At the request of posters Walter Prince and Eli in the "Russell Nelson as Mormon Moses" thread, I did some digging into what Mrs. Nelson has said on spiritual sex and found the following that was taken from a talk on marital intimacy that was given in 2017. The whole of that speech can be found at

https://www.lds.org/broadcasts/article/worldwide-devotionals/2017/01/love-and-marriage?lang=eng

From that talk comes the following quote about Truth #4:

"This leads to Truth #4: For true marital intimacy, the Holy Ghost needs to be involved. It is simply not possible to have the kind of intimate experiences
outside of marriage that you can have within because the Spirit will not be present.

Elder Parley P. Pratt taught that the Holy Ghost has the ability to increase, enlarge, expand, and purify “all the natural passions and affections.”
5
Just imagine: He can purify your feelings! Therefore, anything that invites the Spirit into your life, and into the life of your spouse and your marriage,
will increase your ability to experience marital intimacy. It really is as simple, and as profound, as that!

On the other hand, anything that offends the Spirit will decrease your ability to be one with your spouse. Things such as anger, lust, unforgiveness, contention,
immorality, and unrepented sin will reduce your attempt for marital intimacy to be something that is nothing more than a sexual experience.

So, to recap: While worldly sex is under the influence of the world and the adversary and involves carnal, sensual, and devilish passions, God-ordained
marital intimacy is under the influence of the Spirit and involves Spirit-enhanced and purified passions. The truth is, the more pure you are, the more
marvelous your marital intimacy will be.

With worldly sex, anything goes. With marital intimacy, exquisite care is taken to avoid anything and everything—from language to music to movies—that
offends the Spirit, your spirit, or your spouse’s.

While worldly sex is lustful and kills love, marital intimacy generates more love.

Worldly sex degrades men and women and their bodies, while marital intimacy honors men and women and celebrates the body as one of the great prizes of
mortal life.

With worldly sex, individuals can feel used, abused, and ultimately more lonely. With marital intimacy, spouses feel more united and loved, more nurtured
and understood.

Worldly sex ravages and eventually ruins relationships. Marital intimacy strengthens marriages. It supports, heals, and hallows the lives of spouses and
their marriage.

Worldly sex has been likened to the toot of a flute, while marital intimacy has been likened to the grandeur of an entire orchestra.

Worldly sex becomes a total obsession because it never fulfills its promises. God-ordained marital intimacy is glorious and will continue eternally for
covenant-keeping husbands and wives.

In short, marital intimacy endorsed by the Spirit is blessed by the Lord and is sanctifying."

For a scholarly podcast challenging Mrs. Nelson's assertions about sexual behavior, see

https://www.athoughtfulfaith.org/the-truths-about-marital-intimacy-a-critique-of-wendy-nelsons-sex-talk-helfer-parker-and-de-azevedo-hanks/

As a totally blind person who has never been married, who has had sexual relations with another person only once in his life, but who mastaurbates frequently, I am absolutely convinced that Mrs. Watson is wrong on all counts. She envisions a marriage bed where the pursuit of self-satisfaction and pleasure never comes into the equation, something that is very much outside the realm of what it really means to be human. Yes, you have to consider your partner's needs; but you should never downgrade or deny your own.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/03/2019 08:50AM by blindguy.

Holy ghost involved ? Would that then be a threesome ? This is just too kinky.

Actually, it is two guys (God and Jesus) using a third (Holy) to penetrate both Celestially martial participants thereby creating a true quorum of sexual activities.

Thank you for the belly laugh.

It sounds like a spiritual orgy!

"Elder Parley P. Pratt taught that the Holy Ghost has the ability to increase, enlarge, expand, and purify “all the natural passions and affections."

So sales of Viagra must be pretty low in Utah?

Gas, by its very nature, can enlarge and expand things....things like balloons and such.

But apparently the Holy Ghost gas also has disinfectant properties and can therefore purify what it also enlarges and expands. AFAIK, helium and other gases do not disinfect. So Holy Ghost gas is better and odor free.

Blindguy sees this issue much more clearly than Wendy.

