I was just thinking how a handful of the lds girls I went to high school and college with are still single as late 20s early 30s individuals despite being desirable. Why do you think this is what with mormon culture teaching what it teaches?

Too high of standards maybe?

Good looking, but bitches, maybe? Some guys might be figuring out that beautiful on the outside, but ugly on the inside, might not be somebody you want to spend a lifetime with. And TBM's are all ugly on the inside.

More like there isn't much out there to pick from. My daughter bailed on her wedding to a divorcee with 3 children last fall. I was extremely upset. Then I found out more and more. She dodged a bullet (as did we as we had signed on a home for them). She did the right thing. She will be 31 next month.

She is tall, blonde, blue-eyed, beautiful. Talented, has a long-time good job working for Princess Cruises, graduated from college with honors. Travels, dresses beautiful.

The pickings are few. And most mormon guys don't want a strong, independent woman. They want someone they can control. My daughter is not controllable.

And there are more now than ever, single 30+ year old mormon women. I try to talk some of them into dating nonmormons. They won't hear of it.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2016 11:11AM by cl2.

Don't tell Ziller!

:-)

She should try exmos. All the cultural understanding without the weirdness.

I don't know if we can lump them all into one category. I am in my early 40's, i am divorced and in the single crowd. There are many women, even in their late 30's and early 40's who have never been married. I can't explain it. Many of them are attractive and appear to be a catch. It is a bit of a challenge for me, as i already have kids and don't want to make any more babies, and yet these women very much want to have kids, so I generally don't date them. I met one just yesterday. Age 39, attractive, appears to have a good life, but she wants her own children and since i don't want more, its an automatic elimination.

I guess it probably comes down to the number. More women then men.

If having kids of their own is so important, maybe they should consider artificial insemination. But I guess LDS, Inc. would consider that a sin. It's easier to sin and be forgiven than wait for permission from LDS, Inc.

On the surface, it is a solution - but when you dig deeper, it got it's own set of issues and problems that one need to be made aware of.....

Well, look at how you're thinking of her as "a good catch." As though there's no reciprocity in relationships and the woman is just a tourist in any given relationship. We should just allow ourselves to be caught.

By what, I would ask? See, now that women can access education and careers, we aren't as trapped by accepting proposals from the first provider/protector we meet. We can now provide for and protect ourselves. So now we need the men to bring something to the table as well. I bring you my breadwinning abilities; what are you bringing? I am educated and articulate and can solve problems and be very organized and have leadership skills.

While I really hate the verses it comes from, I am beginning to understand and appreciate the term "equally yoked" more and more as I reach "totally unmarriageable at all" age. I don't want someone who just thinks I'm pretty but who cannot appreciate what I can DO and who I am and see how that could add to and/or elevate his life. Relationships are a team sport -- we have to have each other's backs.

And while some of our resident misogynists frame this as a bad thing, I think it is very much a positive that women can choose to provide for ourselves. And protect ourselves. Because this is where misogyny hurts men too. What a relief it must be when men meet a woman who is his financial equal. That has to take so much pressure off younger men who suffer from enormous pressure to be masculine protectors and absentee father providers. Straight men-and-woman couples can now really be equally yoked.

So maybe she is a great catch. Should she not also have standards? Should she not also refuse to settle for someone who will treat her with disrespect, disdain, disregard? I feel sorry for young, single mormon women because the men are all trained to be such douchebags.

Well put dogzilla! And it is a relief to have a mate that is your financial equal... or it should be.
That was one thing my TBM ex never understood when I put her through college and made her maintain a career. Even though she only worked a couple of days a week, I wanted her to have some sense of independence. I think since we divorced, she is more thankful of having had that.

You know, there are a lot of us NeverMo out there for you ex-TBMs too. We have a deep understanding of the culture and most of us understand the religion better than most TBMs...thus we get the strife that comes with it.

One of my former co-workers just turned 50 and is still single. She is a professor and living in the Mormon culture region. She's popular and pretty. Her criteria for marriage include: must be Mormon priesthood holder, temple recommend holder, must have a PhD, must NOT be divorced, must not have any children.

I doubt she will be getting married any time soon unless she drops quite a few of those criteria or marries one of her much younger students.

Two of the smartest, most successful and attractive students I had were TBM girls that just turned 40 this year and are still single. Both moved to SLC, Utah in an effort to have a higher concentration of worthy Mormon men nearby. One is now working for the church. I actually think both would have a better chance of meeting a strongly religious non-LDS man here in the midwest and converting him to Mormonism than finding the kind of guy they have for a father, which is their gold standard.

