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Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 03:49AM

I’ve been out of the cult for over a decade now and I’m at the point in my life where I feel that it doesn’t matter if you believe in a god or not. Who cares if you don’t believe in the Jesus or if you believe that there is literally nothing out there doing anything? Perhaps god is a giant squid who created us on accident and is now getting ready to feed on our souls? Any less plausible than the super-benevolent being who wants us to return to him without actually doing anything for anyone? (And don’t give me the Jesus died for your sins crap because none of that actually happened).

I feel that we all desire to have definition on some level. We seem to have a need to belong to a group of like-minded people. We like our compartments, our boxes. We leave one box and quickly look for another one to jump into. Boxes feel safer. Boxes are comforting...but...perhaps a fundamental part of the human condition is that there is no way of truly knowing the nature or the existence of god. It is an open-ended question with no answer.

Groups, labels, and boxes can quickly turn into shortcuts to critical thinking. This seems to be a byproduct of living in a cult for a number of years. Cults are full of these types of reasoning; highly polarized, black-and-white, for us or against us. Labels serve this type of reasoning well.

In my experience leaving the cult left me feeling empty or void of personality since so much of who I was was handed to be by the cult. It has taken me years to get to where I am now and the further I get from the cult’s influence the more comfortable I am with the idea that no one really knows anything about the divine or the spiritual. This is just a part of our existence. A question we will never know the answer to.

I can’t count on god to save me. I can’t count on my government to save me either. You know what I can rely on? The people around me.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 07:18AM

It's my faith that gets me through whatever life brings my way. I was agnostic as a teenager, until I found myself feeling very much lost and adrift. A simple prayer (as an agnostic,) turned my life around in ways I could not have imagined. Because someone up there heard and answered it, unequivocally.

If it's a question of who cares, I learned early on that I do. Because I trust that there is a higher power who cares deeply for us.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 11:04AM

Amyjo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If it's a question of who cares, I learned early
> on that I do. Because I trust that there is a
> higher power who cares deeply for us.

Thanks for sharing. There is something very psychologically comforting about your sentiments.

I remember listening to a philosophy course on Heidegger. The Jewish prof was perplexed why it was so difficult to accept that we die and that is it - we are no more. I contrarily thought he was ignoring the last bunches of centuries where Western Civilization people's have been making an extremely personal god for themselves...

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 09:22AM

And is deeply interested in your sexual habits.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 09:25AM

Interested and very judgmental!

Although very forgiving if you're about to serve a mission.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 11:44AM

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Although very forgiving if you're about to serve a
> mission.

And you are male.

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Posted by: LongTimeAnon ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 07:57AM

There’s a radically different way of viewing things and that is seeing, (actually observing) that no, you cannot rely on your group, yourself, or anything/anyone because you are not in control. Of anything. You cannot choose, anything, just like you didn’t chose your parents, the faith you were raised in, but your brain tricks you into thinking you can.
In Amyjo’s language or perspective “God is in charge.” or everything is “God’s will.” Consider that reality is much closer to that perspective, whether or not you assign anything to God.
However you decide to frame things, however, it’s just a thought, and thought patterns are habitual, cultural, etc. “You” don’t choose them, whatever “you” is. Enjoy that ride.

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Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 10:32PM

I'm not saying that relying on oneself or others is the same thing as control. To me, control is the last thing you want in a relationship. People do things for each other hopefully out of love but perhaps it is guilt...but hopefully love.

I'm just saying that categories and labels are not really helping us. What will help is are hearts, intentions, and actions.

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Posted by: babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 02:41AM

The way I see it, we are like ants crawling on a statue. The statue doesn’t move. In each moment of decision, maybe you are two ants. One ant turns left, the other turns right. You only experience one timeline even though both timelines occur. The ant in the divergent timeline is outside your experience but equally real. So how is it decided whether I’m the left ant or the right ant? It’s not. I’m both ants.

We’re not really separate beings. We are one being having subjective experiences of being you. I am an experience of God.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/18/2018 03:24AM by babyloncansuckit.

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Posted by: GregS ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 08:36AM

Apatheists unite!

Uhhh...nevermind. Gods and religions are boring.

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Posted by: spiritist ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 11:06AM

You are very accurate in your assessment! This is the problem I found as a Mormon and throughout my entire life. Just believing in God, etc. is not enough one must believe in the 'benefits' that any 'god-type belief should bring' to their life!

