending BYU, I applied for correspondent type courses. I had to submit a picture with the paperwork. My husband took it into the admissions department as I had to stay home with the kids. The person processing my paperwork apparently commented to my husband that he got lucky in the wife department, based on my picture. I thought that was weird!

I am not impressed by BYU. My husband's ex daughter got in. She may have book smarts, but she clearly has zero curiosity or critical thinking skills. My husband is nice looking, though, and she looks more like him than her mother.

this is the best comment yet. People seem to be missing the point that the education system isn't about being smart. It's about being a good student.

The OP assumes that acceptance to BYU(or any school) is based off of intellect. It's not. It's based off of how good of a student they would be. WHich isn' the same. Not all good students are smart. NOt all bad students are dumb.

+1

Short Answer: NO.

You are barking up the wrong grossly unfair admissions policy tree.

Unfair admissions is the thing that ticked me off about the MORmON Olympic bid bribery scandal. BYU wanted to elevate its academic standing, It also had a surplus of MORmON applicants who wanted to go to the (Lower head) Lord's (= Joseph Smith's god = MORmON Jesus) over priced over rated MORmON school.
So GPA requirements for mainstream BYU students just kept escalating as a means to keep a cap on BYU admissions.

As part of the 2002 Olympic Bid bribery scandal package, you know, besides the guns, the gifts, the merchandise, the prizes, the cash, the luxury vacations, the VIP accommodations, the blow out parties and junkets including booze, good time girls
(escorts and prostitutes), recreational drugs/dope, and whatever else required to loosen up /entertain/ sway IOC officials that was supplied either directly or indirectly by THE church (LD$ Inc) as THE driving force behind SLOC and THE campaign to bring THE Olympics to Utah, scholarships -in the loosest form of the concept, were offered to the children of IOC members.

Sure, as a Mainstream MORmON, I was stupid enough that I had to fight to keep my grades up to be able to attend ultra illustrious BYU, but even so, I am NOT stupid enough to think that the admitted as part of a bribes deal offspring of IOC officials were required to do much of anything academically to maintain their admitted status at the Lower head Lord's University. The fact that I had to go through a grueling and agonizing BYU admittance process because I was a faithFOOL MORmON, and tread water like crazy to try to stay at BYU, while others had to do nothing except kind of show up, really aggravated me. It also put a huge exclamation point on what is really going on at BYU; hundreds of Freebie scholarships and exemptions and waivers granted to the privileged offspring of MORmON insiders / royalty / elite and their designate MORmON charity cases.

As a rank and file MORmON, I could be expected to run myself to death on the MORmON treadmill to make it at BYU and to make the MORmON world of the MORmON elite/ MORmON royalty go around.
The offspring and the designate charity cases of the MORmON elite / MORmON royalty attended BYU for free while I paid for it with exorbitant BYU tuition and exorbitant MORmON membership dues as in MORmON tithes and offerings.


Boyd Packer gave a talk about how not all of his family could continue to expect to attend BYU (for Free). The MORmON insider deal that I just described is the thing that Boyd was really getting at coming from the long way around. Just like the MORmON temple, MORmON leaders love to talk about BYU, but they do not like to talk about the (stupid) secret hand shakes that go on inside, and they do not like to talk about the secret insider deal that finances the educations of their MORmON elite children at BYU. Even as a MORmON insider MORmON ASSpostHOLE, it was beginning to be too much for Boyd, and Other MORmON leaders, to continue to RIP OFF mainstream MORmON members by continually expecting to somehow justify having dozens of BYU MORmON insider *scholarships* extended to Boyd's grand kids and their spouses.

It is tempting to think that BYU is admitting a large amount of their BYU students on a subjective basis, BECAUSE THEY ARE. But physical appearance / personal attractiveness is not the key element to that MORmON exercised subjectivity /ulterior motive. The LD$ Inc elite have a scam to run. They are screwing over Mainstream MORmON members way too fast to mess around with some thing as superficial as some kind of BYU beauty derby that would get in the way of really taking a lot money from the gullible MORmON membership.

anonski21 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> From a LDS leadership point of view, I can see
> that making sense: Have lots of attractive young
> women around for the guys to hitch themselves too.

WOW! Oh WOW! What (planet are you from) MORmON church are you talking about?

