"Opinion: Will Mitt Romney fulfill a Mormon ‘prophecy’ and save the Constitution?"

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2019-10-19/mitt-romney-white-horse-prophecy-mormon-joseph-smith

Please:

Keep it Mormon-related, everybody!

(This means: No Politics.)

Thank you!

While it does have a political component, the major theme is "The White Horse Prophesy" - surely that is in bounds?

3X Wrote:
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> While it does have a political component, the
> major theme is "The White Horse Prophesy" -
> surely that is in bounds?

Yes, it is in bounds.

The problem is: Where the thread veers off to.

One person says one thing, another person responds, a third person responds to the first response....and Voila!

An against-the-rules discussion is off and running.

This is why it is better to prevent such happenings in the first place rather than to "cure" the result. ;)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2019 06:55PM by Tevai.

So...What? Just ignore mormons in politics? Ignore the LDS church interjecting in politics? Ignore Utah leaders that believe that there are mormon prophecies that say they will run the world? You might as well partner with the Deseret News if you're censoring Romney/political/mormon discussions.

So an article and a post about a US SENATOR......has to be non-political???




Good luck

Um, the Mormon "white-horse prophesy" is Mormon-related.

Please, let the mods do the policing.

Thank you for the article, 3X. It's always gratifying to see The Truth of Mormonism being exposed.

exminion Wrote:
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> Please, let the mods do the policing.


Tevai is a mod, so she can say and do as she pleases here. Interstingly, though, she never makes mormon-related posts. She only ever posts off topic or mod-related stuff.

Prophecies are often self fulfilling.

When Hatch was president pro tem of the senate, he was third in sucession and on at least two occassions "designated survivor".

If anything had happened Hatch would have become president and all of mormondom would have declared the prophesy fulfilled.

I really don't see a scenario where a junior senator and failed presidental canidate could pull off saving the country.

I grew up in a small Utah town & recall being told about the White Horse Prophecy as a fact & that it would occur in the near future.
I recently saw a white horse pooping in a field and that about sums up the amount of faith I have in the prophecy these days.

I tried making this point on an earlier thread that was deleted in its entirety. Serves me right.

The Constitution Hanging By a Thread prophecy is *not* the same as the White Horse Prophecy, although CHBAT is mentioned in passing in the WHP. The WHP is much more detailed and, more importantly, the "White Horse" is not a lone individual saving the day, but the church in general.

Also, the church has long disavowed the WHP, but not the CHBAT. That distinction should not be overlooked. When the Times op-ed mentions ETB, he was specifically talking about the CHBAT, not the WHP.

Just because mormons conflate them doesn't mean we have to.

I often ask people to distinguish between what they believe(d) and what they were actually taught--i.e., "folk" Mormonism vs. "official" LDS, understanding both those categories can be very fluid.

EDIT: Henry, I believe you posted a few links previously. Perhaps you can provide them again?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2019 08:12PM by caffiend.

Glad to oblige. The links I had posted turned out to be #1-2 in Wikipedia (which I didn't realize when I first found them).

For all of its faults and failings (and they are many), FAIR actually provides a reasonable analysis as well as the WHP's full text.

https://www.fairmormon.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/cobabe-whitehorse.pdf

A principal source for the above link was this one, from BYU Studies. Free download from here.

https://byustudies.byu.edu/content/edwin-rushton-source-white-horse-prophecy

The WHP as such was officially renounced as early as 1918. Meanwhile, the CHBAT continued to be preached and circulated. For example, this quote is from Joseph F. Smith, the same profit who disavowed the WHP at the Oct 1918 GenCon.

Joseph F. Smith, Conference Report, October 1912, p. 11:

"Now, these are the commandments of God, the principles contained in these commandments of the great Eternal are the principles that underly the Constitution of our country and all just laws. Joseph Smith, the prophet, was inspired to affirm and ratify this truth, and he further predicted that the time would come, when the Constitution of our country would hang as it were by a thread, and that the Latter-day Saints above all other people in the world would come to the rescue of that great and glorious palladium of our liberty."

Flash forward half a century to ET Benson.

