This is in a handwritten letter that’s going on her pillow tonight. I know that she might be sad, but she won’t shun me. I’m her firstborn child and she relies on me for a lot of shit, like babysitting. Hopefully this is my pathway to getting out of going to seminary and church meetings.

To Mom:
So for a while, I’ve had to keep a really important realization all to myself—and I think that telling someone that I can trust would be a great thing to do.
I don’t believe in a personal God. And I don’t believe that the LDS Church, or even any religion is the right one that will guide me to salvation.
I believe that the only thing I can truly 100% rely on in life is myself, and my gut feeling.
I’ve always tried to make myself feel the Spirit, but I feel that I’ve only truly, 100% felt it was in times that I was expected to, like in baptism or priesthood blessings.
I don’t want to be affiliated with the Church, if possible. If you force me to, I will go to church, but I would rather not—as there’s no benefit in associating myself with something that I do not believe. Especially with seminary, it’s a waste of my time, I’d feel.
And, yes. I have prayed about this, listened to my gut feeling, and looked at the facts that I’ve found—and the facts have held that the Church isn’t true.
Now, I know that you’re probably sad and extremely disappointed.
I am your son. And I know that you love me, no matter what.
So please accept me for what I am.
A son of the world, and most importantly your son. I will ALWAYS conduct myself in a Christlike way regardless of my belief in the Atonement of Christ—because Christ is an amazing example regardless if the scriptures are true or not.
I’m worried that if I were to tell dad he would react badly. I know that it would break his heart, even more than yours probably is now. So, please, somehow help for me to be accepted by him.
Dieter F. Uchtdorf, who you believe is a prophet of God said in the October 2013 general conference in his talk Come, Join with Us:
“It may break our hearts when their journey takes them away from the Church we love and the truth we have found, but we honor their right to worship Almighty God according to the dictates of their own conscience, just as we claim that privilege for ourselves.”
In order to feel most comfortable with myself, I have to journey away from the Church. I have to find my own truth. I have doubted my doubts—or rather tried to. But even doing that did not help me. Even Jesus would respect me. He served all.
So all I ask of you is to accept me for who I am and to respect me.
I still love you, no matter what.
-Misty

Jesus is Santa for grown ups. But it’s his elves that worry me.

I’m saying that I’ll be like Jesus because they can relate to it, but yeah, that’s how it is! I’ll update how it goes tomorrow...

bradley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Jesus is Santa for grown ups. But it’s his elves
> that worry me.