"She's popular and pretty. Her criteria for marriage include: must be Mormon priesthood holder, temple recommend holder, must have a PhD, must NOT be divorced, must not have any children."

Those are impossible mormon standards...to find a mate/husband.

I wouldn't be surprised if she was really lesbian..

IMO

ding ding ding ding

Yes she is afflicted with same sex attraction..

Much like younger men who are attractive, athletic, etc but never seem to find a " good Christian woman to marry" ... so I am saving myself for marriage... i.e. Tim Tebow

Hi Pooped....I think when you say, "finding a man like their father" you hit the nail on the head. Your older friend sounds like she's waiting to find her fantasy of her father too....her idea of " Father in Heaven" if she does..I pity the poor dude.

The fact that you think people in their 20s or early thirties are past typical marriage age, and the fact that people responded to your post and glossed over that, screams to me. It screams I am stuck in mormonthink.

late 20s and early thirties is NOT. Repeat NOT, past typical marriage age.

One more time, it's just not atypical.

Well, the recently released video on YSA statistics stated that Mormon temple marriages happen around ages 23-24, and Mormon non-temple marriages around ages 27-28, IIRC. For college-educated nevermos I would say that late 20s to early 30s is the norm.

Well, aren't you just self-important and superior. I know I didn't expressly state it, but I was talking about TBMs so by typical marriage age, I meant typical marriage age for them. Shouldn't be that hard to grasp. Even if we are going for typical marriage age of let's say all Americans check out this link for the US census bureau:

https://www.census.gov/hhes/families/files/graphics/MS-2.pdf

It looks like even in this changing world that we live in, late 20s and early 30s is a little past typical marriage age for most women. For now, anyway.

Most of the LDS coeds in Utah get really depressed and nervous if they aren't engaged by their junior year. This is the time all the RM's are back and starting to marry their high school sweethearts. I saw many a tragic marriage at that age because the couples were totally incompatible but desperate. The boys were desperate for sex and the girls were desperate to fit in to the norm and be done with all the pressure from church leaders to GET TO THE TEMPLE.

exactly what I was going to say... 30 is not over any fake hill by any means. Outside of mormondom, this is very normal!.

If anything, being married in your early 20s was kind of odd to me..

The Whole LDS marriage - family construct is skewed/lopsided, how could we expect anything reasonable?

I agree with I forget, LDS culture & expectations are unrealistic & out-of-sync with the rest of society.

That's true, LDS culture is out of sync with the rest of society, where most people wait until their mid to late 20's to get married. That also means that more women have finished their college education and have a job that allows them to support themselves.

The numbers are not on their side. In one of the leaked videos, a church authority stated that there are 7 YSA men for every 10 YSA women. Plus the YSA women tend to be better educated than the YSA men. My guess is the pool of desirable TBM men shrinks rapidly after the early to mid-twenties.

I always wondered if there were a higher number of divorces among the LDS because the women were pretty much forced to marry men below their education and I.Q. I have only heard that divorce among Mormons is about the same as the national average. Maybe the women have learned to just grin and bare it or not get married at all. That could be what keeps it even with the rest of the nation.

It's Like unmatched socks. You've got to look where the match is.

Most are land whales

I recognize this phenomena.

Have had one foot in and one foot out with the Church for a long time but keep going for the local social aspect as my real friends are far away so I guess I'm a new order Mormon of some kind. Don't send hate about this.

But dating when you are 35 in the church is impossible. There's no single men in my ward except extremely recent converts. I get hit on all the time when I'm traveling for work or at Home Depot but I think a lot of that is looking for a quick hookup. And yeah I'm horny all the time too but I want some romance and relationship first. And I'm scared of STDs.

I've never married, I built a company instead, no children, own my house and am not a model (not a land whale) but I have an hourglass figure and cleavage that pops guys' eyes out. And yeah I don't wear g's, even at Church.

There are other women in my ward who have done the whole temple marriage thing, had abusive husbands and now have to restart. They are far prettier and younger than I and more TBM, but they can't get dates either.

No hate here. There are plenty of board members who still go to church for one reason or another.

My suggestion would be to manage your relationships. If a guy hits on you that interests you, suggest that you meet up for some coffee, or what have you. If all he wants is sex, you'll know soon enough. But you might consider giving the guys a chance. Nevermo men like to find lasting relationships, too.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2016 05:19PM by summer.

