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Posted by: mightybuffalo ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 02:03PM

this week.

Do you think this is because of the potential calling that the bishop was considering giving to me? (financial clerk or something like that-- check out my previous thread for the details on how I found out).

I've basically decided to accept the calling and play the part with my head down till April. What if this meeting is something else? Thoughts, suggestions?

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Posted by: angela ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 02:06PM

If I recall correctly, it could very well have something do to with the calling.

If questions come up about "where you are at spiritually" I think you can de-escalate and deflect it honestly by talking about how stressed you are about med school and all that comes with that.

April really is only weeks away.

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Posted by: deja vue ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 02:15PM

Jesus wants you for a Sun Beam... Put Smiley stickers over your eyes. Bow your head and say Yes. Bite your lips - tear up - grovel - kiss A$$.

Return and report if you can do so without giving too much info.

Maybe wait til May to do the reporting ?

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Posted by: paisley70 ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 02:20PM

My position hasn't changed about the advice that I gave you in the previous thread. They have no special powers of discernment and you do not have to talk. Pretend you are overwhelmed with school. Tell them your faith is intact. Then keep your mouth shut.

They are not on a witchhunt. The meeting with the SP would only be calling related. A worthiness interview. The bishop would be dealing with you and it would never escalate to the SP unless you confessed to some heinous sin. Which is not the case. Occam's Razor bro.

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 02:43PM

Hope it is a calling and an easy one at that. Let him know your time and energy are limited because of your heavy school work load.

If he asks you about your testimony or beliefs, you'll have to play dumb. "I don't think that's an issue. I can't imagine where you got such an idea. Perhaps I was talking to someone who misinterpreted what I said or they caught me when I was overly tired and over worked. That's why I don't want to extend myself on callings. It makes it too hard to stay strong."

Nonsense like the above might appease whoever confronts you.

Good luck.

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Posted by: nli for the weekend ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 05:30PM

LOL. Gaslighting. Perfect.

OP, you only have to put on the act for a few months. My only warning is not to jump the gun.

WAIT until your degree is officially conferred AND notated on your *official* transcript. Only then are you forever free & clear from their clutches. Obtain multiple copies of your degreed transcript from the university.

After all that has been completed, you can set up a meeting with the SP. Make it at least a week in advance, and don't shave in the interim. His expression when you walk in with a beard will be priceless. Then you can have the satisfaction of informing him that you were a non-believer all that time, and rub it in by laughing at his non-existent power of discernment.

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Posted by: pollythinks ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 02:51PM

I don't want to worry you, "mightybuffalo", but.....

I got a call to meet with my Stk. Pres.to meet with him in his office the next day. As well as his being my superior in the Stake, we were personal friends. I though he was going to promote me to a Stake calling.

To my surprise, it was to tell me I would be excommunicated if I didn't commit, in writing, to not share the results of my study on the priesthood, and to met with him reg. this.

Happily, he worded the question as "Not presenting my study as current church doctrine", which I was happy to oblige, and I signed a paper to this regard.

The thing was, I had written a paper derived from the church's own standard works, which proved that Peter, James, and John did not, themselves,'give' the priesthood to J.Smith--because they, themselves, did not have it to give to anyone--except, finally, when he and Oliver Cowdery, ordained each other as 'elders'.

That is, Jesus' 12 faithful companions were 'apostles' of Jesus, and aside from this (earlier than Jesus), Aaron and his tribe was the only tribe allowed to hold this 'honor' (to be priests), per his brother Moses appointing him as such.

Not only that, but the title "Melchizedek", stands for "King of Righteousness"---of which there can only be one--which is Jesus. (So all the LDS men 'ordained' to this pd, do not qualify for this position--as they are not Jesus. It is impossible for them to be THE "King of Righteousness").

I hope I wrote this well enough to be understood (it gets kind of complicated).

Good luck, MB.
P

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Posted by: pollythinks ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 03:16PM

I want to correct this statement I wrote: "I got a call to meet with my Stk. Pres.to meet with him in his office the next day."

Actually, he called me out of my Ward Sacrament Mtg., and told me I was to meet with him within a hour or two at his Stake Office.
----

The church doesn't like to allow it's picked-on members to have time enough, or know why this request is made, so that the chosen person has no time to present a defense, were this necessary. I not only had to face the stake twelve, but the whole stake presidency, and then, later, the S.P again for a private 'show-down'.)

During such a session, someone in the group is chosen to be the victim's advocate--but who, among them, would dare to counter the Stake President, himself?

So, I requested that I at least could had a witness, on my side, to attend. This request was approved, if he (my son), would sit on the sideline, and not say anything.
----

Also, as it turned out, Packer was the one who notified my Stake President--by the service of a middle-man--that I was to undergo this trial. And, by so doing, Packer ignored the church rule that only a bishop could send me (the problem child), for a Stake court hearing. Not only did the bishop not do this, but he was kept ignorant of the whole dirty business.
----

Courage, M.B. The Church doesn't play fair in such matters.
P.