Who are the equivalent of the elves? The 12 guys who followed him? I doubt that there were 12 guys. There was probably more but the Bible tends to want to hit the magical number of 12.

~~~~iceman9090

The quorum of the 12, basically self appointed. Don’t some of them look like elves? They also have extra magical powers. Yup, the church actually teaches that.

those old guys have zero powers. You can write that down.

Misty, think about this. Your mom has been taught that nothing is worse than failure in the home (meaning a child goes "astray"). She will blame herself for doing something wrong. She will feel like a failure.

If you must do this, include gratitude to her for raising you to think for yourself. Tell her this is the greatest gift she can give you. Being mentally independent is something she should be proud you possess.

If it is possible to fade away slowly, sometimes it is less painful. Some decide it is better to rip off the Band-Aid and let the chips fall. Good luck!

Excellent advice, here Misty.

Good luck if you do this. Be sure.

I wrote some more to her, about that.
It really is great advice, that I do think will help a lot.

Be prepared for the only things they know to do in this situation.

Your parents will probably insist you talk to some bishop or stake president to answer your questions. Somehow they think this will assuage your doubts. If this happens, let us know. You have a few ways to handle that kind of situation such as explaining you don't value faith as a way to verify facts.

Also your parents will probably insist you read the BoM (eye roll), fast and pray until you see things their way. They will keep doing annoying stuff to convince you to believe. At some point you will have to set boundaries.

This is a good place to get suggestions about how people have handled being in a situation similar to yours.

Good luck.

dagny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Be prepared for the only things they know to do in
> this situation.
>
> Your parents will probably insist you talk to some
> bishop or stake president to answer your
> questions. Somehow they think this will assuage
> your doubts. If this happens, let us know. You
> have a few ways to handle that kind of situation
> such as explaining you don't value faith as a way
> to verify facts.
>
> Also your parents will probably insist you read
> the BoM (eye roll), fast and pray until you see
> things their way. They will keep doing annoying
> stuff to convince you to believe. At some point
> you will have to set boundaries.
>
> This is a good place to get suggestions about how
> people have handled being in a situation similar
> to yours.
>
> Good luck.


I really hope this won’t happen...but I will get help from you guys, in the case it does

Trust your gut always. I think your gut feeling was given by christ himself. I know a lot of people here do not believe in the new testament christ but despite religion being incorrect I have not written off the christ figure completely. The medical field can only help so much when it comes to healing yhe trauma i went through so vhrist literally is my only hope to be healed all the way.

The warriors await you outside the religious world.

Adam the warrior Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Trust your gut always. I think your gut feeling
> was given by christ himself. I know a lot of
> people here do not believe in the new testament
> christ but despite religion being incorrect I have
> not written off the christ figure completely. The
> medical field can only help so much when it comes
> to healing yhe trauma i went through so vhrist
> literally is my only hope to be healed all the
> way.
>
> The warriors await you outside the religious
> world.

I’m not too sure about Jesus at this point—however I do know that from my limited Bible reading he preached acceptance and love. Although I won’t be religious, I’ll aim to be my best, just as how Christ did, too.

Thats good enough for me. And if its good enough for me then its definitely good enough for Christ I am pretty sure.

Also, don't let anyone tell you have to do a zillion rituals and sing a zillion hymns or say a zillion prayers and pay a zillion dollars for Christ to accept you.

Sorry about the zillion but you get the point. It felt like i did a zillion of all those.

Misty(14M) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

“I’m her firstborn child and she relies on me for a lot of shit, like babysitting.”

==Hopefully, she and the rest of your family won’t turn your back on you.
Family is quite important.

“I don’t believe in a personal God. And I don’t believe that the LDS Church, or even any religion is the right one that will guide me to salvation.”

==I am of the same opinion.
When 1 person claims to be in communication with a god and starts acting as a leader, the skeptic alarm goes off. Most likely that person is delusional or has some kind of mental illness.

As opposed to when 5, 10, 100 people can see the same chair, then it is safe to say that chair exists in our reality.

“I’ve always tried to make myself feel the Spirit”

==I don’t know much about mormonism.
I guess “feeling the spirit” is something that you are told to do. Burning in the bossom.

We can’t determine how reality functions with wishy washy feelings. I can’t show up in court and say “I feel that guy is the killer.” There are some things that we have to take seriously. We have to take reality seriously.
Emotions are great but they have their limitation.

“And, yes. I have prayed about this, listened to my gut feeling”

==Gut feelings are great but it is sometimes best to think with your mind.
I don’t know too many scientific papers written with “I have a gut feeling”. You get in the lab or go out there and make observations.

Anyway, if you have family problems, consider the people here as your family.
I would be happy to help you in the science and logic department.

Don’t ever limit yourself. Learn more and more.

~~~~iceman9090

iceman9090 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Misty(14M) Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> “I’m her firstborn child and she relies on me
> for a lot of shit, like babysitting.”
>
> ==Hopefully, she and the rest of your family
> won’t turn your back on you.
> Family is quite important.
I assume she won’t however I have no way of telling the future.
> “I don’t believe in a personal God. And I
> don’t believe that the LDS Church, or even any
> religion is the right one that will guide me to
> salvation.”
>
> ==I am of the same opinion.
> When 1 person claims to be in communication with a
> god and starts acting as a leader, the skeptic
> alarm goes off. Most likely that person is
> delusional or has some kind of mental illness.
>
> As opposed to when 5, 10, 100 people can see the
> same chair, then it is safe to say that chair
> exists in our reality.
>
> “I’ve always tried to make myself feel the
> Spirit”
>
> ==I don’t know much about mormonism.
> I guess “feeling the spirit” is something that
> you are told to do. Burning in the bossom.
>
> We can’t determine how reality functions with
> wishy washy feelings. I can’t show up in court
> and say “I feel that guy is the killer.” There
> are some things that we have to take seriously. We
> have to take reality seriously.
> Emotions are great but they have their
> limitation.
>
> “And, yes. I have prayed about this, listened to
> my gut feeling”
>
> ==Gut feelings are great but it is sometimes best
> to think with your mind.
> I don’t know too many scientific papers written
> with “I have a gut feeling”. You get in the
> lab or go out there and make observations.
Well, it was more of a formality afterwards, because once the evidence showed itself...I knew.
> Anyway, if you have family problems, consider the
> people here as your family.
> I would be happy to help you in the science and
> logic department.
I’ll certainly do that. Thank you.
> Don’t ever limit yourself. Learn more and more.
>
> ~~~~iceman9090

Right, I made myself an actual account now.

