Utah plastic surgeon injected kids with saline instead of COVID vaccine as part of anti-vaxxer scam.
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https://www.sltrib.com/news/2023/01/19/utah-plastic-surgeon-gave-kids/

All because that pompous ridiculous toasted fool conned religious fundies that he was chosen by God.

Here's a non-paywalled article:

https://www.ksl.com/article/50560529/utah-plastic-surgeon-sold-covid-19-vax-cards-but-threw-away-the-vaccine-feds-say

I think he, along with any licensed co-conspirators, should lose their medical licenses.

Agreed

At least they were aware that children have not yet been trained to be reliable liars, They got fake shots.

I expect some jail time and medical license lifting.

Brother Of Jerry Wrote:
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> ...
> I expect some jail time and medical license
> lifting...

At the very least, I hope. Also fines. Also COVID infections. Oh wait. They probably took the vaccination; I mean why be stupid?

There's a lot of irony here.

He's a plastic surgeon who in some cases probably fixed malformations and the like, but he also probably provided many unnecessary surgeries and procedures so that his patients could improve their appearance. But when it came to real medicine, he basically encouraged his patients to be fearful of it.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1016342778

I don't understand this at all.

Is this some kind of Mormon thing I haven't heard of before?

It's anti-vaxxer nonsense, Tevai.

Tevai Wrote:
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> https://www.democraticunderground.com/1016342778
>
> I don't understand this at all.
>
> Is this some kind of Mormon thing I haven't heard
> of before?


Fundy Xtians, Mormons, etc. who only listen to Faux News and distrust and ignore all other media were lured into the COVID-19 anti-vaxx disinformation madness. Mandatory vaccinations for school kids and jobs led people to get fake vaccine certificates so they could falsely claim they were vaccinated when they were not.


"It's librul commie mind control! They're trying to genetically alter your brain so you'll like gay people and stop eating meat! My cousin's sister's husband told my brother-in-law that it was all a hoax! Everyone 'knows' all you have to do is drink powdered silver and bleach!" ya ya ya



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2023 02:16PM by anybody.

Maybe the MD governing medical board (Remember, this is Utah-) will determine that 'he's a good man' & let him off regardless of medical-ethical considerations...

Not like this hasn't happened before, 'eh?

I hope the physician doesn't get let off without significant consequences.

To me this is medical malpractice of the highest order. He lied to patients and parents about medical treatment he was (supposedly) administering. He deprived kids of protection against a virulent organism, thereby potentially harming them and all those who came into contact with them. He messed up their medical history/vaccination record by confirming administration of a vax they did not actually receive. He subjected kids to an injection (often traumatic for children) that did them no good at all.

It's appalling behaviour.

Too, I would question his medical credentials as he is so obviously incapable of comprehending the basic facts and principles of medicine.

What if he doesn't "believe in" the MMR/etc vaccines and administers his saline special to all the children under his care? Not only is the child at risk of contracting these childhood diseases but there can be devastating consequences if the child's mother, say, happens to be pregnant. The 'R' in MMR stands for rubella/German measles. If a pregnant woman contracts rubella it can cause a miscarriage, stillbirth or serious birth defects such as congenital deafness.

Mumps (one of the 'M's in MMR vax) carries potential complications such as viral meningitis, pancreatitis, and (thankfully rarely) encephalitis as well as hearing loss - hopefully temporary.

Measles (the other 'M' in MMR) can cause infection of ear, lung, upper airway and brain.

I understand the overwhelming desire of parents to protect their children. For instance, nobody wants to see them getting jabbed and crying in response. But it's the best choice in the circumstances in order to protect them from the many diseases to which humans are subject that can cause any of the side effects mentioned above and more, as well as death in some cases.

Given this reality, it's beyond the pale for a medical practitioner to take it upon themselves, unlawfully and unethically, to LIE to them about the health of their precious children.

Throw the book at physicians such as this I say. A big book. And if it hurts, well, they asked for it. That old canard rises up about doctors thinking they're God. They are *not* all-seeing, all-knowing, all-powerful.