Why is it so damn important to own a house as a single whatever? Man, I rent! Yeah. I'm throwing money out the window. But I can move when it's time and I'm ready for change. So very ready for some change now and no I don't wear my garments or go to church. Work, family or rest when needed.

This Time Magazine article does a great job of explaining what you are seeing.

http://time.com/dateonomics/

It's simple. There are more Mormon women than men. This means that, barring polygamy or marriage to non-Mormon men, some of the women won't be able to wed within their faith community.
http://www.sltrib.com/home/2875998-155/mormonisms-dating-dilemma-is-a-guy

http://time.com/dateonomics/

samwitch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's simple. There are more Mormon women than men.

This is the reason.

Active marriageable Mormon women now outnumber the men by almost 2 to 1. That is a terribly sad statistic that is causing a world of pain to countless Mormon women.

Cause needy mormon gals chase all off.

No men that are marriage material.

What's marriage material to you??? Forget marriage material, you got it all wrong. Date to be dating, not for a cookie cutter over the satellite ideal marriage.

To me, it is just a shame that some LDS females feel they need to find a LDS male in order to have a good married life, Mormon-wise.

A good man is rare enough, so (IMO), don't waste years and tears on finding a LDS male (many, if not most of which, are self-conceited about being a single PD male, and therefore wouldn't make a good husband anyway). Besides which, the conceit continues on after marriage.

Hence, marrying a good man comes far before marrying a LDS.

As my grown son says, "Don't be dumb" (when answers are obvious, but avoided).

because she was above marriageable age -- at 22!

After dating a good number of TBMs I Married a nevermo at age 35. Best decision of my life!

Well good for your life! Enjoy. Meantime, I'm enjoying a life without any kind of bots.

I was two weeks from my twenty-third birthday and my wife was a few months shy of twenty-two when we married. She confided in me several years later that she first thought I only married her for sex. That was pretty important back in the day. Later she admitted I must have truly loved her to put have up with her for as long as I have. Next month we will celebrate forty-eight years of married life. A lot of that time was as members of TSCC. The best years have been the twenty years we have been out of the church. Looking back we both agree that we were probably too young when we married, but that is hindsight and water long passed under the bridge. Amazing I met her the summer she graduated high school and she waited for me while I was away almost two years in the service during Vietnam. We married eight days after I returned home. I am glad now that we didn't wait after all, but for some there is value in marrying at an older age. Sorry I couldn't really speak to the topic but It started me thinking of how very fortunate I have been to have met and shared my life with my wonderful friend, my wife.

This is really beautiful.

That's what I want right there. 47 yrs of hard work, blood sweat and tears. No perfect picture story telling.

The problem might be with the men.

The smart men have left Moronism. The attractive women should do the same.

And those that you refer to as less attractive would be far better off to leave too. They are not land whales. They are a hell of a lot more than that but will probably never be appreciated by LDS men who are stuck in an adolescent state of mind. Mormonism fucks up people's heads and finishes them off with its prosperity gospel, with everything about image, wealth and the appearance of success. No woman needs that bullshit put on her. Outside of Mormonism, there is an entire world of reality.

Bullshit. Complete and total bullshit.

Michaelm has a point! I was thrust into the leadership of the regional LDS Single Adults, as my calling, when I'd been divorced only a few months. There were a lot of special firesides for just the men, and the church leaders put full blame onto the men, for not getting married. The speeches were quite harsh, and made some of the guys angry. The Mormon church thinks that all you need to do is line up a bunch of single men against a wall, and a bunch of single women against the opposite wall, dim the lights, and play some music. Individuals are more complicated than that. Life is more complicated than that.

There were lots of reasons people were single, in our area. We made a tally, and believe it or not, one of the main reasons men were single was because of incarceration! With women, it was that they were overweight.

My sons (who never went to the Mormon singles) didn't get married until they were in their thirties, because they were working their way through college, and grad school, and establishing their careers. People accused them of being gay. People have accused me of being lesbian. What other reason would I have for turning down the wonderful proposals by such great Mormon "catches"? I must have been crazy. Professional men, a former stake president, a man written up as "one of the 10 most eligible bachelors" in his city's magazine. I met hundreds of good marriage-worthy people, including quite a few that I had known previously at BYU, and in high school. I seemed to be popular, but only because I had money, a house, a great career, was friendly, funny, was useful as a matchmaker, was thin (thin should have been put at the first of this list!) and was from a GA family. No one ever had a deep conversation with me. I should have done more soul-searching, but I was just enjoying the fun dates! Living on the surface, I had no idea how much I disagreed with the Mormon mindset, regarding the non-status of females, the arrogance of the males, the belief that polygamy is still God's plan after death, that in marrying a priesthood holder I would become his possession and not his partner.

