I didn’t get a chance to reply to Beth’s comments on the Black Lives Matter thread by Human, here:
https://www.exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,2329881,2329881#msg-2329881Background (on Human’s thread):
Re the shooting of Jacob Blake:
azsteve:
> He didn't seem to have a clue about his duty to cooperate with his own arrest whether he thought it was fair or not.
Lot’s Wife:
>There is no such duty, not in a constitutional republic.
My response:
> Cooperation may save your life though. Otherwise they can seem to have an excuse to use deadly force. Live now, argue the point later?
Beth replied:
>The operative word you wrote is "may"
>This is an excerpt from an opinion piece written by Radley Balko entitled, "White people can compartmentalize police brutality. Black people don’t have the luxury." I think it helps explain how POC view the police vs. how white people view the police based on personal experience.
>"According to a 2015 YouGov/Huffington Post poll, 74 percent of black parents had cautioned their children to be cautious around police, versus 32 percent of white parents. A 2016 Pew poll found that 7 in 10 white people thought police usually use the right amount of force, versus just 1 in 3 black people. A 2017 Pew poll asked police officers if the high-profile police killings of black people were isolated incidents or part of a more systemic problem. More than 7 in 10 white officers said these were isolated incidents, while nearly 6 in 10 black officers said they were signs of a broader problem.
<snip>
>"Perhaps the most revealing survey of all is a YouGov poll last year that found that black people were more worried about being a victim of police violence than being a victim of violent crime.
>"When white people see video of unjust police abuse of a white person, it may make us angry, sad or uncomfortable, but most of us don’t see ourselves in the position of the person in the video. If we’re polite and respectful, we think, and don’t put ourselves in scenarios that lead to confrontations with police officers, there’s little chance that we’ll ever end up like Daniel Shaver. When black people see video of Officer Derek Chauvin kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, their reaction is much more likely to be that could have been me — or my son, or friend or brother."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/05/29/heres-why-we-dont-see-protests-when-police-unjustly-kill-white-people/My reply to Beth: I appreciate your explanations for those of us who aren’t totally au courant with the salient issues. It’s embarrassing to me now to admit that I only very recently comprehended the concept of ‘white privilege’ in such a way as to feel I now do understand it, a bit late in the day. I think it’s human nature, in many cases, to feel that one’s own experience and outlook on the world is the common view or even the common take on things. Um, no. For instance, I’ve always loved and respected our Mounties (RCMP) in Canada. Thought they had a sterling reputation and an admirable history. In the past few years numerous female RCMP members disclosed their experiences of systemic sexism and other abuses, including one well known female spokesperson who detailed numerous personal incidents that caused her great anguish and cut short her sterling and promising career. It was a terrible shock to me as the force enjoyed a great image and widespread public trust and I felt warm towards it, loving their musical ride and other public events. But common to many historically paternalistic organizations there was trouble in the ranks. Of course, there are numerous examples of people and businesses and organizations falling from grace, with religious groups and leaders among them. Sadly, we’re getting used to these occurrences now.
In terms of racism, again I have been slow to focus more of my attention on the issues. However, with the ongoing blatant incidents lately the focus is now laser-sharp and, of course, it’s way past time.
A niece and nephew of mine are mixed-race, their father being Jamaican, my sister being White. I had never thought much about my sister’s kids’ mixed heritage (their father is not in the picture). When my niece recently referred to herself as Black, without thinking I blurted out “You’re not Black”. I was thinking that she is half-White and if she only claims being Black then she is dissing half of her heritage and that bothered me. But I soon realized that however she identifies that is her right and I apologized soon after for my forceful (and likely very offensive) comment that “You’re not Black”.
Some of us have to be led slowly and we often take only tiny steps. That was, in fact, the incident in my own sphere that got me to sit up and take much more notice of all the related issues. I felt ignorant and ashamed to be so clueless. And certainly, there are so many examples lately of systemic racism that there is plenty of material to work with if we want to become better informed about the issues. I’m focused on learning about the various points of view from the under-represented, often un-heard and misinterpreted people who know best about the realities of the problem of rampant racism as they live it in their daily lives. For some of us it’s more of an academic exercise. I’m sorry – I know that can seem extraordinarily cold and uneducated. At least I have finally learned that it’s not about my interpretation of things but about how they are experienced by those who live the realities of the situation in both our countries still in 2020, sadly.