Religion is for people who are afraid of going to Hell. Spirituality is for people who have already been there. I didn’t give up God when I left Mormonism, I just gave up organized religion. There’s a very diverse world of spiritual practices. Things don’t have to be the Mormon way. They can be your way. Spiritual practices are very useful for a meaningful life.

I wouldn’t go back to Mormonism because it’s unhealthy. It doesn’t make you a better person. So anyway, good luck. It’s probably better than walking on egg shells.

Do they still sing this hymn in church? "Free agency" has been downgraded to "agency" by proto-fascist tools like Bednar, but the church used to teach actual freedom of choice, even if unevenly applied.

"Know this, that ev’ry soul is free
To choose his life and what he’ll be;
For this eternal truth is giv’n:
That God will force no man to heav’n."

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/music/text/hymns/know-this-that-every-soul-is-free?lang=eng

Today I actually did realize that because I felt shame for making choices that I wanted to (as a TBM), the freedom so treasured by Mormons is an illusion. Only the word of the Prophets are absolute, and even then it’s changed.

They do love their chains. If you outsource your morality, you don’t have it. You have obedience, North Korea style. It is shameful the way they weaponize guilt. Yet they feel no guilt about their culty beliefs. To me that means they’re completely unqualified to pass judgment on you.

You know best how your parents will react. I hope this works out for you. I agree with Dagny that it would be best to express appreciation for the good job that your mom did raising you.

I was about your age when I decided that the Catholic church and I had irrevocably parted ways. My mom was sad about it, but coped reasonably well. Ironically, IMO that was the beginning of her own falling away from the church. She never lost her faith nor her spirituality, but she no longer felt the need to express it solely within the confines of a church building.

I went on a long spiritual journey after that. I read widely, took high school and college courses on comparative religions, and visited various faith communities. I don't think I ever saw myself as a joiner, just someone who was trying to figure things out.

And for right now, I just live. I no longer worry about finding the answers. What will be, will be.

Apologies about posting outside links, but holy shit, I did it!


https://old.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/k05vwc/that_went_better_than_i_had_expected/

I think that's as good, and loving of a response as you could have hoped for. I think it's not unreasonable of your parents to want you to continue the church program as long as you are still a minor and living at home. I also think it's reasonable for them to request that you not disrespect their church to them or the ward. I would ask them how they want you to handle priesthood interviews.

Please remember one thing. If the bishop ever asks you an inappropriate question (i.e. do you masturbate,) you do not need to answer. Or, you can simply state that it is not a problem. It is your right to have a parent sit in on any bishop interview, and I advise you to do that.

lovely letter

Hope it helps

Stick to your guns
Don't give in

Don't go to church
It's not only "not true"
It's evil

I wonder if the letter would be more effective and brought about greater and more expedient change if it were worded more like this...

Dear Mom,

In an attempt to clear my mind of religious confusion, I retired to a grove of trees near by to kneel in humble prayer.

I saw a pillar of light exactly over my head, above the brightness of the sun, which descended gradually until it fell upon me. When the light rested upon me, I heard a voice say, get online and go to www.cesletter.org, read, ponder, and resign.

Amen!

I wonder too.

At least it would give them a place to start to think/ see/ learn / understand [the truth of] Mormonism... and perhaps give them an IDEA you are Serious, or Funny... but either way °•¤•°

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.

People have to appreciate ALL PEOPLE have (their own) POWER, Connections, Visions... to a greater or lesser degree... and they must mind their own business while I mind mine.

I've got ONE LIFE to live and I don't want to - AND Nobody Else Can either - mess it up.

I'LL live my own life from day one to day last. AND I will not fast. That's past.

An angel told it so...

A little birdie told me so...

I told myself so....

I'm telling you...

I read mom’s response on Reddit.

She didn’t reject you. That’s good.

She also didn’t allow you your autonomy to think for yourself and act accordingly.

But that’s not something she can allow you or deny you. You get to make that choice yourself.

When you’re ready and able, you’ll find a way to assert yourself with her and the rest of your family and start openly living your religious life in accordance to what you truly believe.

Good luck.