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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: November 15, 2022 02:58PM

I found this magazine article interesting:

Dr. Gabor Maté: Go ahead, blame your childhood:

https://www.macleans.ca/the-interview/gabor-mate-go-ahead-blame-your-childhood/

“[Dr.] Gabor Maté has had an unusual life. Long before his rise to ubiquity as a medical maverick—and a darling of the podcast circuit—Maté left Hungary for Canada with his Holocaust-survivor parents in 1956, and later spent more than a decade working as an addictions specialist on Vancouver’s Downtown Eastside [DTES].”

(Google: “DTES is the site of a complex set of social issues including disproportionately high levels of drug use, homelessness, poverty, crime, mental illness and sex work.”)


I’ve known of Dr. Maté forever. I did not realize his family background, that his parents were Holocaust survivors. That would obviously definitely impact them greatly for the rest of their lives as well as seeping into the next generation/s.

Dr. Maté worked for years in an area that is known as one of Canada’s “poorest postal codes”, if not the poorest at some points. That environment and the overwhelming social needs would definitely have had a major impact on him in addition to that of his other work and his family background.

In the article, the doctor says: “We use the word “trauma” quite a lot, but often inappropriately—like, “I had a fight with my partner and I was traumatized,” or, “I saw a movie and it was traumatic.” No. It was just sad or painful. On the other hand, we don’t see how ubiquitous and deeply impactful trauma is in the greater scheme of things.”

He goes on: “The term [trauma] itself comes from a Greek word for “wound.” What’s the nature of a wound? First of all, when you touch one, it really hurts. Wounds can be physical, but in this context, we’re talking psychological. These kinds of injuries ultimately lead to a disconnect from yourself.”

Dr.: “I remember coming home from a speaking trip, and my wife wasn’t at the airport to pick me up. That triggered in me a deep embodied memory of my mother giving me to a stranger when I was 11 months old. All of a sudden, this hurt of abandonment got kicked up. People who are traumatized tend to be stuck in very childlike reactions. So I reacted to my wife like I was an 11-month-old baby.”


It’s difficult to imagine such an early childhood memory – 11 months? That is an amazing example of how deeply embedded traumatic events can be. This is what made me think of exmos when I was reading the above article. To live in a closed or semi-closed environment from birth through youth, at least, and to be taught “absolute truths” that deeply affect one's growing-up and future years and then to eventually discard them as questionable, at best, could fit the definition of indeed being traumatic. We can see that by how long it can take for an exmo to travel through their individual exmo journey, to put things into perspective, and to forge their way forward via their own free choices at last. Still, out of the blue a memory, a commitment, a family matter, a rite of passage, a loss can all trigger negative reactions that are difficult to process.


Dr. Maté: “Scientific literature is clear that trauma contributes to physical ailments. A Canadian study showed that men who are sexually abused as children have triple the rate of heart attacks—and not because they smoke or drink. In this country, about half of the women who are in jail are Indigenous, even though Indigenous people make up just five per cent of the population. There’s an epidemic of children being diagnosed with learning disorders and behavioural problems. Trauma also shows up in people’s hatred. So yes, from my perspective, it shows up everywhere.”


I took note of this article first because of the doctor’s family background, having parents who survived the Holocaust. I think of the sad fact that if they had not survived then, of course, Dr. Maté would not exist. And multiply that by the millions of victims who did die and all the subsequent unborn generations in those families as well as all the talent and gifts of which the world was tragically deprived. And what the doctor said about his own experience of trauma from very early childhood.


Too, his description of men who are sexually abused as children that grow up to have heart attacks in greater than average numbers made me think of discussions here about unreported or underreported sexual abuse in the Mormon church (and many others, as we sadly know) as well as posters here who have experienced such abuse. The crimes are multiplied ten-thousandfold by their lingering negative effects.



Dr. Maté: “The fact that we can’t see each other’s humanity is, to me, a manifestation of social trauma. It’s a cause of it as well.”

Seeing one another’s humanity – what a concept. If we could manage it, more widely and more often, what amazing positive change could result for the good of us all and for our planet as well. But to date, this goal seems beyond human reach. We definitely have an entrenched fight gene and we literally don’t all speak the same language. Unfortunate, as beneath the surface most of us have much in common.


I wish the article had been longer, and in more depth, but I will buy Dr. Maté’s book. The title itself also pertains to Mormonism, as well as many other environments:

‘The Myth of Normal: Trauma, Illness and Healing in a Toxic Culture’. The subject is described as “how unhealthy the West’s medical system, and even its pop-cultural pursuits, really are.”

I definitely agree that the demands and expectations on medical staff, especially in traumatic times such as the recent, and ongoing, pandemic, could easily lead many practitioners into stress overload, exhaustion and long term PTSD.