Some people use somethings and others others. Unfortunately, Wendy has a public platform with which to promote her sexuality using religious aphrodisiacs.

I'm sure there are some useful religious relics out there that others find sexually exciting...

This is what I deduce from the gobbly goo that she dribbles - the princess is bat-**** crazy.

Absolutely creepy. She has "issues" is all I can say.


She's right about one thing: Worldly sex does not involve a ghost.

dagny Wrote:
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> Absolutely creepy. She has "issues" is all I can
> say.
>
>
> She's right about one thing: Worldly sex does not
> involve a ghost.

Ya think? Most groupies have issues but she managed to marry her rock star.

This from a woman who was like 131 years old before she ever got to first base.

She's against lust, but I find it really helps get the job done.

LMAO...yeah it really does.

Unless fantasy sex with the Holy Ghost counts, all bets are off.

Is she saying he can't get it up? She should keep quiet.

He was 84 when they got married. Let that sink in. EIGHTY-FUCKIN-FOUR!!! She was "only" 56, which is likely completely through menopause.

OK, those of us in the over-60 category know what that means. On both their parts. Yes, you can still have a good sex life, but not likely at that level of Mormonism. She has absolutely no possible clue what normal pre-geriatric sex entails. Yeah, they might sit in the bed and rub parts while quoting First Nephi or something and get their spiritual rocks off, but other people have raging hormones and there ain't no Holy Ghost in the mix.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/02/2019 02:14PM by lachesis.

Love it! Great reply.

>
> She has absolutely no possible clue
> what normal pre-geriatric sex entails.
>

I'd like to get Sheri Dew's frank appraisal of your assertion.


Also, I'd also like some clarification from anyone who has been doted with the requisite knowledge: Does Holy McGhost go down?

Does Holy McGhost say that oral is moral?

Does Holy McGhost get off on watching someone go cross-eyed from pure pleasure?

elderolddog Wrote:
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> I'd like to get Sheri Dew's frank appraisal of your assertion.

Hehehehehe. I wonder if Russ gets to watch when Sheri and Wendy play.

I stand corrected. He was only 82 when they got married. Soooo, ummmm, nothing. Just that I was mistaken.

Ha! Nothing like getting a lecture on sex from somebody who knows nothing about it. I know my mom thought Nelson marrying such a younger wife was weird. I remember her going,"Oh how nice. Elder Nelson found a trophy wife." My mom was a very liberal Mormon and she always viewed the brethren with suspicion.

There is a certain look on a face when someone isn't "getting any." And a certain fixation on making sure no one else gets any either.

Done & Done Wrote:
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> There is a certain look on a face when someone
> isn't "getting any." And a certain fixation on
> making sure no one else gets any either.

Misery loves company. I always figured some of the active Mormons hate us ExMormons because we have more freedom than they do and they are more miserable than we are. Ha! Some of the most miserable people I have ever seen are TBM's stuck in high callings.

Oh my gosh this is wonderfully amazing good stuff that proves beyond anything I have ever heard or seen written that the Church must be super true :) Her husband, the glorious super holy prophet Russell, is the chief micromanager of my sex life so its important that I listen and incorporate, without any question or doubt, all the amazing words from his beloved wife. Just curious in wanting to make sure. Don't all of you look to this mighty prophet as the chief micromanager of your sex lives? Thanks to the beloved Correlation program its how you are wired to think. Isn't this beloved gospel so amazing? I certainly stand all amazed. Time for me to go yell at all my unassimilated neighbors about this good news as I try to get them assimilated into following the Correlation program.

I forgot to invite the Holy Ghost into the room and was just interested in natural sex between a man and a woman.

Toronto Boy Wrote:
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> I forgot to invite the Holy Ghost into the room
> and was just interested in natural sex between a
> man and a woman.

I'm sure when your husband is over 80, you pray for an erection.

So for their tenth anniversary she got her husband some swingers? That would be one scary as hell key party.

The recipient places a small sacred blue tablet on his tongue and then is instructed to swallow. When the will of the Lord is manifested in the loins, The wife of the anointed one is called.