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Posted by: cl2notloggedin ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 03:57PM

If I have a chance to ask my ex about how his callings to be financial clerk went, I'll let you know what he says. He was financial clerk several times and then ex. sec.

I'm going to actually bet it has to do with your nonbelief. I hate to say that, but I don't trust these bastards.

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Posted by: Not logged in ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 04:25PM

Buff

Act as innocent as you can. Stake callings do not require THE SP to be involved personally. Some interviews can be handled by other presidency members.
1. Act anxious to accept a calling. “Experience I can take East and prepare to serve there...”
2. Deflect any direct questions about doubts...”I have been educated at this university to probe, ask questions and investigate...the gospel has withstood all my questions. What questions did you have at my age??”
3. Express gratitude for your wife and allegiance to her. He can’t argue with that.

Return and report

Gatorman

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 05:14PM

It's a trap !

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 05:16PM

If the meeting starts with, "Well, Mighty Buffalo, what do you have to say for yourself..." it means that he's going to be prepared to counter any advice I, or any of the others, give you.

But they are so gosh darned busy, it's hard for me to believe that they can keep up with all the apostasy that goes on under their very noses. Like when they, BYU, was hunting the Gays...They thought because they caught a few that they had a handle on the situation. They didn't.

I've been out a long time, but don't they usually offer the calling, subject to final approval? Were you formally offered the position and accede? Because if not, it just doesn't ring true that you'd be processed by the SP without the assurance that you were going to accept.

Now then, this advice is universal: When the questioning and accusations start, keep your mouth shut. Sure, your wife showed them all the Might Buffalo threads and posts here, but you don't admit a thing! Don't say around, don't even deny it. Look them straight in the eye and "clavase el pico" (nail your beak shut), except to profess that you have a testimony of the church and know that Joseph Smith was a prophet.

The act of having doubts is not actionable, but preaching your doubts to faithful members is. You've never done that, and you never, never, never would.

Now me, I'd cry. Other men love it when they think they've made you cry... But be aware, if you do, you'll be in the bishopric by the first of March.

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Posted by: Not logged in ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 05:45PM

Buff

If it proves true your wife has shared her thoughts, your posts here and your comments it might prove prudent to walk out....

Silence cannot be misquoted.

Gatorman

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Posted by: Goldros ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 07:33PM

I also believe your wife talked. All sorts of things are probably running through her head now. Pretend. Pretend. Pretend. It's almost middle of February. It'll go fast and you'll graduate. Don't mess it up.

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Posted by: angela ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 07:35PM

Fast yes.

If one thinks about it, MB has about 9 weeks. And they want to make him a financial clerk?

For *9* weeks

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Posted by: uglyties ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 08:09PM

In the mid 90's, I was called to be executive secretary for a NoCal ward. I was mildly active at the time, and that was their way of trying to reactivate me. I recall meeting with somebody from the Stake Presidency for that calling. Probably similar for your calling.

Just keep your shit together and everything will be fine. As others have noted, just play the role. You know the lines. If you're asked questions about your testimony or missing church, just say you've been overloaded and just needed a moment to catch your breath. You can do this -- you've been doing it your whole life!

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Posted by: caffiend ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 09:09PM

N.B. I am not an ex-mo, so what do I know? At the risk of inducing (hopefully unnecessary) anxiety, think of the worst possible questions so you have your responses set.

1) (Eyeball to eyeball) "Brother Buffalo, do you have a testimony that the church is true and that Joseph Smith was a true prophet?" That might be tough to to answer with generalized, evasive ambiguity. "Why would you think that?" may be insufficient, and lead to something like,

2) "Your wife tells us you have lost your testimony. Have you?"
2-A) (Your problem is now horribly compounded.)
2-B) Any chance your wife accessed RfM or other sites you've visited? Have you been careful with your cache history?

3) "I have no choice but to forward this information to the appropriate dean at BYU."

4) You may be called to something important, and the bishop brought in the heavyweight (Stake President) to augment the pressure.

5) Think of other problem questions, and try not to answer on the cuff.

Hope #4 is the worst possibility that shows up.

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Posted by: Rameumptom ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 10:36PM

Say to the SP: "I've been studying and getting strength from Elder Uchdorf's conference talk, about doubting doubt before doubting faith. I'm applying this talk to me life."

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2013/10/come-join-with-us?lang=eng

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Posted by: tumwater ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 10:54PM

1) "Brother Buffalo, do you have a testimony that the church is true and that Joseph Smith was a true prophet?"

BB I do believe now and always have believed that the church is true and that Joesph Smith was a prophet just as President Nelson is now my prophet.

