Does anyone know Professor Thomas W Mackay who taught humanities/ancient languages at BYU in the 70's and 80's? He was a Nibley knockoff. Does anyone know why he was removed from working directly with students? Any knowledge on Thomas W Mackay would be greatly appreciated.

I'd also be very interested in knowing more about Tom. He was a favorite teacher of mine who changed my whole life through his enthusiastic teaching. I got the impression in the late '80s that he might have had a bit of a relationship with a student. I also know that his Mormon faith was shaky in some areas at least. I wonder if he's still alive (2015) and how his life has been.

Altar Boy Wrote:
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> Does anyone know Professor Thomas W Mackay who
> taught humanities/ancient languages at BYU in the
> 70's and 80's? He was a Nibley knockoff. Does
> anyone know why he was removed from working
> directly with students? Any knowledge on Thomas W
> Mackay would be greatly appreciated.

Hello.

We do not know each other.

I went to school with Tom Mackay in Southern California, and knew him some. His father Wendell Mackay was a lawyer.

At least in high school, he had a fairly strong sense of ego. I did not know him in his later life and he may have changed in some ways.

He was reasonably good playing the piano, and was proud of this.

What was the meaning of your post? I did not get ___ "knockoff"

Can you share what you do know?

I didn't know him, but found this from 2008.

http://www.walkersanderson.com/obituaries/Rosemary-Tyler-Mackay/Payson-UT/1397076

Here you go:
http://www.whitepages.com/name/Thomas-W-Mackay/St-George-UT/4sjt3wd

Wow, I'm really late to this party, and I don't have much in common with exmos either. I ran across this from a didymus thread elsewhere on the web (Prof. Mackay was interested in one of didymus' fragments BYU got hold of). I knew Prof. Mackay during much of his tenure at BYU. "Nibley knock-off" is a bit malignant, but I guess that's par for the course with exmos, right? He was a student of Nibley as an undergrad and was no doubt influenced, as so many students were. He went on to very decent grad school (Stanford), however, so you need to have done better to make that kind of snarky comment. If you want to be snarky, go for the similarities between him and Wilfred Griggs. At BYU he was indeed full of himself, and there were rumors that he was casual with female students, but those may have been jealous rumors because he was an attractive man. And there was a Hall of fame for nasty rumors in that Classics dept. The truth about his departure was that he pissed off the wrong colleague and said some things about another younger colleague that were untrue. There was proof of what he said and he got canned--more properly, exiled--for it. I think they kept him on the payroll and maybe gave him a few things to do, but his presence was no longer allowed in his former department and he was not allowed to teach. By that time he wasn't really teaching much anyway, so no loss to anyone. At one time he had a lot of promise, but teaching Greek at BYU might drive anyone insane, so I'm not judging....

>>"Nibley knock-off" is a bit malignant, but I guess that's par for the course with exmos, right?...so you need to have done better to make that kind of snarky comment.

And you snarked right back at exmos, Mr. Peter Penishood, so I suppose that makes you no better.

summer Wrote:
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> >>"Nibley knock-off" is a bit malignant, but I
> guess that's par for the course with exmos,
> right?...so you need to have done better to make
> that kind of snarky comment.
>
> And you snarked right back at exmos, Mr. Peter
> Penishood, so I suppose that makes you no better.

You might want to read the rest of the post, it's actually interesting what s/he says.

I did. Didymus makes some good points apart from his inflated sense of righteousness about what was a very casual opinion.

"Peter Penishood"...I rest my case. Thanks for the reveal.

Would you prefer, "blowhard?"

I knew Tom Mackay when we were both LDS missionaries in the French East Mission back in 1962. He was an outstanding missionary, I also heard rumors about problems in the Classics department at BYU, but never learned the details. Many years later I saw him at a mission reunion and he was with his second wife whom he married after his first wife died.They were preparing to go on a mission together, so if he ever had doubts about the church, they were resolved.

Having now consumed this short but fascinating thread, and especially the last entry, I immediately concluded, with zero need for any additional facts or other such ugly things, that Bro. MacKay was dumped by his first wife when his behaviour (I'm laying back and thinking of England as I type this post) caused her to lose her will to live, and then subsequently finding a rich mormon widow and deciding to pretend for all he was worth because of all she was worth.




I don't know how I live with myself...

I was a student of Tom's 50 years ago, shortly after his return from an extended study period at the Vatican, and became close to him and his family. Because I kicked against the pricks who ran dress code enforcement in the BYU administration, he would advise me when I needed to cut my hair and, in fact, would have me come to the house (escorted by him in his small and clunky car that seemed too small for his long limbs and great height) where he would do the honors with his kids running around and Rosemary, his lovely wife, preparing dinner to which I was welcomed after the shearing. I loved the man and still do. His arrogance was apparent, but I suppose I had a similar affliction. He did not suffer fools gladly, but students with promise he showered with attention. The incident at BYU that led to his shunning might have been related to his objection to a particular Latin teacher (who was concurrently working on a PhD in classics at University of Utah) that he thought unqualified, but I can't say for sure.

Tom was charismatic in the classroom, so much so that he changed the course of my own academic career and the lives and careers of many others. He would often arrive late and begin talking even as he strode towards the blackboard. He would sometimes ponder over questions asked of him, or ideas that occurred to him, by pacing back and forth, a nubby piece of chalk in his hand, until suddenly he would freeze in his tracks, smile as an answer dawned, then suddenly throw the chalk into a wastebasket across the room. This was his reaction to the lightbulb going off.

In later years, whenever I passed through Provo, I would visit him in his semi-exilic office where he would share his latest work on the Didymus the Blind fragment or the Venerable Bede, another of his interests and areas of expertise. I always wondered what kept him in Provo, in the Mormon fold, and at BYU. It still escapes me. His fall from grace was apparent, but he wouldn't explain it or even admit it, but would brush my questions off lightly as nothing worth discussing. The Classics department at BYU for decades seethed with mutual envy and toxic disrespect. Tom probably contributed to it but in the end was himself a fatality.

The note by "Didymus" that speaks of a divorce and second, wealthy wife seems to be mistaken. According to Rosemary's obituary she died in 2008 while she and Tom were serving a "family history" mission in Tahiti (Tom's French was perfect). Whether he married again after his bereavement at the age of 68 I don't know. He seems to be living now in Saint George at the age of 84. I hope his health has held and his wit. The size of the house makes me think he might have one of his 7 children living with him with a brood of grandkids. Best to him.

For Rosemary's obituary: https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/deseretnews/name/rosemary-mackay-obituary?id=28656770

Hi Sinandi,

Someone posting by the screen name R. Stone, not me (Didymus) mentioned his marriages. Just to make that clear.

I enjoyed your recollections and was happy to learn that Dr. Mackay influenced you so positively. He was a character, to say the least. I was undecided at the time whether his whimsical nature (which you describe very well) was genuine or overly affected. I only had two classes from him and thought he acted like *he* thought he was rather bright, but he may have just been quirky. At least one other faculty member, who suffered a similar fate, hated him and tried to influence students to a similar hatred. I never heard Dr. Mackay lower himself to that kind of unprofessional talk, but he may not have been kind to that other faculty member...I don't know. Both he and Griggs (whom I referenced above) both went to decent grad programs, and both ended up in dead-end careers at BYU with little to show for it, especially in terms of publications.

Dr. Mackay had some great kids--at least one whom I met later and really liked. He went to Dartmouth and even played ball there I think.

Anyway, glad you had a good experience with him.

D

Thanks for your detailed account.