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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 05:18PM

This is of special interest to me, since it includes areas I have some knowledge of, and particular interest in (Swaziland, as well as a number of Khoisan areas, are on the "new continent" side).

When I was growing up, one of the things I most wanted was a globe--and although I didn't get my wish back then, I have three of them now.

Throughout my growing up, I used to spend long periods of time with world maps (at home), or with globes (at school), where I would very carefully examine South America, and Africa, and "see" where they had once fit together, and wonder with all of my might as to how they wound up separate continents with the Atlantic Ocean between them.

Well...THIS is how is happens in real time!!!

THIS is a sort of God's-eye (or space alien's) view of planetary change...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62wWxqkbx0o

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Posted by: steve benson ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 05:47PM

I remember seeing an illustration of the globe with all of the ocean waters stripped off of it, so that you could see the seabed formations, the hot spots and vents, the deep canyons out of which magma is pushed up and spread out, along with the areas of subduction where the surface plates are pushed down, only to reemerge elsewhere—all part of a beautiful interlocking. natural mosaic of mass in motion, puzzle pieces of land being ever so slowly pushed and shoved and moved and shifted around in the grand, ever-changing, majestic process called continental drift.

Seeing this global perspective laid out before me in ways I could visually comprehend was an amazing moment of personal and exhilarating enlightenment. I realized how our planet was, and is, being formed over eons of time up to and beyond this day, in ways that are observable, predictable and utterly fascinating.

In that moment, plate tectonics/continental drift powerfully drove the point home to me that we live on an exceedingly old, yet vibrant, planet that is in the unending process of constant creation—and that the scripture stories of “creation” are pure and total bunk.

This moment of thunder-struck comprehension came to me, of all places, while sitting at a study table in the Harold B. Lee Library at BYU. It was, for me, another break for personal freedom from inside the concentration camp of moldering Mormonism.

Hoorah!!!



Edited 8 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2018 08:08AM by steve benson.

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 05:50PM

^^^ ^^^ ^^^

Yes!!!

Thank you for this, Steve...you expressed it beautifully.

:)

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Posted by: steve benson ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 05:59PM


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Posted by: bobofitz ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 08:14PM

Hi Steve...I love your posts. This personal epiphany you have just related brought back a longtime memory for me that I’d like to share. It wasn’t life changing at the time, mainly because I was too young to have understood what it meant, but I remember it vividly. When I was a real young child my mother gave me a puzzle of the United States with each state a puzzle piece. It was a wonderful way to learn geography. When I was in second grade I remember the teacher pulling down a large map of the world that nearly covered the entire blackboard. The shapes of the different colored countries reminded me of the puzzle I used as a little kid. What I noticed most was how the shapes of Africa and South America would seem to fit together so well. I raised my hand and asked my teacher if maybe they had once been together. I was abruptly dismissed with something like, “ this is not our subject for today” ...or something like that. As I mentioned I didn’t have a serious moment at that time, but I later learned about Pangea and geologic history. Ironically I took Geology at BYU back in 1965 and didn’t hear any “seven days” stuff or any flood talk ...it was just pretty straightforward science. It’s amazing how confusing our educations were when trying to integrate what we were taught in schools with what we were fed in Church. It was definitely counter productive.

Thanks again for your posts, they are very informative.

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 10:27PM

bobofitz Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What I noticed most was how the
> shapes of Africa and South America would seem to
> fit together so well. I raised my hand and asked
> my teacher if maybe they had once been together. I
> was abruptly dismissed with something like, “
> this is not our subject for today” ...or
> something like that.

Oh, boy...do I ever remember this kind of response to what was, from my perspective, a serious question! (In elementary school, I got laughed at a lot by some fellow students, too...though this MOSTLY vanished once I entered junior high.)

I DO remember, bobofitz!!

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Posted by: bobofitz ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 11:00PM

Thank you Tevai. I enjoy your posts also. They are interesting and informative.

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Posted by: jay ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 08:20PM

How did you feel when you heard about the frozen Wooly Mammoth they found in Siberia? And where were you?