2) "Your wife tells us you have lost your testimony. Have you?"
BB. I have not lost my testimony, I might not have expressed or demonstrated as much lately. The pressure of school, my studies have taken a toll on everything. I'm sure my wife feels I don't devote as much time with her as she would. I'm having a rough time giving appropriate time and effort to all the things that are my priorities, I.e., Church, family, school, friends.

3) "I have no choice but to forward this information to the appropriate dean at BYU.

BB. ???

4) You may be called to something important, and the bishop brought in the heavyweight (Stake President) to augment the pressure.

BB If a calling is offered, I will try my best to be as successful as possible to fulfill the duties.

5) Think of other problem questions, and try not to answer on the cuff.

BB, lie like you did when you got the priesthood.

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Posted by: cl2 ( )
Date: February 11, 2018 11:30PM

but doesn't remember if he did for financial clerk, but I'd assume you do. When do you meet with the SP?

So your wife knows you post here???? I would hope not.

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Posted by: JustHangingOn@57 ( )
Date: February 12, 2018 12:04AM

I dont want to alarm you, but Every time I've been issued a call by a member of the SP they've also requested my wife be there also. Makes me suspect that it it not a calling.

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Posted by: cl2 ( )
Date: February 12, 2018 03:23PM

but if they did, I would have said no. I said no to all bishopric or sp meetings after I got married. I only got one new TR and I did have a few callings, but they were actually sometimes done by the person over the organization like YW. The YW president called me.

But my ex had to tell the bishop many times that NO she won't come in and talk to you.

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Posted by: Pooped ( )
Date: February 12, 2018 02:05AM

Is your temple recommend current? Have you been paying your tithing? Is your bishop a real zealot about the church? Has your wife told you everything she said to your bishop?

It could be almost anything. I very much doubt he's going to threaten excommunication/BYU sanctions unless there is something you haven't told us.

This thread reminds me of a conversation I had awhile back with an old boyfriend. He was married with a couple of kids and was talking to me about all the things that bothered him about TSCC. I was almost out at that time but not quite. I just listened without saying anything about my belief that Mormonism was a crock. After he had told me everything he ended his admission with, "I've thought this out carefully and decided that it just wouldn't be worth it for me to leave the church." I haven't seen him since and have no idea if he ever changed his mind about leaving but that one sentence might be what you could use if your Stake President is on the war path to beat you into submission or if your wife is asking your ward/stake leaders to influence you. You'll just have to wing it depending on what the SP has to say.

I'm betting, however, he just wants to interview you for a calling. Not all bishops and stake presidents are total control freaks. And they may be just as eager for the semester to end so they don't have to get embroiled in a big family dispute over your testimony. They are probably more than happy to let your future, after April, church leaders take that on. There's just not a whole lot of time left to go through all the disciplinary steps to reel you back into the fold using threats, meetings, etc. I'll bet they'd like to look good on their reports by letting you leave the ward in good standing. Just a guess.

Let us know what transpires. We're all rooting for you to get a "get out of jail free" card until April and graduation.

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Posted by: Elyse ( )
Date: February 12, 2018 12:15PM

Boy, I don't know.
There may be a number of people over you in the church who would take delight in watching you fail at this time over your lack of testimony.

Backpedal as much as you can and get your degree in hand.
After that, you can give Mormonism the finger.

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Posted by: BrightAqua ( )
Date: February 12, 2018 03:45PM


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Posted by: corallus ( )
Date: February 12, 2018 07:36PM

Ward clerks - financial, membership or "the" ward clerk are not typically called by a member of the stake presidency. Usually the call comes through the ward's assigned high councilor.

I suppose that could be it but it would be unusual.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: February 12, 2018 07:43PM

Okay, the lack of a response may indicate that MB has come to his senses and shored up his testimony, just like we all advised him to. It was the right thing to do! Church comes first, then fun and games

Yes, he was a bit confused and concerned, but I hope he's done the right thing and returned to the bosom of the church, just as no doubt all of us will, too, in time, since it is the Truth and all the available facts support that view. It's just that we've either been offended and are busy sinning. But in time...

And if MB tries to come back here in May and tell us stuff, obviously we will NOT listen to him because we know the church is true.

I say this in Joseph Smith's name, amen.

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Posted by: Elyse ( )
Date: February 12, 2018 09:31PM

If his wife ratted him out, though, he may want to look for a divorce attorney in a couple of months.

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Posted by: Goldros ( )
Date: February 13, 2018 12:07PM

Any updates?

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Posted by: moremany ( )
Date: February 14, 2018 04:10PM

Goldros Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Any updates?

M@t

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Posted by: angela ( )
Date: February 14, 2018 05:25PM

moremany Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Goldros Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Any updates?
>
> M@t


He did mention how the meeting has been postponed in the thread he started "GREAT NEWS"...

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