There was just something "wrong." Add to that, so many Mormon women are brainwashed that only a Mormon husband would make a good, sober, dependable father. Because of my strict TBM family, I could never have married anybody but a Mormon; yet, I was opposed to their philosophy (prejudice, hatred, lies, etc.) I had no choice, but to remain single (and happy.)

My TBM cousin and I were talking about this, and between us we had 8 unmarried children between the ages of 23-36. They were good looking enough, bright, educated, had good futures, etc. We came to the conclusion that these kids were too happy! They had friends, a social life, success, hobbies, sports, travel, money, a nice house (either still living with us at home, or in a house of their own). They got along too well with the family. Life was too easy.

More bullshit! I have never seen a "special" fireside just for single men for not getting married. Simple burnt out and sssooo tired of women with mindless hopes. "Can't take to the temple" bullshit I so much of. Man porn iiissss sssooo much than dating her boring ass. Man, you'd think I'd have to spend the evening just trying to date a mindless bot while fullfilling a calling. If taking a friend to a fireside with the regional choir perfoming. God ya I so bored with the singing. I needed to take a piss then on the way back found another rep was deepy needing help setting up the desserts, tables, and chairs. Got pretty involved with that as usual. I came back and all she could do was sit there and pick her nails.??? She couldn't recite anything that was being sung. ( trying to get a conversation going) then she smelt like a cats litter box. What the hell kinda of mindless bot thinks your to get turned on by smelling like a litter box??? Thanks gawd she got married to a afganny i.t. nutjob.

As with EVERYTHING in mormonism, the easiest way to understand it is Follow The Money!

The geezer brigade will never encourage these incredible girls who have so much to offer, to date or marry outside the religion or even outside the temple. For one thing, if they stay single they end up getting fairly highly educated or good paying jobs. They will likely stay active in the church and their 10% adds up. To a lot. Whereas, the ones who do marry outside the temple are much more likely to drift away from the church and take their earnings with them.

And secondly, a percentage of these girls will get mormon guys in the 2nd round--when they're divorced with kids. The more cute mormon girls who are 30+, the more likely these guys will pick from that crop. And since the guys often have alimony and child support to pay, the girls usually have to keep working, even if they have children of their own, especially if they pay tithing on both incomes. But they'll still pay their 10% on both incomes.

My opinion: Once an LDS woman gets over the age of 22, many people in the church (including the young woman herself) starts to wonder what the problem is. Surely they MUST have something wrong with them. In fairness, the same thing happens to young men in the church after about 26. And it's just silly. Because people shouldn't get married until they have fully developed adult brains and can take care of themselves. People should get married when they find the right person, and not to fill a societal expectation to marry and have babies.

My observations (I got married in later 20s):

Many (but not all) LDS guys are intimidated by too much education or independence in women.

In my BYU wards--later the ones with 'older' singles--the older guys in their mid to late 20s gravitated to the youngest girls who were fresh out of high school. Then tended to overlook the women who had graduated college or had careers. Now tell me that doesn't show a preference to choose someone young and hot, and who would be dependent and compliant.

I'm the 1% whose learned by being single all the way to this point ( 43 ) in life the independent woman is extremely hot BUT Having a divorced sister (lived in her basement for 3 yrs) is the hardest thing a man can do. We fought it out a many a times till I learning how to deal with her BULLSHIT! AND THE FAMILY IS THE WISER FOR IT. they keep asking how did I do it.

that its just an imbalance of numbers.

I would like to throw in my two cents here that more men than women bail on the LDS church. Here's why:

The women are taught to be submissive, know your place, the bible says so, heres a scripture, pray and obey, you will get the life you deserve in the CK, a woman's accomplishments are in the home, have babies, have babies, have babies and don't forget your tithing.

The men on the other hand are taught they have the power of the priesthood, that they are responsible for revelation. Then they find out that Joseph Smith used his power of revelation to get himself off. They understand that immediately- the threatening Emma, the whole sexual pervert thing, and they eventually bail.