I had seen new neighbours last weekend moving into the apartment building where my sister and niece live. I was driving my niece home the other night after we’d had dinner out and she saw them outside lolling around on the stairway in the sunshine. My niece waved and called hello to them as she opened my car door to get out. They answered back in a friendly fashion. My niece turned to me and said, all excited, “That is the first time I have ever seen Black people sitting on our stoop in my whole life.” Her comment made me tear up. I felt very sad to hear her have to say such a thing and to know it was such an issue in her life.
I have never been super-conscious of race in my life – I haven’t had to be due to a mere accident of birth in being born White.
Being White, in my experience, has meant never having to think about my skin colour. Only 3.5% of the entire Canadian population is Black (2016 census). Here in BC I live in a sea of White. I have lived around two towns that have small Indigenous populations (Indigenous groups make up 5% of BC’s mix).
Wiki defines us as follows:
“British Columbia has a very diverse ethnic population. First-generation immigrants from the British Isles remain a strong component of local society despite limitations on immigration from Britain since the ending of special status for British subjects in the 1960s. Also present in large numbers relative to other cities in Canada (except Toronto), and also present in BC ever since the province was first settled (unlike Toronto), are many European ethnicities of the first and second generation, notably Germans, Ukrainians, Scandinavians, Yugoslavs and Italians; third-generation Europeans are generally of mixed lineage, and traditionally intermarried with other ethnic groups more than in any other Canadian province.
“In recent decades, the proportion of those of Chinese and Indian ethnicity has risen sharply, though still outnumbered by the historically-strong population of those of German ancestry. Visible minorities have become an important factor in ethnic-based politics, though most visible minorities are less numerous than the long-standing non-British European ethnicities making up BC's "invisible minorities".”
On the list of ethnicities in BC the top five are English, Canadian, Scottish, Irish and German, making up nearly 96% of the population. Metis is 1.98%. First Nations (Aboriginal) is 4.83%. American is 1.71%. (Stats are from 2016. I’m not sure exactly what “Canadian” means in this context).
Back to police: I have volunteered for two local city police forces. I enjoyed it immensely, learned amazing things, made good friends (although one of them got me into Mormonism but fortunately for me I exited myself fairly quickly without too much lasting damage) and generally found it to be a thoroughly worthwhile and life-defining experience. Never once did I witness any questionable behaviour by any officer (but as above, we don’t have any known significant issues of racism in the the city where I live. Perhaps, as I see now, this is due to our ethnic mix here and not because we are paragons of virtue after all).
Apart from this volunteer experience, as a civilian I did encounter a sexist officer at work once who was giving the women there a presentation on personal safety, including the topic of rape. Bizzarely, he did it in a most unfortunate and sexist way. I sent in a written complaint to his department and they subsequently interviewed me and, amazingly, implemented every suggestion I had for improvement plus making an abject apology. So even there, it turned out to be a positive experience for me – that despite being on the timid side I wasn’t afraid to speak up to police and that I was listened to and changes were made. (For one, that officer lost his position in that realm although didn’t suffer any formal discipline as far as I know – that was fine with me. It was the acknowledgement of error and the willingness to change that smoothed things over).
Again, Beth, you said:
>"When white people see video of unjust police abuse of a white person, it may make us angry, sad or uncomfortable, but most of us don’t see ourselves in the position of the person in the video. If we’re polite and respectful, we think, and don’t put ourselves in scenarios that lead to confrontations with police officers, there’s little chance that we’ll ever end up like Daniel Shaver. When black people see video of Officer Derek Chauvin kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, their reaction is much more likely to be that could have been me — or my son, or friend or brother."
This is a most incredibly enlightening paragraph. I wish it didn’t have to be so, for all sides. This is absolutely how it is in my life and experience. Especially since my stint at the two police departments where I met so many solid people. I have never felt apprehensive with police, even when being stopped for sobriety checks or speeding or for other checks. When it’s an emergency (accident, etc) they are a reassuring presence and always most helpful. I do not fear the officers and it has always been a positive experience to interact with them (that one incident above the glaring exception but it wasn’t deadly or even close). It’s very easy to assume that all citizens have the same positive experiences. It’s difficult for many of us to even imagine that police could be a cause of fear just by their mere presence.
But now I get it. And it’s scary and sad and intolerable.
And I’m sorry that it’s so.
Back to Human’s thread: “Re: Black Lives Matter “
Beth:
“+1
“Say their names.”
Indeed.