You are SOOOO over estimating LD$ Inc affection and appreciation for its MORmON member young men, and what it is willing to do to motivate / reward them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuN_ZDJKkPo

It is AS IF you have IOC officials (or plural marrying Brigham Young and MORmON cohorts of days long since past) confused with current rank and file MORmON young men. Current MORmON young men can expect to be kicked in the face as a reward, and then to LIKE being kicked in the face by THE church and to think that being kicked in the face by THE church was good for them.


Stingy demanding LD$ Inc could not care any less about creating any kind of resort type environment with attendant attractive young females for MORmON young men to cozy up to. IF that has happened to whatever extent at any MORmON church school then it was completely inadvertent. The thing that LDS Inc WILL DO for Young MORmON males in terms of sexual attraction is to deprive them of all physical contact for two years in order to make them so desperate for such contact that they will jump into just about any marriage arrangement in order to satisfy their pent up urges in an approved way.


yes, there is a MORmON emphasis on getting married and it stems from the REAL MORmON emphasis on marriage which is that of BEING married and then, just as you mentioned, BREEDING BREEDING BREEDING like crazy. At that point, LDS Inc does not give a damn about what a MORmON Male's perception of his baby factory wife's attractiveness is or is not, he is locked in and he is expected to stay in, just as the woman is.

LD$ Inc does not care if anyone is having any gratification of any kind in life, they only want what they want which is MORE MORmON members to fleece. They want Members to breed, to be home breeding, NOT chasing women around on any campus. Chasing women around on any church school campus is an utter waste time that is only tolerated because it is a necessary step that should be as abbreviated as possible along the way to BEING Married and breeding.

Remember the Kimball doctrine of any marriage partner will do just as long as they are totally committed to THE Church?
Remember Sister Bednar's edict that any displayed hint of enticing female form is sinful and offensive?

and somehow out of that MORmON condition, LDS inc is supposedly striving to create some church sponsored oasis of enticing female form at BYU ............... (?)


NOT LIKELY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LDS Inc does not give a damn about what any body finds attractive, or not, they only care about people getting on with getting it on in the MORmON unmentionable secret handshake approved way in order to breed more MORmONS for the MORmON church.

LD$ Inc. purposely creating resort type environments with attractive females in order to entice young MORmON men into marriage ?

LMAO !!!!

A MORmON guy can put a paper bag (much like the MORmON burkas that all LDS young women would be wearing if Sister Bednar had her way) over the head of WHO ever he is going marry as far as the MORmON church is concerned, after all, it will go right along with the high coverage super UN sexy UN attractive MORmON temple garments. The MORmON guys just need to get on with getting married because THAT is his duty as far as THE church is concerned.

> It doesn't matter a damn if the women are smart,
> since their job is to be in the home and make
> babies.

It may not matter if the women are smart, but it does matter that they are dumb because if they were smart then they would stop being MORmONS, the same thing applying to MORmON men.

>
> Has that been your observation?

Female mission assignments are based of looks ,with the best going to temple square. BYU never heard of it there.

So if you're a cutie like Sister Bednar, then you'll have to go elsewhere.

I haven't been on BYU campus lately, but there were tons of dorks way back when. At one time I lived at Helaman Halls. I would walk to my classes, and everywhere I went, girls would smile and say "Hi" to me. That went sailing right over my head because, I had NO confidence in high school, mormonism destroyed my self-esteem, and the mormon girls in my hometown treated me like shit.

I mentioned to my roommate that the girls are really nice, that they all say hi to you. He replied with a laugh " They don't say hi to ME". It took a long time to heal my natural confidence and now I'm "old".

There are good looking guys at BYU and some cool ones that are stuck in the cult, but there are a TON of geeks. The worst ones are the arrogant, judgmental, know-it-all, geeks. The coolest guys I knew at BYU were never from Utah. They were from places like New York etc.

'97 Alum. Tons of ugly chics there then. They do openly practice geographic discrimination. Bringing in folks from 'the mission field' to make sure they don't go to East Cast intellectual schools. Also they take federal aide money to attract non-mormon, foreign students hoping they get baptized and go back to their home country and reproduce. But they end up ignoring missionaries who come around asking why they went inactive back home.