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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 01:07PM

I don't know anything about him, but I want to make mention of him in the new book I'm writing. Do anyone of you have family lore or stories about him? Was he a pleasant person like David O. McKay or was he dour and dictatorial? Did he do any good for members or for the organization. Did he get along with civil authorities?

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Posted by: looking in ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 01:51PM

I know nothing at all about him, but have discovered a very distant family connection to him through genealogy research. Something like 6th or 8th cousins. So, not much of a connection at all I guess! But maybe I'll learn something from this thread...

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 01:54PM

I knew there would be someone actually related to the guy. I'll bet many of us are blood relations if we had relatives who crossed the Plains.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2018 01:55PM by Cheryl.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 02:37PM

Wow! The J. stands for Jeddy! I never knew that!

How cool is that name!!!

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 03:26PM

He was the Jedi who cleanup up Mormonism with his own prohibitions.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 03:33PM

And his father, Jedediah M. Grant, was the driving force behind the Mormon Reformation, which was as close to the Inquisition as the religion got. Those were the days of extra-judicial killings, the whittling and whistling brigades, and Mountain Meadows.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 03:45PM

Yep.

"His father, Jedediah M. Grant, Second Counselor in the First Presidency to President Brigham Young, died of pneumonia at age 40, only nine days after Heber’s birth on 22 November 1856. However, the legacy of faith and righteousness his father left was a motivating factor throughout Heber’s life. “Years after his death I was reaping the benefits of his honesty and faithful labors,” President Grant later explained.3"
https://www.lds.org/ensign/2004/01/heber-j-grant-a-prophet-for-hard-times?lang=eng

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 03:50PM

The Wiki article on Heber is pretty funny. Apparently written by faithful saints, hagiographic in tone.

You'll be happy to know, for instance, that he was remarkably tenacious and did what others thought impossible. They told him he could not, for example, become a bookkeeper because his penmanship was so poor. But he worked assiduously and ultimately achieved his goal.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 03:57PM

And I think as a child he gave a poorer kid his coat? Lots of hagio going on...

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 03:58PM

I'm told there was also an episode with a cherry tree.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 04:01PM

When he popped that cherry tree's corn hole? His mom looked out the window and what did she see? Little Heber popping corn onto the cherry tree.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 04:03PM

That wasn't quite what. . .

Lot's Wife blushes.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 04:04PM

You liked that? I have a gummy for you then. ;)

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 04:04PM

Too soon?

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:06PM

Never take candy from strangers.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:19PM

What if I were a celebrity clown?

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:20PM

Aha! Who says you aren't!!!

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:28PM

Damn. I know my moniker was too appealing.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:28PM

Only if it is Krusty.

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:30PM


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Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 03:35PM

He loathed Roosevelt and was very upset that Utah voted to repeal Prohibition. It was probably the last time the church stayed out of politics and has meddled ever since.

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Posted by: Heartless ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 06:46PM

There are several biographies on him.

What I remember is....

His mother was sealed to Joseph Smith. Heber was therefore considered Joseph's son. Joseph F. Smith even presented his as such to the church on at least one occasion. This was used to claim the fulfillment of prophecy that a son of Joseph would lead the church.

Heber stopped the practice of first confering the priesthood and then ordaining to an office. Many considered an ordination to the office as invalid if you never confered the priesthood first.

Primary storie I remember are....

Heber learned to sing by practicing a lot. Learned to throw a baseball by practicing a lot. You get the theme.

Heber was big on the word of wisdom.

His "rival" was the illustrious J Golden Kimball.

Kimball called him Heber, rarely elder grant or president grant. Just Heber.

The story I most associate with them is knowing Golden's propensity to swear and knowing he was going to give a talk broadcast on live radio, Grant wrote a speech for Golden to give.

After trying for a few minutes to read the speech he turned to Grant and said. "Hell Heber I can't read this damn thing."

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:28PM


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Posted by: loislane ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:17PM

Heber J. Grant was fascinating on many levels.

His father, Jedediah Grant died before he was born, a victim of too much rebaptizing in the wintertime.

His mother was forced to marry (for a while) Jeddy's brother, a hideous drunkard.

HOWEVER, BY who performed the marriage between Heber's mother and father, actually sealed Rachel Grant to Joseph Smith, which meant that JS would have been considered HJG's REAL father.

