The tragic death of four tbm parents killed in a plane crash in Idaho.

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/03/investigators-release-names-of-victims-killed-in-plane-crash/

I know one of the families, but all were active Mormons. They were successful business owners, young and with most of their lives ahead of them. Seven children are now parent-less.

Of course there was no inspired feeling that any of the adults had before getting into the plane. There was no protection from harm or accident with prayers offered before the tragic flight.

So God is absent, seven children will be raised by grandparents or aunts and uncles, and four young parents are dead. And all the Mormon's at the funeral will say how these parents were "needed more on the other side". It's all sad, sick, and horrible.

Very tragic.

And, it will be seen by most tbm's as a "trial" for these kids, thereby justifying their god's actions.

A lot of dentists and doctors have enough money to afford to buy/rent private aircraft, but they don't have the time and personality to learn to fly safely. Most of these guys are over confident and fly in poor conditions that their plane or their skills are not suited for. I don't know what conditions were when the plane crashed but ground blizzard in the photos would suggest that flying through the mountains in Idaho was not a good idea for this pilot.

Hedning Wrote:
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> A lot of dentists and doctors have enough money to
> afford to buy/rent private aircraft, but they
> don't have the time and personality to learn to
> fly safely. Most of these guys are over confident
> and fly in poor conditions that their plane or
> their skills are not suited for. I don't know
> what conditions were when the plane crashed but
> ground blizzard in the photos would suggest that
> flying through the mountains in Idaho was not a
> good idea for this pilot.

Plus, many dentists and doctors are long on arrogance and short on caution. People often overgeneralize their expertise too. "I can pull a tooth like nobody's business, so that means I am a hotshot pilot even though I only fly twice a year."

Ah actually Andersen was the pilot, he got his certificate late last year and the comments....

"This accident is a result of poor judgement. Why on earth would anyone take off with 800 ft ceiling, rain at 3am and at an airport with no IFR departure procedure and no de-ice or anti-ice equipment?
Anderson received his private certificate 6 months ago and had less than 100 hours"

I once read that this kind of inexperience with a small plane pilot leads to the bulk of the deaths in the small plan world. Another big danger is the fact that inexperienced piolots often just go rent a plane that they are only minimally qualified to fly, and invite friends along. Something happens, and they either don't know it's happening due to vertigo principles and nighttime flying, or can't handle an emergency in an unfamiliar plane. This is what happened to John Kennedy, Jr., when he flew his plane into the water. He wasn't familiar with it, and apparently wasn't even aware that he was going down.

I remember when he went down with his wife. The weather was really dreadful -- it was storming. He had no business flying over open water that evening. If he had used even a grain of common sense and waited until the next day, he would likely still be alive.

Why two sets of parents would risk life and limb leaving all those children to be orphans, God only knows their reasoning.

My step-sister's husband was killed when his small aircraft went down between Idaho Falls and Jackson Hole, Wyoming 20 years ago along with two other men.

She never blamed God however. Her husband was on a work assignment. He purposely planned his trips so that no other family members would be on the small plane just in the event it crashed, so his children wouldn't be orphans, or his brothers kids. He co-owned a family business with his dad and brothers.

Turned out another of his brothers died from heart failure at age 43 only a year or two later. Nada thing to do with flying. He didn't leave any children though he did leave a wife.

The pilot earned his rating last fall. The aircraft was a 1958 Cessna 182. Four adults, full fuel, flying in the mountains of Idaho. My TBM friends have been posting on FB about a fund for the children. Sad.

surely they would have had life insurance? why does everyone and his brother start a fund these days?

Surely purchasing life insurance would have been a necessary purchase before paying for flying lessons.

in his cute little Piper Tri-Pacer. (I'm pretty sure that's what it was.) This was in the late Fifties and I was about 10. I don't know how long the guy had had his license to fly, but he put that little plane through all sorts of barrel-rolls and other acrobatic stuff. Dad and I loved every minute of it.

About a week later, one of that plane's wings folded back against the fuselage and then fell off. Everyone onboard was killed.

I've never been willing to fly in a small, private plane since then.

danr Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The tragic death of four tbm parents killed in a
> plane crash in Idaho.
>
> http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/03/investigators
> -release-names-of-victims-killed-in-plane-crash/
>
> I know one of the families, but all were active
> Mormons. They were successful business owners,
> young and with most of their lives ahead of them.
> Seven children are now parent-less.
>
> Of course there was no inspired feeling that any
> of the adults had before getting into the plane.
> There was no protection from harm or accident with
> prayers offered before the tragic flight.
>
> So God is absent, seven children will be raised by
> grandparents or aunts and uncles, and four young
> parents are dead. And all the Mormon's at the
> funeral will say how these parents were "needed
> more on the other side". It's all sad, sick, and
> horrible.

So lets get this right .You are blaming God for the stupid act of an inexperienced pilot and the inevitable consequence of that stupidity. Come on don't let your grief overwhelm your intellect.

I think danr was just pointing out that Mormons are taught that they should receive promptings and so avoid such disasters. So either God isn't there, doesn't care, or it was supposed to happen.