Sure, ask questions. Have doubts. Formulate your conclusions as you will. But don't deceive people based on your personal private opinions or political stances - especially the latter, please God. Especially if you're practising medicine you have a duty of care. That distinctly most definitely does not include lying to your patients.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2023 03:50PM by Nightingale.

This thought came upon me while perusing this thread:

If you were in a conversation with D&D and his Secondly Anointed brother, and you described this Utah plastic surgeon,

RM, AP
BYU grad
former bishop
current Stake President
refused to believe in Covid-19
tried to fool medical authorities


...with each bullet point, the gap would widen between their estimations of the man's character.

You could chose up sides for a spirited game of whatever using this "he's a jerk v. he's a hero" choice.

The people he sold cards to weren’t lied to. They were in on the fraud. I think they should be at least charged and fined.

If their employers required vaccination, they might not be too pleased to find out they were lied to, either.

Oh, I missed that point. I thought he made that decision on his own and was not informing the parents. I should have read the news account instead of making assumptions.

But why would the parents agree to their kids getting injected at all if the MD could have just given them the fake certificates without an unnecessary shot?

My points still stand about any MD who would lie to parents and kids about the treatment being rendered.

Because they were afraid their kids would bland and say they never got a shot. A reasonable fear. Hence the fake shot. The parents all knew exactly what the score was.

We have our own kook doctors in Idaho too. This one called the vaccine "needle rape," discouraged masks, and prescribed the vet meds. This is what happens when political views become so strong they override the actual data from their own profession.
He's getting sued by some patients from Washington.

https://www.boisestatepublicradio.org/health/2023-01-19/treasure-valley-doctor-ryan-cole-faces-disciplinary-sanctions-over-covid-patient-care-violations

I'm guessing he's not Mormon, based on where he lives. I think Idaho might top Utah in anti vac rhetoric. This guy was a board member of something for cripes sake.

Think how people with fake vaccinations jeopardized others through their travels and misinformation. It's beyond selfish of them.

Why should Utahns trust the government? The government made them give up polygamy.

The weird thing is that I find it hard to believe that many Utah employers required a Covid vaccination. So why would Utah residents feel the need for a card? I do realize that hospitals normally require their employees to be vaccinated, along with the military, but it's not just the Covid vaccine, it's all normal vaccinations.

My employer required it, but employees who asked for a religious exemption were granted it without much fuss.

My guess is that it was probably mostly for travel. I live in Utah and you're right that Covid vaccinations really weren't required much here.

caffiend Wrote:
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> There's certainly been lots of rumors and stories
> circulating. With the "where's there smoke,
> there's fire" approach, there must be some truth
> to this.

"Rumours and stories" do not guarantee facts - in fact, they sow doubt or uncertainty and prompt reasonably intelligent, open-minded people to check them out along with the sources from which they emanate in order to determine reality from disinformation.

One million people can spread smoke while one lone soul can share fact. The one million do not trump the one in that instance.

Wiktionary helps out with the smoke/fire concept:

"If there is a hint of something occurring it could indeed be true, but such rumors should be taken with a grain of salt."

"If there is a hint of something occurring it could indeed be true, but rumors should be handled with skepticism."

I guess the trick is to realize that an idea or statement is a rumour, not fact, or smoke blown about haphazardly to forward a personal agenda.

I find that the best approach is to first check the source and second check the source's source and then access a separate source to double and triple check the information. Depending on how much value one places on seeking truth, finding facts, confirming information and making personal choices based on all available reliable information.

It never hurts to try and see the bigger picture and to consider how one's personal choices may affect the choices and rights of others. Eg: In the midst of a pandemic, hopefully the majority of people would honour the collective responsibility to do what they can to avoid killing fellow citizens by their own uninformed and self-first choices.


> As for myself, I'm happy to report I've suffered
> no side effects from any of the "safe and
> effective" vaccines--or saline, for that matter.

I note you put "safe and effective" in quotes. A subtle but not invisible anti-vax stance.

