Said, "That's heckuva good idea. Of course we do things a little different in Utah. Be a good idea to pay food servers, say $8 an hour. I mean, that's more than the minimum wage, right?"
Tipping is not a city in China...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2016 01:32PM by SL Cabbie.
Its the 21st century and governments require vast amounts of revenue where much of it comes from sales tax and income tax. This idea is good for government revenue but bad for the customers who will be paying more overall because higher prices means higher sales tax. Also the servers will have higher reported incomes and thus pay higher taxes and qualify for less subsidies.
"The Michelin-starred restaurant just announced that it is getting rid of tipping entirely, and instead will pay servers $27 per hour, which works out to approximately $55,000 annually. Hourly kitchen workers will continue to earn $13 per hour."
This was my biggest complaint when I worked for a restaurant as a cook. With tips, the servers earned substantially more than we did. I was talented at cooking, not serving. I remember once I managed to produce 18 complete meals within the space of 15 minutes. But our labors were deemed to be not as worthy.
So boo to the Meadowsweet restaurant! Give both the servers and the cooks the same wage.
I agree, and for those places that still do tips, I think the cooks should share in the tips. For example, if there are 5 waiters/waitresses, then each server would share maybe 15% or 20% of their tips with the cooks.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2016 08:17AM by ragnar.
The skill set is not as high for either job. Bussing is entry level restaurant work for those who eventually want to become servers. Dish washers tend to move on to other things.
More easily replaceable? I would argue with that (having actually worked in a restaurant as both a cook and a server.) For some jobs, it's not a simple case of supply-and-demand.
Of course the cooks earn less than their bosses, the chefs. That is to be expected.
Tipping is a ridiculous way to pay people, and a fair number of restaurants in NYC are now banning it. I was in Minneapolis recently and some restaurants there are jumping on the bandwagon too.
It is grossly unfair to the kitchen staff, and pooled tips can only be redistributed among workers who are normally tipped anyway, as per federal labor law. A service charge can be distributed to all employees. Tipping really screws the kitchen staff, which is the main reason high end restaurants are dropping it.
Young servers get tipped more than old ones. Whites get tipped more than blacks. Cleavage increases tips from men. Those better at being manipulative get tipped more. It's much like a mission. The best baptizing missionaries were often real jerks, they just were good at pouring on the charm, were better looking, whatever. It had nothing to do with either their work ethic or their so-called spirituality. They just learned to be better scammers, a business skill which Mormons do have a reputation for.
Tipped workers are attractive targets of drug dealers. They get off work, it's late, they're tired, and they have a large wad of cash in their pocket. They become the manipulated and the scammed.
A fairly large number of states override the federal standard that allows paying servers well below minimum wage. The entire west coast mandates that servers be paid at least the state minimum wage, which in all three states is higher than the federal minimum wage. All states ought to do that. Finally, some employers are picking up the ball and just doing it themselves. Good for them.
If tipping is so important to proper service, why don't we tip hospital staffs, where proper service actually matters? Yeah, I tip. I still think it is a preposterous, and largely North American custom. Employers should be responsible for paying employees.
You've got me and my favorite customers on the warpath...
Item: This one amounts to a subtle "elitist" move to actually lower wages for high end servers. One of my friends, a single mom, manages to support herself working three days a week at a moderately upscale restaurant downtown (it's on my short list of Exmormon spots, incidentally, around the corner from Will's office) that caters to the business lunch crowd.
Item: Good food servers "tip out" the kitchen help and know what it's like to live on tips (I don't live on them, but they are the difference between steak and hamburger). My friend hadn't seen me for two months--she loves hearing about the Exmormon stuff--and honest Lamanite, she laid eighty bucks on me (obviously a bit of it was a "holiday bonus").
And if memory serves, the last shindig you were at here was at the Lucky, and I dropped an extra $20 on the little girl there as well.
The American business model for food servers is actually a "democratic one," and it allows lower income sorts to enjoy an occasional foray into "elitist venues" (and we don't expect as much gratuity from them, either).