Women think its complicated. They have had their sexuality and reproduction controlled by others for their whole lives. When they read the D&C, and learn what Smith really is, they say "it can't be true!" It's a mistranslation, written by enemies, an attempt to destroy the restoration of the gospel, he was uneducated and doing what he thought was right. Just like they make excuses for their husband, they are prone to make excuses for Joseph Smith.

So they go to their bishop and cry on his shoulder. He fills their ears with things like, "You are a queen in waiting, a Royal chosen person, held back for this marvelous work of bringing spirits who are wait, waiting to be born in these last days. What could be more important?

So they get a job at McDonalds "just temporarily" and bear most of the burden of childraising while their husband attended important meetings. When he's gone and she's alone, her life hasn't changed much to be honest. She was already doing most of the work.

But one thing she knows, she's going to choose better because God has made promises and she can bind him to those promises, but she has to have a Mormon man in order to get a temple divorce.

Read that last sentence again.

That's why.

She can't marry a non-Mormon and still keep her children in the CK. And they are her most important work, right?



Kathleen

Hard hitting analysis, Anagranny!

And right on target.

I hope folks do what I did, and go back to read your entire post a second time.

It is disturbing. But it is true.

I know of several nice couples who got married in their 60s. That seems like a typical marriage age. She wants to marry 40 years early?

What's wrong with being and remaining attractive?

Maybe men (tbm or not) just don't want to get married? Seriously, not much incentive anymore.


BTW, if this trend continues, they will have no choice but to give women the priesthood.

You know, a lot of women don't really have much incentive to marry anymore either. (See also: My previous post upthread about women providing for and protecting themselves.)

Yep, time to throw the male children in the grinder and become a true hive species now that women can support themselves. Who needs males anymore. Their strengths are no longer needed.

Whatever.

Like most things, the institution is to blame. Now that misogyny has rightly lost its treasured and accepted place in Mormon society - it has unraveled the fabric of mysticism that held Mormonism together for so long.

Mormonism is about a few men having absolute power and the rest are to be emasculated sheep. The more sheep-like, the more valuable the man becomes to the LDS culture. In the 90’s, Hinckley began a series of talks in which he would always treat men like children, his themes ranged from “you are lucky a girl even married you”, “take her out on a date, she is better than you and is taking a huge chance by giving you the time of day” to “stop playing around and get married, who do you think you are?”. These comments, although tongue in cheek, were constant, and always alluding to men being lazy sheep who needed their rear-end kicked.

Why get married to a princess who just wants to drag you to Church every weekend and only respects you if you become a Bishop or somesuch? Men would rather go to the hallways, face the shame and stare at a painting for 45 minutes; they get more spirituality out that, than the vomit-fest going on in the classroom. The manuals read like the 500 page fine print disclosure when you buy a computer; no one reads it, you know it’s just generic jargon, so they just agree in order to move on. Every quorum is a group of nervous men checking the scores and the time remaining for the lesson on their cell phone.

The church used to at least try to be fun. Now, everything feels like an exercise in liability avoidance. Ward breakfasts are like a refugee camp, no one makes eye contact, the food is cold and cheap and people just want to get out of there. Ward date night is dead and buried. No basketball, no road-shows, no super-trips.

The men are objectified. They used to be admired for just showing up and trying. They were respected. Now they are compared to the sheepiest of the sheep or the laziest of bums - indeed, even at an exmormon site.

If they don’t go on a mission, men won’t get to even date the “best” Mormon girls. If men don’t look the part, they don’t get the callings that make women go "Ooooh". If men don’t pay the piper, no temple recommend, and therefore no temple date weddings, or bullet-proof underwear.

The typical young Mormon woman loves the idea of going to school for a semester to find a husband and then sequentially retire with her 6 children. She is looking for a hard working sheep that will provide, do his 30 hour calling and still be home to rub her feet and sing hymns to the kids. Good men don't want a fundie wife who let-herself-go and drag them off to waste half the weekend at church after working for 50% lower wages than every other state nearby all week long.

The sexy times harping has become unbearable. I don’t know about you, but Mormonism made me feel like a rapist. The constant talking about self-pleasure, porn, bare knees, shoulders, thoughts, co-workers, it felt like that is the only thing the priesthood is about anymore - not cheating on your wife. They have made spirituality about the most common and vulgar things possible: money and sex. Most girls act like men are creeps just for trying to ask them out.