I find it important to believe in God, spirit guides, etc. etc.. However, those beliefs are not what is 'vitally important'!

What is 'vitally important' to my life is that, because of my beliefs, I not only believe but expect miracles and supernatural type events in 'my personal life'.

I was a Mormon for many years and as a teacher/leader continued to probe members for 'personal experiences' that bordered on 'miracles'. I found very few Mormons or anyone else with those 'miracle type experiences I was having periodically. I did find one or two with experiences/miracles similar to mine.

I will not brag about the benefits but there have been many 'miracles/supernatural' events in my life in the areas of help on tests, at work, in finding truth, investments, contests, protection/warnings, etc. etc.. One can say they are all just coincidental. I cannot disprove that, however, I have had so many incidents and get many minor things each month that few others experience I have a problem with 'coincidence'.

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 06:59PM

Who cares?
Koriwhore, apparently :)

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Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 10:36PM

HA!

I am reminded of the Indigo Girls song "The Closer I am to Fine".

You know the line - "The less I seek my source for some definitive, the closer I am to fine."

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 09:07AM

I didn't know the song, so I had to go look it up...
Thanks for the reference! :)

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 07:25PM

Once again I will struggle mightily to come up with the requisite enthusiasm to plug Laztheism.

Be a Laztheist. It's cheap and extremely uninvolving. Attendance will be taken and dues collected after your demise if we're wrong.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 09:28PM

I'm an Aziontologist.

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Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: October 17, 2018 10:24PM

Love it!

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 11:46AM

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Attendance will be taken and dues
> collected after your demise if we're wrong.

Will you get baptized and endowed as well?

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 12:44PM

I spent my formative years unendowed and it worked out okay, so ...

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 12:48PM

You're still under-endowed.
Oh, wait, you meant something else didn't you?
Sorry.

:)

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 12:50PM

Lot's Wife strove mightily to avoid making that joke because it was veddy improper.

Do you here that, Hie? Veddy improper!

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 12:57PM

You see, you see!!! That's what friendship is! You set yourself and your true friends pile on! It's a wonderful thing!!!

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 03:14PM

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Do you here that, Hie? Veddy improper!

I've never been very good at following "proper" rules...

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Posted by: alsd ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 12:30AM

I hate the labels, and I hate the fact that there are people who insist on locking others into certain boxes.

I do not know how to describe myself. I could be atheist, or agnostic, or apatheist, or a combination of any of those things.

All I really know is that after 4 plus decades of trying to do the right things, trying to gain a testimony, fervently praying, God has failed to convey the truthfulness of his existence to me. That ultimately led me to one of two possible conclusions, either God does not exist, or God does not care enough about me to give me the same confirmation he so willing to give others. Either way, it was time for me to stop caring.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 11:55AM

You could be a pococuranteist and care just a tiny weeny bit?

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/pococurante

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 02:54PM

This is a great new word I have never encountered before, EB!

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: October 22, 2018 12:17PM

Cool!

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Posted by: Sillyrabbit ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 02:45PM

An atheist, a vegan, and a crossfitter walk into a bar.

I know because they told everybody in less than 2 minutes.

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 03:08PM

Sillyrabbit Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> An atheist, a vegan, and a crossfitter walk into a
> bar.
>
> I know because they told everybody in less than 2
> minutes.


This is painting with a rather broad brush.

I know a great many atheists, many vegans, and some crossfitters--and none of them are people who are likely to do this in "a bar." [Meaning: a place where people congregate to socialize, while drinking alcoholic beverages.]

Although, on second thought, it might well happen in a juice bar, or a health food store, or in a veg-oriented restaurant, or a fitness center, or at some kind of lecture or special local event geared to intellectually-oriented people, because it might be of common interest to the people who normally go that place. (Especially those who are, at that moment, looking for new friends, or new relationships.)

I know this doesn't mean that there aren't people who DO do this as they go through their daily lives, but I think the premise is generalizing to an extreme.

[DISCLOSURE: I have no idea what to call what I really do identify with on the "nature of, or non-existence of, God" question, since I have never yet found any word or phrase which adequately describes my actual understanding of this. I am mostly vegetarian (most definitely not a vegan): my daily supplements include animal by-products, and I do eat some fish. And as everyone here knows, I am definitely not a Christian.]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/18/2018 03:34PM by Tevai.

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Posted by: thedesertrat1 ( )
Date: October 18, 2018 05:02PM

Certainly not me!!!!!

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