To be clear, I believe you've said you haven't had any vaccine. So "no side effects". Millions of people have had the vax without significant side effects occurring while conveying a good measure of protection. That's millions who have vastly decreased their chances of contracting a potentially deadly virus. That has the added bonus of helping to protect others who come into contact with them and so on in a widening circle.

I may have mentioned some of this previously. /s

> Millions of
> people have had the vax without significant side
> effects occurring while conveying a good measure
> of protection. That's millions who have vastly
> decreased their chances of contracting a
> potentially deadly virus. That has the added bonus
> of helping to protect others who come into contact
> with them and so on in a widening circle.

I concur with all of that. I just wish I hadn't had this uncontrollable urge to buy Microsoft products. . .

I had some rather strong, but temporary side effects from the Covid vaccine. Those side effects were a preview of what contracting Covid unvaccinated would have been like for me. No thank you. I'll gladly take the vaccine.

The thing is, new vaccines are constantly in development. Right now Pfizer is testing a new mRNA flu vaccine. What are the anti-vaxxers going to do? Go without a flu shot? How about the pneumonia and shingles vaccines? I saw two people get shingles within the past year, and it was nasty for them.

There is also a RSV vaccine expected to be approved sometime this winter. That has been long sought after and much wanted, tending to kill infants and old people.

Candidate vaccines for Lyme disease, malaria, and AIDS, though it was just announced that the AIDS vaccine failed to qualify. There are a couple of other potential vaccines in the pipeline, but I don’t remember the diseases.

There is an expectation that there could be a vaccine that would work against all corona viruses. Also it is possible that we may be able to custom make one off vaccines to fight one person’s specific cancer case. Wonder how the anti-vaxxers would react to that?

The COVID vaccine will work on the ACE site rather than the spike protein, which is more susceptible to viral variants.

As for anti-vaxxers, there will be a small number who don’t get the memo and refuse to get their kids vaccinated and consequently pay the stupid tax. But most will just get back to business as usual, seeking standard medical treatment rather than risking their ad their families’ health.

Never underestimate the capacity for humans to live with their own appalling hypocrisy and irresponsibility. Stay tuned for Episode Two: the House that Kevin Built.

>> As for anti-vaxxers, there will be a small number who don’t get the memo and refuse to get their kids vaccinated and consequently pay the stupid tax. But most will just get back to business as usual, seeking standard medical treatment rather than risking their and their families’ health.

From what nurses have been saying (I lurk on a nurse's forum,) the families bring their loved one to the hospital when things go south, and then double-down on the stupid. They yell, scream at, and threaten the nurses and other providers when those providers are not able to administer their folk remedy of choice, ie. Ivermectin. They loudly assert that they will not have their loved one vaccinated, even though hospitals do not give vaccines to patients (and as the nurses point out, their loved one is too far gone for a vaccine to work, anyway.) In cases where the nurses have been unable to save their loved one, the nurses have been followed to their cars and threatened at the end of shift, to the point where some hospitals have had to provide escorts to them.

Brother Of Jerry Wrote:
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> There is also a RSV vaccine expected to be
> approved sometime this winter. That has been long
> sought after and much wanted, tending to kill
> infants and old people.


I did a double take here. Took me a sec to realize it's the RSV that tends to kill. But yeah, I'm 100% in favour of vaccines. Absolutely.

Science rocks.

My editor was out sick today. :-/

Ah yes, but Nightingale treated you to a "u" in "favour."

Nuttin' but class, that one!

Whaut aun honour!

Somewhere a woman named Dourothy is cursing in badly accented Spanish as she spins in her grave.

What a gaudy night!

Ghaud help us one and all!

>> There is also a RSV vaccine expected to be approved sometime this winter.

That's really exciting! RSV has been a huge problem in central Maryland this winter. Along with other viral illnesses, it's put hospitals at 90-100% of capacity.

I looked at the UM Medical School website. They are currently one of the hosts for the malaria vaccine study, and also shingella, and a pediatric nasal spray flu vaccine. So many countries will be grateful for an effective malaria vaccine.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/23/2023 08:17AM by summer.