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Posted by: steve benson ( )
Date: April 08, 2018 07:48AM

I remember, again when I was at BYU in the 1970s, the find of a frozen, well-preserved carcass of a baby woolly mammoth. This was within the context of Siberian woolly mammoth remains being uncovered with the remnants of buttercups still preserved in their stomachs.

I had a nutty BYU religion professor, Reid Bankhead—a colleague of my Uncle Reed (oldest child of a ETB) on its religion faculty. “Bunkhead,” as he was known among scoffers, touted a goofy creationist publication in his Book of Mormon classes which claimed that:

-these Siberian mammoths were killed in a “quick freeze” caused when an icey astroid supposedly was pulled into Earth’s orbit by its gravitational field;

-whereupon the astroid dumped its ice load on the poles;

-in the process freezing to death the peacefully-munching woolly mammoths;

-with the asteroid ice subsequently melting;

-causing global sea levels to rise;

-precipitating Noah’s Flood;

-which then proceeded to cover the whole world.

And Mormons wonder why BYU is regarded as an insult to good comedy clubs everywhere.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2018 08:10AM by steve benson.

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: April 08, 2018 12:51PM

steve benson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And Mormons wonder why BYU is regarded as an
> insult to good comedy clubs everywhere.

:D :D :D

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Posted by: steve benson ( )
Date: April 08, 2018 02:45PM

“Big Crack Is Evidence That East Africa Could Be Splitting In Two”

By Lucia Perez
CNN
April 6, 2018 . . .

“A large crack, stretching several kilometres, made a sudden appearance recently in south-western Kenya.

“The tear, which continues to grow, caused part of the Nairobi-Narok highway to collapse and was accompanied by seismic activity in the area.

“The Earth is an ever-changing planet, even though in some respects change might be almost unnoticeable to us. Plate tectonics is a good example of this. But every now and again something dramatic happens and leads to renewed questions about the African continent splitting in two.

“The Earth's lithosphere (formed by the crust and the upper part of the mantle) is broken up into a number of tectonic plates.

“These plates are not static, but move relative to each other at varying speeds, ‘gliding’ over a viscous asthenosphere.

“Exactly what mechanism or mechanisms are behind their movement is still debated, but are likely to include convection currents within the asthenosphere and the forces generated at the boundaries between plates.

“These forces do not simply move the plates around, they can also cause plates to rupture, forming a rift and potentially leading to the creation of new plate boundaries. The East African Rift system is an example of where this is currently happening.

“The East African Rift Valley stretches over 3,000km from the Gulf of Aden in the north towards Zimbabwe in the south, splitting the African plate into two unequal parts: the Somali and Nubian plates.

“Activity along the eastern branch of the rift valley, running along Ethiopia, Kenya and Tanzania, became evident when the large crack suddenly appeared in south-western Kenya. Why does rifting happen?

“When the lithosphere is subject to a horizontal extensional force it will stretch, becoming thinner. Eventually, it will rupture, leading to the formation of a rift valley.

“This process is accompanied by surface manifestations along the rift valley in the form of volcanism and seismic activity. Rifts are the initial stage of a continental break-up and, if successful, can lead to the formation of a new ocean basin.

“An example of a place on Earth where this has happened is the South Atlantic ocean, which resulted from the break up of South America and Africa around 138m years ago — ever noticed how their coastlines match like pieces of the same puzzle?

“Continental rifting requires the existence of extensional forces great enough to break the lithosphere. The East African Rift is described as an active type of rift, in which the source of these stresses lies in the circulation of the underlying mantle.

“Beneath this rift, the rise of a large mantle plume is doming the lithosphere upwards, causing it to weaken as a result of the increase in temperature, undergo stretching and breaking by faulting.

“Evidence for the existence of this hotter-than-normal mantle plume has been found in geophysical data and is often referred to as the ‘African Superswell.’

“This superplume is not only a widely accepted source of the pull-apart forces that are resulting in the formation of the rift valley but has also been used to explain the anomalously high topography of the Southern and Eastern African Plateaus.

“Breaking Up Isn't Easy

“Rifts exhibit a very distinctive topography, characterised by a series of fault-bounded depressions surrounded by higher terrain. In the East African system, a series of aligned rift valleys separated from each other by large bounding faults can be clearly seen from space.