The officiator then says a prayer and confirms that the recipient's "calling and erection has been made sure."

Interesting fun-fact. The third anointing was first performed in the Tokyo temple.

If this had come out when I was a morgbot, I would have questioned this. As a formal member of the "Godhead", the holy ghostus is a "personage of spirit." There is no way in hell that this HG dude wants to be present during the Russ and Wendy show, my show, or anyone's s*x show. It defies even Mormon logic.. I mean come on Wendy. As a Mormon, I would have "No, this is stupid." Joseph Smith was banging every woman he could, of all ages...he was a freak. Mormons are so hung up on s*x...they're just weird.

It is the sin next to murder and the non-sin next to godhead.

"Wait! I think we're at the stage now where we should invite our invisible friend to come watch over us while we...you know...do that stuff and stuff.... How about you? Want to join me in asking for our invisible friend to come watch?"

"Uh...okay, I guess. Which invisible friend are you talking about?"

"Holy G. of course, you silly!"

"What? Your fantasy exchange student from China?"

"Not 'Ho Lee'. 'H-O-L-Y'. You're so silly!"

"I think I'll just go have a root beer and watch TV."

Wait. Does the ghost look like Patrick Swayze by any chance?

LOL!

I probably should note here that while researching this topic on the Internet, I discovered that Mrs. Watson Nelson had written a whole book on the subject (it's available through both Deseret and Amazon) and had given a similar speech back in 1999 long before she got involved with Russell Nelson. Unfortunately for Mrs. Watson Nelson, her ideas about sexual intimacy have absolutely nothing to do with the reality of sexual behavior as many of the responses clearly demonstrate.

She got this critic from another of her books.

"Larry Mauksch, reviewing the book in Families, Systems, and Health, commended the extensive literature review and approachable prose, but criticized the book's method of identifying and analyzing moments of change in therapy as unscientific."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wendy_Watson_Nelson

Perhaps she is an expert in spiritual orgasms, er organisms?

a family/marriage counselor and "therapist" (probably along lines substantially the same as Wendy's career.

His goal was to be hired by the Church (LDS Social Services).

Based on a number of conversations with him, I learned that a lot of what LDS "counselors" do is a blend of purely dogmatic religious approaches and some of the basics of psychological theory and standard counseling techniques taught in the type of courses that counselors/therapists typically get (probably just enough to qualify for licensing). But it sounded like the religious side of things was strongly emphasized: praying, reading the scriptures, advising couples to look to religious leaders and texts for guidance and so on.

As such, even though Wendy appears to have a solid academic background in the relevant subject matter, I expect that her actual approach to counseling and therapy was so churchified that spending time in sessions with her was probably essentially like spending time discussing personal problems with a Sunday School teacher who was also well-versed in the latest trends and buzzwords in the counseling/therapy field. Having no personal experience of her own in marriage and sex, I doubt that she could really understand and empathize with what the people she was counseling were going through.

Wally Prince Wrote:
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> Having no personal
> experience of her own in marriage and sex, I doubt
> that she could really understand and empathize
> with what the people she was counseling were going
> through.

Church filled in her gaps.

I thought Sheri filled and plugged her gaps...

about any marriage other than temple marriage was a fake marriage or fake relationship? I listened to it as I was driving home from Idaho. My daughter wanted to listen to conference and then promptly fell asleep. I was so furious, I told one of the men who told me to marry my gay ex what I thought.

I mean talk about a relationship being fake. Believe me, the relationship and the SEX with my straight boyfriend is a hell of a lot more REAL than my temple marriage sex.

I have a good idea.

Let's get marriage and sex advice from a person who was never married until her 60s and the only married to a guy in his 90s.

Oh and she probably lost rock paper scissors with Wendy as to who would marry Rusty.

Only Wendy Nelson could turn the HOLY Ghost into the HORNY Ghost.

LIKE

"Worldly sex" is sex.

It's the only real sex there is.

It's sexual activity compelled by drugs produced in the physical body. Sex is a drug reaction. Sexual activity is activity that results from impulses caused by the body's sex drugs.