Ezra Taft Benson, Conference Report, April 1963, p. 113:

"The Prophet Joseph Smith said the time would come when the Constitution would hang as it were by a thread. Modern-day prophets for the last thirty years have been warning us that we have been rapidly moving in that direction. Fortunately, the Prophet Joseph Smith saw the part the elders of Israel would play in this crisis. Will there be some of us who won't care about saving the Constitution, others who will be blinded by the craftiness of men, and some who will knowingly be working to destroy it? He that has ears to hear and eyes to see can discern by the Spirit and through the words of God's mouthpiece that our liberties are being taken."

Again, no horses, just the Constitution. [Note too ETB's "last 30 years" comment. What happened in 1933? The inauguration of FDR. Wanna bet ETB despised FDR?]

great to make such distinctions ....even as MORmONS intentionally suck at making distinctions especially when its self serving ......even as both "wild ass" prophecies are part of the same MORmON over inflated ego trip

We Baby Boomers very much grew up with the White Horse prophesy. I don't think today's youth hear about it as the church is trying so hard to distance themselves from JS. But I remember it as being that the elders of Israel (plural) would ride in, as if on a white horse, and save the Constitution. My ex FIL truly believed he would be in that saving brigade. I heard him talk about it a number of times. It was one reason they had drills with the Southern California Mormon Battallion (yes, the had drills and uniforms, and rank and everything), was for when they had to save the country.

It did hit me the other day that dang, maybe he will ride in on that white horse afterall and save us. But no, he'll fall in line with the party.

What do the 47 percent think about this ?

Or the .01%.

Who is the .01 % ? Please tell us.

Active mormons in the world?

As things stand, he's a mere suck-up.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2019 11:51PM by caffiend.

The only problem is Mitt doesn’t believe in the Constitution.

He "doesn't believe in the Constitution" because he disagrees with you?

You'll have to do better than that.

Mitt believes corporations are people. So it would be We The Corporation and not We The People.

An understandable objection but not one based in the constitution or in Mitt Romney's views.

The word "incorporation" literally means to transform something into an organic body, to give it some of the rights that societies normally assign to people. Corporations originated in the Middle Ages and were part of the British and American economies long before the constitution was even written. There is accordingly nothing in the constitution that prevents corporations from being treated as in some senses legal "people."

It follows that everyone who has ever organized a corporation, invested in a corporation, worked for a corporation, or bought something from a corporation effectively accepts those entities in exactly the same way that Romney does. You can only do business with, or sign a contract with, a corporation if you assume that it can, like a human, agree to that contract. Romney simply made the mistake of expressing to laymen an idea that has long been enshrined in the constitution, the law, and the English language.

We may disagree with some of the implications of that fact--I'm confident we both in fact would--but that doesn't change the basic constitutional facts.

There might be some confusion. Romney is more likely to fulfill a white horse's ass prophecy.

Does the article also mention 'Gold shoveled like sand' and 'silver piled up'?

If it doesn't, I want my money (-0-) back!!

The mormon church likes to act like they have a major important role in every important human event. The White Horse Prophacy is a bunch of crap. The mormon church is not patriotic any more than what it might take them to gain control of everything, if they could. Never forget that the Mormon church once had an oath of vengeance against the United States government and they taught that oath of vengeance in the temples. Mitt Romney would make a terrible president. If the priesthood were to help save the constitution (assuming the priesthood is real to begin with), the President wouldn't need to be a Mormon. Theoretically, the priesthood works by remote control - it doesn't need to be in the White House- and cooperation of a US president is not required for the priesthood to work. But it's all a moot point anyway since both the mormon church and its priesthood are not what they claim to be.

Never mind the anti-Trump "secularist liberals", who have been the subject of scorn at General Conference and beyond. No Mitt Romney has to be the hero in this instance...um...okay. Better late than never, but I can only give so much credit.

Let's also remember that Senator Romney sought Trump's endorsement in 2012--knowing full well that he was full of it with his racist birther conspiracy. This helped legitimize Mr. Trump's bona fides as a political operator.

Follow-up: Does he actually live there for any significant amount of time? I assume he has multiple residences: Utah, LaHoya (still?)...?

EDIT: Turns out Mitt has a secret Twitter handle, "Pierre Delecto." I couldn't help but think of Anthony Weiner's "Carlos Danger!"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/21/2019 10:34AM by caffiend.

It's soooooo Massachusetts! (He's one-for-three here.)