Jesus said in the Bible 3 times.....

"Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in their heart but believes that what they say will happen, it will be done for them." Mark 11:23


He replied, "Because you have so little faith. Truly I tell you, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you." Matthew 17:20


Jesus replied, "Truly I tell you, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done." Matthew 21:21

Since the time Jesus made that promise, three times, that experiment has been conducted countless times by millions of his followers, resulting in the same exact outcome EVERY GD time.

Nothing,

You can conduct that experiment right now. Pray with all of your might, mind, heart and soul. Pray like the guy on the 99th Floor of the WTC, right before it fell to the Earth, with flames licking at his back, looking out of a broken window, with less than 1 minute to live....

Nothing will happen.

Pray all night and all day that way and guess what?

The mountain will be there in the morning.

Pray for an entire week, or a month or a year or the rest of your life as hard as you possibly can and

The mountain will not move into the sea.

The mountain will be exactly where it was before you started the experiment, just as surely as we will see the sun rise in the East and set in the West tomorrow.

Just as surely as the tide will rise and fall twice a day.

The mountain stays put no matter how hard you pray.

Unless you employ a pile of dynamite almost as big as the mountain itself, and a hell of a lot of fossil fuel to extracting it load it on trucks and move it yourself to the sea.

So the question is,
If Jesus made an unambiguous serious claim, 3 times, recorded by multiple witnesses, reporters of the time.

which has failed the test every time,

was he a liar?

Or was he delusional?

Or were the writers of the stories exaggerating what he said and Mathew copied Mark and/or Vice versa?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/01/2017 10:21PM by koriwhore.

Jesus? Naw, Jimi:

"Well, I stand up next to a mountain
And I chop it down with the edge of my hand
Well, I stand up next to a mountain
Chop it down with the edge of my hand
Well, I pick up all the pieces and make an island
Might even raise just a little sand"

Nobody in the history of humanity has ever moved a mountain using "faith."
Not even bible Jesus.

How about that :)

(cue the "it's just a metaphor!" folks)

ificouldhietokolob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nobody in the history of humanity has ever moved a
> mountain using "faith."
> Not even bible Jesus.
>
> How about that :)
>
> (cue the "it's just a metaphor!" folks)

Metaphor my ass. Usually when you're relating a metaphor, you preface it by saying, "This is just a metaphor, but..."
You don't repeat it 3 times and tell people the reason they can't kill a fig tree like you is because they don't have nearly as much faith as you and if they did, they'd be able to move a mountain into the sea, despite the fact nobody, ever in the entire history of mankind has moved a mountain an inch with faith.

Jesus was either a liar or what he meant was something the size of an atom has the power to destroy a mountain and blow it into the sea, in which case he would have prefigured E=mc^2.

The New Testament is full of Jesus speaking in metaphor and in figurative language. Yes, even the fig is a metaphor within the context of the story which is actually meaningful wisdom. People use allegory to express meaning all the time. Some allegory may seem odd to us because we didn't live 2000 years in Jerusalem, and we've had a life time of stupid people with an agenda explaining what scriptures mean. As a result what could have been a good lesson is corrupted, and people get shitty.

And no, people don't say hey "this is a metaphor", unless you are talking to an idiot whose slow on the uptake.

Agreed although it seemes some posters take everything way too literally

"nobody, ever in the entire history of mankind has moved a mountain an inch with faith"

Oh, come on. Have you so quickly forgotten about Jared's bro?

Ether 12:30:
"For the brother of Jared said unto the mountain Zerin, Remove – and it was removed. And if he had not had faith it would not have moved; wherefore thou workest after men have faith."

Totally historical incident! That's why you can't find Mt. Zerin on *any* map today!

It's official doctrine – even shows up in the Encyclopedia of Mormonism!

Encyclopedia of Mormonism, Vol. 1, BROTHER OF JARED:
"The brother of Jared and his people crossed the sea to the Promised Land. His great faith, as noted by Moroni, once caused a mountain, Zerin, to be removed."

Reynolds and Sjodahl, Commentary on the Book of Mormon, Vol. 6, pp. 170-71:
"Moroni refers to an incident in the history of the Jaredites, not recorded elsewhere. The Brother of Jared said to Mount Zerin, Remove! and it was removed. Where and how this happened we do not know. But it is, by no means improbable, that the Jaredites during their migrations from the coast to the interior of the Continent of Asia, encountered some mountainous obstacle which the Lord removed in answer to the prayers of faith of the great Jaredite Moses. It may have been done by some physical adjustment of the earth such as an earthquake, or by some supernatural agency unknown to us. Whatever it was, be it either case, it was a miracle, a divine reward of Faith."

Unless, you know, Joseph Smith made it all up to turn a Bible metaphor into something literal.

Yeah, like I said...

:)

Like Clockwork or KennyAnne Conjob defending a pu$$ygrabbing White Supremacist.

Jesus can't even heal any injury on my body that I asked to be healed so I wouldn't have to go through countless surgeries I tested him straight up cause everybody was telling me to pray to him cause he's the master healer but you might as well pray to your toothpaste tube you'll get nothing so he's all talk and I don't think he exists so I kinda feel like an idiot.

Move a mountain? Hell, Jesus couldn't even reveal the "truth" of the BoM to me, no matter how many times I read it, no matter how much faith I had, and no matter how many times I prayed.

Does faith come in particles or waves?

Dude, you know it's both.

More interesting are the quantum aspects of the resurrection. Is Jesus alive or dead? Maybe He's in a superposition of both at the same time! The is Schrodinger's Savior Paradox.

Being from El Paso, I've known a number of Jesuses. One of them did, in fact, have the nickname of 'Mountain' Mendoza. Because of girth rather than height, but still. He was the captain of the football team. I do not know if he used particles of faith to move around, but I did see him move.

Now the best Jesus of all time made an appearance in The Big Lebowski. No mountains were moved, but the creep sure could roll, in his synthetic purple jumpsuit.

8 year olds dude..

I refuse to call Jesus a liar because I don't believe he even existed.

If Jesus drove a Komatsu D575, he could move just aboput anything...

Indeed he could!! That bad boy is badass!!

The bible is just a bunch of made-up stories we tell ourselves because we want certainty in a chaotic universe. To the simple-minded bible stories help them feel safe.

I can tell you that I don't place much stock in faith and prayer right now. When listening to the palliative care doc tell my wife her options for her own end of life care and what if any or no heroic measures she's like performed on her to prolong her life even if those actions could possible put her into a vegetative state, all I felt was despair.

In my opinion neither. Since there is evidence that the Roman Piso family actually wrote the New Testament then it is possiblew that the whole thing is fixction

Oh, please, that theory is nonsense.

The theory doesn't fail. All the failures prove is that no one really has faith and that doubt is the normal state of the human mind. We are all mere muggles.