A few bits from an apologist after someone asks: "Why did Mormon Joseph Smith require members to chant pay Heylel (Hebrew for Lucifer) during the temple endowment ceremony?"

Now, first off, it's not a great question, and is probably a be "gotcha" set-up anyway, but the answer never corrects the questioner about the silly Pay Lay Ale "pure adamic language" that used to be part of the temple hokey-pokey, which you'd think might be a "missionary moment".

Here we go (from the apologist):

"As always this kind of questions (from Anti-mormons) are asked in a way to mislead people instead of trying to find a sincere answer. They always state a falsehood as a fact and ask for an explanation.

It is very clear that the purpose is to mislead people about the true beliefs taught by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

It is not possible to answer a question that has been intentionally misworded without either rewording the question or clarifying it, but since doing either would destroy the true reason of the question (which is to misinform) the original posting will not be fixed.

First off, Joseph Smith does not require any member to chant anything.

Second, the words: “pay heylel” are not and never were part of the temple endowment ceremony.

Third, no Hebrew words (except the name Elohim) has ever been part of the temple endowment ceremony."


Just my opinion, but you can bet that plenty of apologist answers are "intentionally misworded" to mislead questioners....

From what I heard, the words mean: "magnificent false god"

valkyriequeen Wrote:
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> From what I heard, the words mean: "magnificent
> false god"

Christian anti-Mormons have come up with that idea, relying on interpreting the last part as being the Hebrew word 'helel' which is the word for the planet Venus, the "morning star." This is the word which occurs at Isaiah 14:12, and which the King James Version translates as "Lucifer." However, the idea that the "morning star" was Satan is a
medieval idea, and that passage in Isaiah was NOT intended as a reference to Satan, but was addressed to the king of Babylon. So Hebrew 'helel' does NOT mean "Satan," or "false god," whether that's the word in the endowment ritual or not. Most modern translations of the Bible translate Isaiah 14:12 with "star of the morning" or "morning star" or "day-star" or "light-bringer" or "son of dawn." BTW, that is the only place where the name "Lucifer" appears in the Bible, and it is ONLY in the King James Version. (Notice that this passage also appears in the Book of Mormon at 2 Nephi 24:12).

It is more likely that the meaning intended by Joseph Smith was something like the modern official revision (from 1990), "Oh God, hear the words of my mouth!" since the Hebrew word 'pe' means "mouth," and 'le' means "to" and 'el' means "God." So "pe-le-el" was intended to mean "mouth to God." Remember that Smith had been studying Hebrew at the time, and considered himself a linguistic genius.

The whole thing falls apart, however, from the fact that Mormons teach that those were the words Adam spoke in prayer in the Garden. Thus, they aren't Hebrew at all, since the Hebrew language did not exist then. But Smith apparently thought that it did, and so he makes Adam pray in Hebrew.