Recently there were 4 articles in the same Ensign about tithing, so they must be worried. The pressure for the end-of –the-year shakedown has increased. They escalated to a public sign up list, now they just call you and schedule it on the phone. The mention of money has increased in sacrament meeting and priesthood: they don’t have enough, the ward missionary needs some, the chapel is dirty and they need volunteers to clean it, the want you to pay for this and that and encourage you to contribute more and more. This makes men uncomfortable, especially when the women join in the choir. Sorry, no matter what covenant we took, our kids eat before the church gets its investment money, deal with it.

The return on investment is non-existent for men in the LDS church.

They have even taken our imaginary future planets! They have burdened men with endless to do lists and spineless leaders. It has been insinuated that they are just waiting for a scout campout to rape all the kids in the ward. We have all been taught that the righteous prosper financially and have been made aware of the financial expectations this level of righteousness brings. We have been called lazy, after working 60 hours plus 25 on our calling and 5 visiting and going to the temple. We have been infantilized. We are asked to visit people that don’t want to be visited, have meetings no one wants to attend, go to the temple to pray for our families, all while we are too busy to be with them. We have been taught to use guilt and fear. We have
been asked to clean the toilets of other men on our hands and knees.

We have been informed that having 5 kids without a career or college degree is matter of faith, while we see the church make financial cuts based on reality. We have been told that good boys don’t remember or think.

Being told by the Church And society that men just suck is f*ked-up.

If there is a root cause, it is the decline of the middle class - the inability of even a family of four to survive on a beaver's family income; and it is not only the LDS church which has lost resources, it is all churches, fraternal clubs and even civic government.

The Mormon fantasy was never true, but the society that allowed it to prosper no longer exists.

Thank you for a dose of reality! I was getting ill reading this thread until your excellent post. Of course, it isn't appreciated by most here, I would guess. Contrary to exmo doctrine.

I keep reading that good men are hard to find, as though all the women are angels. BS.

As young men continue to be told how undesirable they are, why would they want to burden a woman with marriage?

A few sample comments from above:

"Should she not also refuse to settle for someone who will treat her with disrespect, disdain, disregard? I feel sorry for young, single mormon women because the men are all trained to be such douchebags."


"They are a hell of a lot more than that but will probably never be appreciated by LDS men who are stuck in an adolescent state of mind."

"No men that are marriage material."

Really? ALL men are trained to be douchebags? Not one man is marriage material? Not ONE????

People see what they want to see, just like TBMs in the Internet age.

The general problem in American culture is that guys are trained to be white knights and women are trained to hold out for a white knight. The reality of white knights is that they destroy women by facilitating their slide into madness and then the women take the men down with them. Young guys see this and decide it isn't for them.

It's basically a cultural problem, I think stemming from the shift from traditional to nuclear families. Without multiple generations living under one roof, you have kids raising kids.

That's not to say all women will go off the deep end. There are some stable ones on this board. But the Johnny Lingos of the world are nothing but trouble for anyone conditioned by modern culture.

"Really? ALL men are trained to be douchebags? Not one man is marriage material? Not ONE????"

That is not what I said.

No, but that's what dogzilla said. News flash.....men are not girls with different plumbing. It takes work to get along. Some are willing to work and compromise....some hold out for what they call standards.

It's certainly true that boys and girls are conditioned differently. If you want to develop and maintain a good relationship....work at it.

I, too, have a very attractive daughter who is now 41. She managed to make it through 5 years of BYU, and despite going on the dates and meeting lots of boys, did not get married as she had wanted. She found her way through a hospital management company, starting at the bottom, and is now the head of two departments. Despite her success as a professional woman, she says it is not what she wants. She wants to be married and have kids.

She may frighten men, however. At this point, she is clearly a professional woman.Although she is attractive and shapely, she has done things that suck the sexiness out of her life, like by working in the temple for several years. Local church leaders have pushed her toward several men, but church leaders' standards are notoriously low--some unmarried guy with a penis, no matter his other qualifications, or lack of them. She began dating divorced TBMs, but they come with all that baggage. She once got engaged to one who had a cute 5 year-old daughter. He seemed nice, and was quite successful as a businessman trading in hospital equipment. But after being engaged for a while, he called her while she was at Disneyland with friends and told her he wanted to play the field a bit more before settling in for the long haul. I'm proud that she told him to take a hike, and not bother to call her back in future. But it did ruin her vacation, of course.