Some things about the church I understand very well.

One thing that blows my mind is the notion that baking a plate of cookies is going to persuade an inactive member to return to the desired "active status.' It simply DOES NOT WORK!

So why do they persist in believing-doing something that does not work?

Seriously, I never knew of or met a member that had returned to activity because some stranger baked a plate of cookies. I never heard a reactivated member stand up and bear his/her "re-born" spirituality (testimony) over a plate of snickerdoodle.

What it really takes (And I state this from experience, not a way for the church to succeed or grow) is time and authentic concern for the individual. These are two things that the church really doesn't care for. First, the church wants instant results with minimal effort. Also, the church doesn't want its members to be truly concerned with others. The church is jealous when members actually care about others that may never return to the church.

I at least want cinnamon rolls if that is what they are going to do! And coffee with it.

You make great points. This goes back to the other thread. Mormons do not understand their own religion. They are so immersed in obedience that if they are told to take a plate of cookies to someone to bring them back to the fold, they don't even stop to consider how ridiculous that is. Because---the important thing is to do what they are told and that is where all the focus is. Obedience.

Why oh why is the word "Why?" not in the Mormon vocabulary.

Done & Done Wrote:
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> I at least want cinnamon rolls if that is what they are going to do! And coffee with it.

Yum!

Haha can you imagine them leaving a thermos of coffee on your doorstep?

hahahah

messygoop Wrote:

> What it really takes...is time and authentic concern for the
> individual.

Absolutely.

Had I ever seen that from ANYBODY I might still be in.

Cults operate through manipulation.
Faking interest and offering love is one of their methods.

They bake ( or sometimes take it them out of the package) them and give them to you to get blessings on their ledger for their own rewards in the grand race to the Celestial Kingdom. They don’t give a r.a. if you eat them or feed them to your dog. The service points and the obedience points for them is what matters. Just like tithing( referred to as “fire insurance”) is paid not for what good it does for people here, but for a self serving reason, like when you pay your fire insurance premiums. That’s why they don’t really care what the money is used for...malls,? ok,...hunting clubs? no problem...we already got what we need out of the deal..our brownie points and fire insurance for the last days. Ridiculous.

bobofitz Wrote:

> The service points and the obedience points for them is what matters.

What I would like to know is...does it work the opposite way?

For example, for the people who were sh**ty to me, or needlessly stuck up and cruel, do they LOSE points?

Since I left TSCC because of them, will it count against them getting into the CK?

See, that would be the stuff that I could get behind.

The fact that it doesn't work makes no difference. They just want to try it and blame the victim when it doesn't work.

Cheryl Wrote:
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> The fact that it doesn't work makes no difference. They just want to try it and blame the victim when it doesn't work.

I wasn't righteous when I gave their cookies to the possum who stops by every night.

So, yeah, it WAS my fault!!!

:) :) :)

We were taught to endure to the end. Mormons think the end is tomorrow.

That is what I can't figure out about all these women who divorce their husbands who have lost their beliefs. Or even their children.

I remember my daughter getting really frustrated with me when she first went back to church because I wasn't catching on fast enough.

Oh-kayyy-- I just read this thread, and do you know what is absolutely childish about this whole thing?

They leave the cookies on the doorstep!

What is that about? Is it just me? Is my apostasy more contagious than anyone else's? I surmise that you other posters have had cookies "left for you" instead of given to you in person; hence, the possum wins!

When I was new in the ward, and living my first days as a divorced single mother, several Mormon neighbors, on their own, came over to welcome me and console me. I have never forgotten that. They did not dump the cookies and run--they came into my home, sat down, and talked and laughed. It was not an assigned visit. There was no manual. These lovely friends have remarried, and have moved to other states, but we are still friends.

Don't the Mormons have a clue? It's not about the cookies. If a Mormon were to bother to have an INTERACTIVE conversation, human to human, and open up a bit, and relax, a relationship might develop.

Oh, wait, Mormons don't want any kind of real relationship with us "less actives" or "apostates." And, oh, they don't want to risk listening to what we have to say, for fear that we might say something to "shake" their testimony. It's better for them to preach at us, one way, and bear their testimony, uninterrupted, and leave quickly. This is what they have been instructed to do.

One of the temple worthiness questions: "Do you associate with apostates or apostate groups?" No, I just leave them cookies.

Doorstep dumping of cookies is the best possible behavior, because the Mormons can delude themselves into thinking this is "reaching out", plus, they can do it with no personal interaction, whatsoever.

Back to the possum comment--brilliant!

Mormon: "Did you get the goodies we left on your doorstep?"

Me: "No...but our neighbor's dog is always on the rampage." It actually did happen once, that we know of. At this point, I'm done with the phony Mormons, and am simply not playing their game.

exminion Wrote:

>several Mormon neighbors, on their own, came over to welcome me and console me. I have never forgotten that.

Yes. Real stuff. Not fake. Thoughtfulness.

>they don't want to risk listening to what we have to say, for fear that we might say something to "shake" their testimony. It's better for them to preach at us, one way, and bear their testimony, uninterrupted, and leave quickly.

Ha! Yes, I have never felt so much like I had some sort of contagious disease as when I was in the LSD cult!

> Back to the possum comment--brilliant!

Thank you! I kind of love the possum. Possums are the only north american marsupial! So cool! They eat with their hands. I watch him through the window. I guess I'm silly but I think he is really cute. He liked the cookies!!! :) :) :)

I was glad to give him a treat!

Mormons generally believe that most people leave the church for petty, unimportant reasons. Simple reasons for leaving can be fixed with a simple solution.

I've received my share of cookies from Mormons. I usually just throw them away, but occasionally I'll taste one. I have to say, I think Mormons need better cookie recipes. I make far better cookies than the ones I've received.

I don't think that it doesn't work. Its based upon both reciprocal obligation and feigned interest.

As a sales/manipulation technique.. if you do something for someone they feel obligated at least on some level to want to give back. If they can make someone feel emotionally indebted to mormons, they make it easier to make suggestions that the recipient will feel more obligated to do. ( even if they didn't like the cookies)

If they see that someone showed up and actually gave them something. On some level they may feel that someone made at least some effort and is thinking about them. this will theoretically act to break down any barriers they person may have toward mormons at least on a small level.

Wowza Wrote:
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> Its based upon both reciprocal obligation and feigned interest.

Oh MY GOSH!!! You are so right!!! It is a sales technique to create a sense of obligation!!!

Everything you said, Wowza, hit me between the eyes! You have got it, and now I will not ever fall for that!!!

Thank you!!!

I agree with Wowza.

I suppose that some people respond to kind acts, signs of community, concern, and reciprocity.

Some people don't really care about the history. They are responding to emotional needs.


Also, a lot of people simply are not aware or concerned they are being manipulated.

dagny Wrote:

> Some people don't really care about the history. They are responding to emotional needs.

Yes, that was me. Dagny, your comments are always spot on!!!

Thanks!