“Not all of these fractures formed at the same time, but followed a sequence starting in the Afar region in northern Ethiopia at around 30m years ago and propagating southwards towards Zimbabwe at a mean rate of between 2.5-5cm a year.

“Although most of the time rifting is unnoticeable to us, the formation of new faults, fissures and cracks or renewed movement along old faults as the Nubian and Somali plates continue moving apart can result in earthquakes.

“However, in East Africa most of this seismicity is spread over a wide zone across the rift valley and is of relatively small magnitude. Volcanism running alongside is a further surface manifestation of the ongoing process of continental break up and the proximity of the hot molten asthenosphere to the surface.

“A Timeline in Action

“The East African Rift is unique in that it allows us to observe different stages of rifting along its length. To the south, where the rift is young, extension rates are low and faulting occurs over a wide area. Volcanism and seismicity are limited.

“Towards the Afar region, however, the entire rift valley floor is covered with volcanic rocks. This suggests that, in this area, the lithosphere has thinned almost to the point of complete break up.

“When this happens, a new ocean will begin forming by the solidification of magma in the space created by the broken-up plates. Eventually, over a period of tens of millions of years, seafloor spreading will progress along the entire length of the rift.

“The ocean will flood in and, as a result, the African continent will become smaller and there will be a large island in the Indian Ocean composed of parts of Ethiopia and Somalia, including the Horn of Africa.

“Dramatic events, such as sudden motorway-splitting faults or large catastrophic earthquakes may give continental rifting a sense of urgency but, most of the time, it goes about splitting Africa without anybody even noticing.”



Edited 9 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2018 08:53PM by steve benson.

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: April 08, 2018 03:33PM

Thank you, Steve!!!

This is wonderful information...thank you SO MUCH for taking the time to do this for us!

I was just cleaning the kitchen and thinking about things, and I remembered the (probably very common) times when I wondered about how the experience would have been if any of us had been able to actually OBSERVE the Big Bang happen...or maybe the Earth when the dinosaurs roamed free...or the time period when our species was very young and still, primarily, in developmental flux.

This dramatic land split in Kenya, even if it DOES take 50 million years to culminate, is the equivalent of the various key events in our universe's, and our planet's, history we KNOW happened, but which no individual of our species was able to knowingly observe...or (alternatively) to know WHAT they were actually seeing or experiencing as they were living through the various challenges and changes of their particular times.

There was a post-WWII radio show, and later a TV series, titled "You Are There," which did historical reenactments of famous vignettes from world, and American, history...and this, right NOW, is the real-life equivalent.

We ARE "there," right now and for REAL, as a new continent is being born on our planet...

...and though I am (simultaneously) very sorry for the human and non-human animal costs which will inevitably come about as this process proceeds (the man who was working so hard to save the individual pieces of his torn-apart house really got to me), I am also more than a bit incredulous that I (and all of us) are able to see and experience this huge planetary change as it is actually happening...

...and to consciously KNOW how this is eventually going to end, millions of years from right now.

Thank you so much, Steve, for the time and work you put into providing us with this very welcome material, because it does help, immensely, to understand how we are SO privileged to be able to knowingly observe and understand this birth process of a new continent, as it happens in real time, during OUR lifetimes.

Thank you, Steve, for this...and for all that you have given to us, and to the world, through the years.

:)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2018 03:41PM by Tevai.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 06:11PM

I have always loved globes too, Tevai. We had one as kids and I felt rich. I have a tiny one on my office desk just as decoration. I've wanted to buy one for a long time now but they are not as prevalent as they used to be. Not the real kind that are actually useful. Maybe they've disappeared along with the paper maps that every corner gas station used to carry.

Yet another way the world she is a'changin' I guess.

It takes effort to keep up!

I've been paying attention too to the incredible sight of continents shifting. I've always marvelled at the history of human migration and the amazingness of ancestors trekking across continents that are now divided by massive waters (good walkers; even better than friends who just returned from a trek in England where they walked 10 miles a day. No wet feet either). Almost beyond comprehension for some of us.