No magical man in the sky to blame. Mormon's always pray for safety, or to be inspired, yet when bad things happen the Mormon's say God wanted it this way. It's all so silly.

Life insurance for a private pilot is expensive, and limited coverage. Idaho law does not compel you to carry aviation liability insurance. As a pilot myself, I carry a million 'Smooth" per seat in my plane, which is pretty standard. So if the pilot had liability insurance, there might be some insurance for the family of the parents who were not pilots. Presumably, this family could also sue the estate of the pilot for negligence.

I am surprised that their garments did not protect them from a 4000 pound airplane with 90 gallons of fuel on board hitting the ground at high speed.

Would have been protected if someone wasn't masturbating or engaging in impure thoughts.

Or maybe an empty coffee thermos will be found in the wreckage.

A similar situation occurred when I lived in the Morridor about 15 years ago.

Young lds father (of 5 or 6 kids?) crashed a small private aircraft.
He had little experience, no instrument rating and made a series of bad choices due to inexperience and likely hubris that directly led to his death.

Found out later that his wife had been a worried wreck for years, as all he did in his spare time were activities with a higher than average risk of injury or death. Parachuting,some type of scuba diving that was explained to me as for professionals only (he wasn't one),and something I had never heard of (maybe mountain hang gliding? Can't remember).

A lot of people felt bad, but many really weren't surprised...

What a tragic event.

As a Flight Instructor I know that winter flying in the mountains is risky.

Unfortunately, general aviation is not as safe as driving in a car but most of the accidents are due to poor judgment of the pilot.

Old pilot saying "There are old pilots & bold pilots...but no old, bold pilots.

I've got lots of flying hours in my 40 years as a pilot but I still feel I have a handle on my limitations.

I feel sorry for the kids. RIP

well, you know that Satan rules the waters, and when there is enough water in the sky, then Satan rules the sky too. Satan obviously did this, but it was OK with HF and Jesus too so they allowed it. because they needed some more missionaries on the other side. It makes perFuct sense, to MORmONS!!!!

This is what I was thinking too.

"We will have a prayer and God will protect us because we need to be home for church."

Sad.

I just hope people are honest with the kids and don't feed them any "God has a plan" crap. At least they could say, "we don't know why it happened. It makes no sense at all. I don't believe a loving God would have purposely let that happen."

In the early 80s, when I was a young mother, I took a child development class at BYU from Dr. Alvin Price. Has anyone else had classes from him? What an incredible person.

Anyway, he tells the story about when he and his wife lost a young child to leukemia. He was trying to get a point across about how it does NOT help people who have a death in the family to say things like "they were needed on the other side" or "God had a reason" or anything like that. He said, "my son died because he had leukemia, for which there was no cure. The end."

He had been teaching Seminary at the time and at the funeral people were coming through the line and person after person spouting off the same old "trust in the Lard's plan" stuff. Then one of his seminary students, a kid who was a little on the rough side, dressed in holey jeans, came through the line, got to him and stood there for a minute and then punched him on the arm and said, "tough beans." He said that was the single most helpful thing that had happened the whole day. He just needed someone to say "tough beans," (translated, "that's some tough shit, man.")

I have never forgotten that and it really changed how I communicate with those experiencing loss. I remind them that it's the shits (with more appropriate words), and that time is their best friend and the only "friend" who will begin to give them any comfort.

These two families died because they made a decision to take a trip on a small plane that crashed.

It will have conclusions of the investigators regarding pilot error, pilot inexperience, carborator icing, wing icing, poor visibility, shearing winds, etc. No mention of Jesus or angels or mission calls to the spirit prison.

Unfortunately, couching situations that end in fatalities with that kind of logic (This happened because 2+2+4, not because god and his angels blah blah blah), while true, is sometimes not what people want to hear. I, personally, wouldn't want to hear a single word about the 'atonement' or God or any Mormon Hokum if said situation were to occur. Unfortunately, some people are so entrenched in that line on nonsense- TBMS, specifically, or any super religious person- That telling them that their in heaven or a better place might be the only thing that gets through to them, even though if in the long run it's not what's going to help them deal with the reality of the grieving process.

Unexpected deaths, either deaths of young children or young parents, are pretty delicate, tricky situations. It's sad to say it sounds like this person was being incredibly negligent.

What a horrible tragedy. My dad was a private pilot and my mom would never let me go flying with him. Although it was deeply aggravating to me as a child, as an adult, I do understand her reasoning. She was trying to manage risk to the family.

The Bell Shaped Curve is real.

A very few people (relatively speaking) have wonderful things happen to and for them. An equal number of people have horrible, very unwonderful things happen to them.

The majority of us are in the middle, where slightly good things and slightly bad things happen to us.

If ghawd is involved, how the hell would he decide when to do good things and when to do bad things to people?

It can be boiled down to "no ghawd needed".

when horrible things happen to Others: statistically, it makes them feel safer. And likewise, 'thank god it wasn't me or my family!' The tacit underside of that same coin is 'thank god it happened to someone else' = gratitude for others' misfortunes.

This is so common. Just check your own automatic reactions to bad news...