HOWEVER, HJG, was not particularly religious and made it abundantly clear that he did NOT get revelations.

HJG, started out believing in polygamy, married three fine women, but none of them bore him a son. He said he would keep on marrying until one of his wives bore him a son. He finally got a son, but the boy did not live long.

When HJG became president of the LDS church, he was down to one wife, the other two having died. Dunno what happened, but HJG became rabidly ANTI-Polygamous, and said that the WORST children in the world were born to such unions. Considering the fact that all three of his wives bore children to him, that wasn't very nice.

One tantalyzing rumour I read right here on this board was that HJG had a fourth SECRET wife, that being his secretary, and she gave birth to a boy who was somewhat addled in his brain. Mebbe that had something to do with Heber's turnaround.

As far as personality, he was hard-working, driven, raised by a fine woman with all the virtues of a New England spinster, which is basically what Rachel Grant was. HJG was NOT into revelation. He was a business man. I think at one point he mortgaged the temple to save the LDS church's financial situation. HJG was not particularly creative, but had lots of drive and would work at a skill over and over until he mastered it.

One of his daughters wrote a book about her childhood. HJG comes across as a loving, caring father, who valued respectability. She was sent to Radcliff University. She got piano lessons. All the things that says respectability, she got.

She repeated one anecdote where, as a little girl she got her mouth washed out with soap for cussing (She didn't KNOW she was cussing. When she caught her father HJG cussing, (he was merely repeating what someone else had said_ he humbly washed his own mouth out with soap to show that he wasn't above punishing himself.

I wish someone would right a bio of the man. A study in contradictions. Not particularly religious but wound up being president of the LDS church. Rabidly pro-polygamy, and then rabidly anti-polygamy. I think it was the respectability thing. Polygamy just isn't respectable.

HJG kept a journal, so there is plenty of primary sources.

Read his daughter's bio, read what the FLDS have to say about him and then form your own conclusions.\

One curious thing I remember about HJG as a missiom president is that he urged the young male missionaries to grow beards because he thought it made them look older, and thus more likely to be taken seriously.

My own father once asked HJG for a revelation about some personal matter and HJG's response was, "The Heavens are as brass to me."

At least he was honest in THAT regard.

Lois

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:27PM


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Posted by: Heartless ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 09:57PM

Sorry. Have to add this.

Golden Kimball on revelation.

"Heber Grant is supposed to be to Lord's mouthpiece. He is supposed to receive revelation. But with all his travels by plane, train and automobile he moves too damn fast for the Lord to catch up to him."

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Posted by: Jerry the Aspousetate ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 10:13PM

Pay Lay Alol

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Posted by: Hedning ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 07:50PM

I'm not sure if you can find this story in print anymore but he was sent on a mission to japan where he was far from successful.

He reported to friends that we should just machine gun the Japanese and do the baptisms for the dead.

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Posted by: anono this week ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 08:16PM

The J Rueban Clark (the church years) biography by Michael Quinn contains all kinds of things from the time period about Grant and his real ideas of how he changed mormonism from a frontier faith into a corporate 20th century business. Grant was heavily interested in making money and was a banker by profession. He chose as his 1st counselor (against all kinds of advice from others) Clark who was working in Washington in a federal appointment making lots of money.

Clark never went to church and somehow became an Apostle? But Grant loved the money and relied on certain people to get it.

Also look into the Mormon Hierarchy Series, Wealth and Corporate Power, and the other one that I can't remember the name.

There is also bits and pieces of pre-manifesto glimses 1880s (and conversations with Grant) in the Book Under the prophet in Utah by Cannon.

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: October 12, 2018 09:25PM


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Posted by: Heartless ( )
Date: October 13, 2018 09:55PM

A few more things from the book "Boys who be ame prophets"

Heber, as a youth was skilled at playing marbles. Part of the game of course is the winner keeps the other folks marbles. Heber used his "winnings" to hire the other boys to do his chores for him.

Heber became a book keeper and errand boy for an insurance firm at age 15. The book does not name the firm.

Heber as ordained an apostle at age 25.

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: October 13, 2018 09:57PM


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Posted by: Aloysius ( )
Date: October 14, 2018 03:18PM

Not related, but Heber is my secret temple name (i.e., the name of the first token of the aaronic priesthood for people who went through the temple the first time on the same day as I). :)

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