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 10:07PM

Thank you, Nightingale!!

:) :) :)

[I agree that globes seem to have "disappeared" from retail stores, but if I wanted another one right now, I would Google.]

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 06:21PM

Mother Nature always has the final say.

I'm a maps and globes person as well. My brother had a globe in our family home, and I always enjoyed looking at it. And I always collected the maps out of National Geographic Magazines.

Steve, I find underwater geography interesting as well. It's like discovering a hidden world.

I would be interested in having a globe of Mars.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2018 06:22PM by summer.

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 10:13PM

summer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And I always collected the
> maps out of National Geographic Magazines.

Me, too!! :)


> I would be interested in having a globe of Mars.

If you Google "globe of Mars" there are a number of globes of Mars available...including a "to scale" set of the Earth, Earth's Moon, and Mars for $18.95 (which is undoubtedly not all that detailed, but would be fun to have anyway).

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 09:18PM

Gee ... I wonder why they call it the great rift valley.

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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 09:29PM

Can't watch the video in "MY COUNTRY"....bummer

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: April 07, 2018 10:00PM

Lethbridge Reprobate Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Can't watch the video in "MY COUNTRY"....bummer

Go to YouTube and search for: Kenya rift valley, 2018

If that doesn't work (though it should), you can Google the same thing and there will probably be accessible-to-you videos within the search results.

:)

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Posted by: SL Cabbie ( )
Date: April 08, 2018 07:21AM

Per the geologist: This will take tens of millions of years for this to happen...

Personally, I'm grateful it didn't happen in California... The doomsday crowd would be all over this one.

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Posted by: olderelder ( )
Date: April 08, 2018 11:08AM

Tevai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...I would very carefully
> examine South America, and Africa, and "see" where
> they had once fit together...

But the plates also moved up and down as they drifted apart, dropping below sea level or rising above sea level or changing the depth of the oceans altogether, so I think a lot of the Africa/South America "fit" is coincidental.

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Posted by: anybody ( )
Date: April 08, 2018 12:34PM

"Crack In The World" (1965) with Dana Andrews

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGXVBW82GnY

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Posted by: steve benson ( )
Date: April 08, 2018 05:13PM

. . . wondering about when a new moon is going to emerge might not be at the top of your priority list.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2018 05:49PM by steve benson.

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Posted by: SL Cabbie ( )
Date: April 09, 2018 10:36AM

One of my regular RFM e-buddies and fact checkers just sent me this one. The tectonic split is very real, but it looks like the shinola shovelers were out in force...

https://www.theguardian.com/science/blog/2018/apr/06/africa-is-slowly-splitting-in-two-but-this-crack-in-kenya-rift-valley-has-little-to-do-with-it

>>A widely reported crack in the Rift Valley was not formed by tectonic movement, but by erosion of soil from recent heavy rains

>>This agrees with what local geologists have said and previous studies have concluded – rainwater has washed away deep layers of loose volcanic ash deposited by previous volcanic eruptions in the rift valley. Similar erosional features have been observed before in tectonically stable regions, such as Arizona. Given this conclusion, it is fittingly less dramatic to refer to this feature as a gully.

Hmmm, I'm winding up reading the Guardian a bit more these days, and I see they're trying to keep from being drawn into the "paywall canyon." Might have to kick something in the next time I get a trip to Idaho...

/insert Mark Twain quote about truth having trouble putting its pants on

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Posted by: steve benson ( )
Date: April 09, 2018 10:55AM

And if what it now reports about the African continental “split” is verifiably true, it just goes to show that science has effective methodologies for fact checking claims, re-examining established or proposed theories, and readjusting positions according to new empirical realities as they become known and crystallized through observation, testing, falsifiability and replication (that is, before they are adapted in response to incoming additional data).

It’s called self-correcting, and is the best tool we have available for getting at the facts. Scientific investigation is like the perpetual motion of plate tectonics: always changing and adapting to evolving conditions othe ground (or under the water).



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 04/09/2018 01:09PM by steve benson.

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Posted by: steve benson ( )
Date: April 09, 2018 10:41AM

I’d love to talk plate tectonics with you, if you get my drift.

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