Like other types of drugs, the sensations felt while under the influence of the body-produced sex drugs (sometimes called hormones) can be quite pleasant and addictions can be formed as a result. Unlike meth labs and cocaine labs that can be shut down, most reasonably healthy humans have sex drug labs inside their own bodies, so they can't really ever get completely away from the drugs, even if they are conditioned to feel very guilty and dirty every time they come down off one of those sex drug trips, having done things that in hindsight seem to them to be very dirty and animal-like.

Religious people in particular often feel especially "dirty" and "bad" and guilty whenever they've had an intense sex-drug experience. They don't like that feeling and wish that there could be something more wholesome and "clean" and "spiritual" to replace dirty sex while also being just as pleasurable, thrilling and exciting. In fact, much of religious life is actually indulgence in a fantasy that is designed to take the place of sex by providing equally or more compelling feelings of ecstasy and excitement--in a way (possibly a kind of "mind over matter" where the mind can get so far into a fantasy that it can get the body to release similarly intense drug effects (such as dopamine, etc.) that don't compel one to engage in activities that lead to a lot of sweaty grunting and wild-animal noises and...well...you get the picture.

The LDS Church fantasy was for the most part usually not compelling enough to compete with the sex drug, which is probably why the leaders were so quick to get into polygamy and all kinds of kinky stuff. (In particular, it wasn't enough for the leaders because the leaders were too intimately aware of the falsity of it all.)

But still there are some devout Mormons who can get into the LSD Church fantasy so intensely that they can indeed work themselves up into "spiritual" states of ecstasy and excitement that can compete, at least temporarily, with the sex drugs that their own bodies keep trying to push on them. These types are the types that you can see crying their heads off and getting goosebumps from a speech by a General Authority...even when the actual content of the speech is as ordinary and uninspiring as anything can be.

In short, the Church is a big cosplay program full of people hoping to replace "dirty" animal sex with "clean" spiritual/ religious fantasy. It usually doesn't work very well, but they keep trying, as Wendy's nonsense about "worldly sex" versus "Holy Ghost sex" would seem to indicate.

Wendy is kinky. She wants us to do the DP with Space Ghost.

Holy the Ghost is a voyeur?

mikemitchell Wrote:
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> Holy the Ghost is a voyeur?

He is in the Nelson household. I thought Sting was weird talking about tantric sex but Wendy takes the cake.

after that night when they were...well...you know...and just when everything seemed to be going in the right direction, Wendy screamed out "Oh...oh...my HOLY GHOST! My Holy Holy Ghost!!".

That's when Nelson realized that HE was the third wheel in the relationship.

He was so jealous that he wanted to take down and smash all of the framed portraits of the Holy Ghost in the Church Office Building...but the Holy Ghost is invisible, so there were no framed portraits, and that just intensified Nelson's frustration and rage.

But he started feeling better after he got some balloons and started popping them--telling himself that at least a part of "Gas Boy" (Nelson's pejorative new nickname for the Holy Ghost) had to be in some of those balloons.

Wendy will ultimately prove to be a PR nightmare for TSCC. People outside of the Morg view her ramblings as cultish and totally out of touch with reality.

The FSM is either totally out to lunch with the big 15 or the big 15 is not listening. Maybe Russ is sleeping too soundly at night to receive the idiotic ramblings.

While the Morg will be around for a long time in some form, they have reached the tipping point of a slow decline. The big 15 have no idea how to stop the decline. They are content to travel the world, speak at conference every 6 months to the believers and wait for the rapidly approaching embrace of death.

This Wendy Nelson talk is creepy. I might have thought it was an April Fool's joke or something.

Also, I thought the Mormon Church was mainstreaming. This stuff is NOT going to help.

The two people involved in intimacy are sufficient. Their love for each other is sufficient. Lust is a part of it. Even trying to think about all this other HG stuff will make the people feel so worried or guilty about being holy enough, the whole experience will suck.

It seems the point she is really making is that even in marriage you aren't supposed to have a good sex life.