Thanks for the link. I don't necessarily doubt the study, but I do wonder what percentage of abuse is reported or if we even know. If the number is small, the results of any study of the beliefs of the perpetrators could be skewed. At any rate, I think it is likely that conservative religions like the Morg have a higher number of abuse, but my point was that anecdotal evidence isn't all that convincing. Just because you and several people you know were molested by a guy who was Mormon doesn't mean that Mormonism was a big factor or that a high percentage of Mormons are abusers. Maybe and maybe not. Post hoc ergo propter hoc is a logical fallacy and we hear it a lot on this board.

topper

Getting good numbers is hard and I'd feel a lot better with that kind of data. It isn't easy to find! I did find a table of sex offenders as a percentage of the population by state and Utah was higher than average but there were other states just as high. That isn't even conclusive because sex offenders are not necessarily released to the location where they offended. What I would say based on the studies, the lack of background checks, and a tendency in the Mormon Church to not report to law enforcement is there is elevated risk in Mormonism and it pays to be aware and to take steps to prevent abuse. One simple step mentioned on the board frequently is not to permit invasive interviews alone with bishops. While a particular bishop may not have ill intent, the process itself sets up kids to be victimized.

I agree anecdotal evidence isn't conclusive, but it isn't meaningless, either. It demonstrates that *something* is happening. I worked in a community-based program with a group of about a dozen sex offenders--10 men and 2 women. With the exception of two or three, the members were religious conservatives. One man whose wife was chronically ill and didn't have sex with him molested his daughter because that wouldn't be the same as adultery. My opinion is that in addition to that rationale his religious upbringing prevented him from developing the sexual maturity to risk rejection by an adult woman. A therapist from Washington State whom I met and spoke with worked with dozens of sex offenders and told me a good half of them were Mormon men. That could be simply demographics, but it might also point to something.

I've never agreed with simple statements about sexual or physical abuse that they occur in all social levels because it leaves the impression that there are not risk factors and causes (however poorly we understand them). It leaves the impression (at least to me) that abuse is random, and that is just not true. If it were random, we should stop the educational efforts because there is little we can do. On the other hand, if we can identify some risk factors, we can stay a little safer.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/30/2011 04:04PM by robertb.

Thank. I agree with that.Mormons do not check people out and that is troubling along with the fact that unqualified people are in leadership positions..



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/30/2011 03:49PM by bona dea.

I also don't have a problem with saying abuse exists everywhere[it does] so long as people realize that there are red flags that everyone should look for. Some people and institutions are more dangerous than others.Parents need to check out any organization or people that their kids associate with and be on the lookout for anything suspicious.If an organization doesn't do background checks and have qualifed people in charge, that is a big issue for me.

As with probably all anecdotal evidence, you can find nearly the exact same thing with other groups if you look hard enough.

That said, living in Utah I was puzzled by the neighborhood reaction to TBM's with good "callings" getting accused. I saw it on the news many times, but one in Lehi and one in SLC stand out. In the SLC one, a bishop was accused. He came up with a totally crazy excuse, and everyone turned on the victim and her family.

He was accused of inappropriate touching of one of the Young Women at the church during an activity. Her version was he grabbed her and played with her boobs. His version was that she was trying to get a cart through a door, and it was tight, so he came up behind her and put his arms around her to help her pull the cart through the door! Pulling on her body, to help transfer more energy to the cart?

The whole neighborhood turned on the victim, apparently bought the Bishop's story, and it all went away as I recall. The Lehi story was very similar, the neighborhood turning on the victim to protect the status ward member.

One part of the problem is "wards" and high concentration of members. That ties neighbors together in a strange way that doesn't happen elsewhere. It makes people act as a unit with a common goal for bad effect in these instances.

In another location, the neighbors wouldn't all go to church together and would have no motivation to protect the abuser as a group. They'd act more like individuals. As individuals, rather than ward members, they would not be as likely to give a damn about what position the abuser held in whatever church he went to, and would be more protective.

DNA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As with probably all anecdotal evidence, you can
> find nearly the exact same thing with other groups
> if you look hard enough.
>
> That said, living in Utah I was puzzled by the
> neighborhood reaction to TBM's with good
> "callings" getting accused. I saw it on the news
> many times, but one in Lehi and one in SLC stand
> out. In the SLC one, a bishop was accused. He came
> up with a totally crazy excuse, and everyone
> turned on the victim and her family.

There is the idea that a good Mormon wouldn't do such a thing
>
> He was accused of inappropriate touching of one of
> the Young Women at the church during an activity.
> Her version was he grabbed her and played with her
> boobs. His version was that she was trying to get
> a cart through a door, and it was tight, so he
> came up behind her and put his arms around her to
> help her pull the cart through the door! Pulling
> on her body, to help transfer more energy to the
> cart?
>
> The whole neighborhood turned on the victim,
> apparently bought the Bishop's story, and it all
> went away as I recall. The Lehi story was very
> similar, the neighborhood turning on the victim to
> protect the status ward member.
>
> One part of the problem is "wards" and high
> concentration of members. That ties neighbors
> together in a strange way that doesn't happen
> elsewhere. It makes people act as a unit with a
> common goal for bad effect in these instances.
>
> In another location, the neighbors wouldn't all go
> to church together and would have no motivation to
> protect the abuser as a group. They'd act more
> like individuals. As individuals, rather than ward
> members, they would not be as likely to give a
> damn about what position the abuser held in
> whatever church he went to, and would be more
> protective.