The myth of normal – hmmm – gives you a lot to ponder. I think, indeed, there are a lot of things they/we’ve got wrong. Maybe life is an eternal struggle towards attaining equality and peace. That goal can prove exhausting because likely we never quite get there. At least in my experience so far. Naively, I used to think we could do so. That is likely why as a young teen I was an easy mark for the JWs as they preached the paradise regained theme non-stop, a vision that can be very appealing. But the trick is to stay within the realms of reality and also to keep paradise as paradise, not messing it up with bland repetition and empty promises.

The main question that finally penetrated my little grey cells was do I want to do this (door-knocking, preaching the end of the world) for the rest of my life. The answer was easy. Big. Fat. No.

And here we all still are. :)

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: November 15, 2022 03:17PM

Some abuse victims myself included become experts at adherence to what others consider normal. I was telling a coworker about my family and past in the most candid way and felt like I was talking about a friend, not myself.

The dissociation is strong and the Mormon church is all about appearance and adaptation to what is considered normal. Their ideal of family is fantastic. Fictional ideals is their currency.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: November 15, 2022 08:37PM

I thought of you, EB, as soon as I read some of the comments in the article.

I think the trauma associated with negative childhood experiences (the last phrase is a massive understatement, I realize) is often vastly under-quantified and all too often not even discerned or too easily dismissed. Too, it takes a lot of work on the part of the abused person to try and come to terms with what has happened to them, if that is even possible.

Too, the magnitude of the trauma and its lasting effects, bleeding into one's entire future, is easily vastly unknown by all too many.

In particular, I have contempt for those who cover it up and/or deny it, in particular for our purposes on this board, for those church officials who know about abusers and don't stop them, dooming even more vulnerable kids/members/others to being victimized. That should be more widely seen as the egregious crime that it is.

Where is the prophet on this? Dumb question?

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: November 16, 2022 02:27PM

Nightingale Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dumb question?

Yes. Deaf, dumb, and blind.

We are so acclimated to a world of abusers and abuses that it doesn't exist.

Here is where God is lost. Where is the prophet to the world of generational abuse? Genealogy is just the taking of names after the asses are kicked down into the ground.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: November 15, 2022 03:27PM

I joyfully played hooky as a 6 year old second grader and I’ve never experienced homesickness.

I’m not sure what these mean but I bet I’m correct in believing that I’m “different”.

I blame television . . . Specifically The Howdy Doody Show: “Washdae”.

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Posted by: anybody ( )
Date: November 15, 2022 06:50PM


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Posted by: Done & Done ( )
Date: November 15, 2022 06:52PM

You mean you really were normal?

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: November 15, 2022 08:21PM

Oh, that's a low blow!!

If you ever said that to me, I'd cry...

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Posted by: Done & Done ( )
Date: November 16, 2022 04:23PM

Trust me. You're in no danger whatsoever.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: November 16, 2022 05:03PM

I trust you implicitly, impractically and impressively...and any other 'im...ly' word, except impossibly.

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Posted by: anybody ( )
Date: November 16, 2022 03:08PM


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Posted by: Human ( )
Date: November 16, 2022 09:30AM

Chris Hedges, who knows trauma intimately as a former war correspondent and as a University teacher in a prison, had a good interview with Gabor Maté about his new book:

https://scheerpost.com/2022/10/16/the-chris-hedges-report-dr-gabor-mate-on-trauma-addiction-and-illness-under-capitalism/

Recovery relevant snippet:

GOBOR MATÉ: Am I going to be authentic and be rejected by my parents, or should I reject myself and be accepted by my parents? Well, the tragic tension invariably gets resolved in favor of attachment, and a person adaptively suppresses their authenticity, but then that becomes a lifelong paradigm and we live out of a false sense of self. We don’t know what we feel, we dare not ask for help. We dare not say no at the demands of the world, and that makes us sick. So that’s what the tragic tension is. And a lot of people, when they get sick, they actually learn to be themselves. And when they do, not just as documented by myself but by others as well, there’s a much better chance for health.



For a broader view of Gabor here he is with his journalist son Aaron Maté and the legendary rocker/humanitarian Roger Waters:

https://thegrayzone.com/2021/05/22/roger-waters-gabor-mate-israels-apartheid-wars/

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Posted by: GNPE ( )
Date: November 16, 2022 03:04PM

there are no substitutes for caring, loving parents, sibs, & extended family, & neighbors; Love & Loving are absolutely irreplaceable today as they were before.


the social successes of some compared to-with the hatred, crime, & hurting around us shouldn't/ Can't be denied.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/16/2022 09:17PM by GNPE.

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