As a money maker the church was not that great until cash tithing. As a money manager the church wasn’t that great until an Eldon Tanner was brought in. Then the church made money and grew money.

As a religious institution the church was more successful in the earlier part of its history. Joseph Smith and Brigham Young grew the church in extremely hard circumstances and created a foundation to grow the church more worldwide. Excitement slowed but growth continued as long as America was perceived around the world to be this wonderful magical place.

Once the reputation of the US started to wain due to questionable wars and government corruption the interest in a uniquely American religion wained. Also add in social changes and the LDS Church becomes extremely dated in a world of secularism, UFO fantasies and New Age dreamers.

Was it really that hard or were they just lucky with timing? They got to migrate to a huge area that was undeveloped with little regulation. They basically owned most of the businesses in Utah from the start. They lucked out and were able to form a little theocracy where they made the laws, controlled the people and most information that reached them. They managed to encourage huge families with unsustainable numbers of offspring.

A lot of these factors are not tenable now.

They managed to shift to running their own universities. This helped them get seemingly endless businessmen to help build the business and legal backbone of the church.

I'd say they were successful in becoming a giant business. They were successful like a parasite is successful in many ways. The actual teachings were made up, amateurish and regressive (like most religious dogma), but the business aspect of the organization won out. People care less and less about the history or what was taught, just like other religions. It seems to me the "success" of religion is the quest to get real estate, money and power. The best ones can even make their own country. The people are led along and happy to help it happen.

Luck played a big part. But the church leaders and members were extremely tenacious. There’s a lot to say for not quitting and working the problem. Maybe what will finally deflate the church is the leaders and members have become soft. Brigham Young himself said when the saints become comfortable that’s when they will fail. I think he was right.

I think the church was a success in the (roughly) 1960s through 1980s. It always had only a niche appeal, but it had a positive image in the U.S. and abroad. It lost its luster at some point. I don't think that people view it very positively anymore.

I think the church rode the coat tails of the United States. The US had a great reputation after World War II and with the rebuilding of Japan and Europe, the post war economic boom and American pop culture, the US was the place to measure up to. Anything American sold well and that included Mormonism.

After the fall of the Soviet Union the US started to decline. The military/intelligence complex started new conflicts to justify its existence. War profiteers extended conflicts to make money. Paranoia was used to clamp down on freedoms. The politics continued to degrade and get more corrupt. Entertainment became propaganda.

Not much to look up to anymore and most the world wants to be left the hell alone. Yankee go home! No we don’t want you dumb religion!

summer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think the church was a success in the (roughly)
> 1960s through 1980s. It always had only a niche
> appeal, but it had a positive image in the U.S.
> and abroad. It lost its luster at some point. I
> don't think that people view it very positively
> anymore.

I couldn't agree more. They had a great PR machine kicking out those "feel good" messages- people helping neighbors, looking out for others, doing right when it was unpopular. I was a missionary getting media referrals from running TV ads. The church was getting 10-15 per week; which requested a free sappy VHS tape with a pair of elders/sisters to explain why they needed Mormonism to feel joy :D

And they had everyone paying tithing- even some back tithing to score a temple recommend.

The church did very well for 25 -30 years.

U'd think that financial & other disclosure would make ChurchCo more attractive to others & a few members, but that's never been the case and probably will never happen.

Some members like to think they are affiliated with the wealth of the church. Mormons like bright shiny things. Just look at the temples. It was exciting when the first McDonald’s came to town. The third one isn’t so exciting. The same with temples. That special feeling goes away.

The church for my family was basically the family recreation center. The most important part of the church was the basketball court. It as the same for my wife’s family.

I would say the church recreation was more important than the church part. We kind of pretended to be religious but we drank, smoked and fucked and played church basketball.