Moreover, I promise you, most of the bistro proprietors in Salt Lake aren't getting rich, either. Walter, of Valter's is an occasional customer--and friend--and I know where he lives. I promise you, it's not Federal Heights.
I cooked at a nice hotel restaurant for a number of years and was never once tipped out by the waitstaff. None of us were. I produced very good meals, too. I still get complimented on my cooking (when I do it!)
Back in the day, servers often avoided declaring a good chunk of their tips for tax purposes as well. Nice for them. It's harder to do that now, but I bet it still happens.
I favor a wage with no tips for servers. It's fair, and it levels the playing field. And both servers and cooks should be paid at least the same amount.
Hey, I thought my little screed would get your attention. Beth would rise up too, but she must not be reading the list right now. Some people need tips the way the system is currently structured. So be it. It is still a stupid way to structure the system.
Why don't we tip hospital staff? Because they are professionals, and it would be considered totally inappropriate, if not downright insulting. We don't tip government officials for doing their jobs. The last two Utah attorneys general thought they should be tipped. They are busy now trying to stay out of jail.
We don't tip computer sales people, plumbers, car sales people, doctors, or the woman helping us try on shoes at Macy's, or the poor traffic control schlub at highway construction sites who has to stand out in the dust and sun and rain and sometimes snow, and whose decisions can cost us our car or our life if they screw up. Basically, we tip people who are working in what were servant-class jobs in the Victorian era. We don't tip professionals.
Besides making being a server a non-professional job, tipping ruins any career path for them. Floor managers, and often general managers at restaurants make less than the servers. So trying to move up on a career path in the hospitality industry often results in a cut in pay. That is just one more way tipping distorts the hospitality industry.
It sucks. It's finally starting to go away. Good riddance.
[I don't expect you will agree, nor would I if I were you. Context is everything! Tal will recover, and thanks for the fact check on Martin Luther's publishing career. :) ]
>Don't tip computer sales people... car salesman...
I know you hate how imprecise the English language is (and honest, I came from your background; my science aptitude is off the charts, and my math is pretty high, too; I majored in English and the humanities to save my sanity), but the vocabulary word on those two is "commission." And for others, the word "bonus" is often applicable...
/capitalist's son voice off
That applies a fair amount of the time, and the two terms aren't quite synonomous since commission is more like the "European System."
And stepping outside of the "egocentric" perspective (which I can do, honest), the issue is whether we operate under a "meritocracy" or not.
Utah, of course, is not a meritocracy in most cases; if you know the secret handshakes and the buzzwords (like "MTC"; that one tripped me up), you've got an inside track.
You're still welcome at lunches (haven't hosted any since last summer), but I'd be watchful of your food... (big smiley face--now that is an egocentric POV)
Here on Planet Utah, jobs that involve "reasonable" gratuities serve as a counterweight to the chauvinistic, misogynistic, and homophobic culture here, and I view that as desirable. I note they are often held by women and gay individuals...
Q.E.D.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2016 07:28PM by SL Cabbie.
Which means when you eat out in France, the servers don't care most of the time about you. I have sat down at dinner with full restaurant in France and the only server was out having a smoke break, for 45 minutes.
I am for a modified tipping structure. Pay a decent wage and have a tipping limit. No more than 5% discretionary by the consumer. That way the servers aren't completely dependent upon a tip but are still motivated to do something.
I have left a 2 cent tip and a note before on bad service.
One of the things I like about tipping is giving more than they expected to get makes for very pleasant service and treatment. My wife and I are regular customers at one place. By regular, that means we only go out once or twice a month. As soon as we walk in they know us and take good care of us. I would be disappointed if I couldn't tip. But I live in a rural county, definitely nothing like Brooklyn.
Restaurants shouldn't rely on the kindness of strangers to pay their employees. A tip should be a small gift in gratitude of service, not something to extort from patrons through guilt.
Yes, $27/hour is a lot, but that's also in NYC. I'd bet most places could pay $15-20 and get the same results, adjusted for cost of living.
Tipping 15% on your meal is a weird custom. Tips in Europe are literally change from your pocket after you've paid the bill. They are shocked that their bill is 25% higher than the menu costs when they come to the US.