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Posted by: Lafayette ( )
Date: January 05, 2020 04:51AM

Spent some time with baptists and evangelicals. Most of the time online. After a while I sensed that the main issue, as always, is the question who is saved or not? That is where they end up. Most of them in the debate.

Some people get fruit in their lives and at the same time someone point out that they are saved another person point with another finger and says that is not being saved it is trying to be righteous through work effort. But wait wait, that is a blessing?? Do you not see it. No no, that is of the "world", store your wealth in heaven instead. But do not cut anyone some slack, you repent and make something out of the life you got as a gift from God who was not obligated to give you anything! Be rich but not happy in this life, but do not forget to be grateful! Grateful in the right sense, you know, grateful that you store things in heaven for eternity, do not live of this world, but wait!!!... On and on..

What is the problem in this ever-changing milieu? Well, I sense that it is that no one can prove that one is saved or not.

So after spent months with the baptist online community I came to conclusion that Jesus done it all and there is no use being part of a community that "works" most of the time to prove something that can not be proved in the eyes of any human. If we go to scripture alone it means that no amount of time should be spent on anything because God and his son is doing everything and already did it on calvary. Baptists are stuck in the 1950s. They got idols in the attributes and hymns?

My conclusion is. Jesus did it all. Do not spend your time to prove it in the community. He just did it on Calvary. Believe him and be saved. Do not say that you are saved because it is not possible to prove.

People taking part in the community participate in emotional abuse.

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Posted by: babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: January 05, 2020 06:57AM

America specializes in making cults of all kinds. Religious cults, sports franchises, the USMC, Apple, movies, etc. There’s always some organized “thing” you can give yourself to. Everybody wants to be a cog in a wheel. You can hang with Baptists and Evangelicals. What makes you think they know more about salvation than a gunnery sergeant or a computer nerd? They only know more about the Bible. I know a TBM who knew the Bible inside and out. His family still imploded.

Maybe the time for organized religions is over, except that everything in America is an organized religion. I’m not saying that’s bad, but where does that leave independent thought? Society needs to evolve. Systems don’t like mavericks. So why do we keep building systems?

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Posted by: Susan I/S ( )
Date: January 05, 2020 08:23AM

So why do we keep building systems?

Well, that is really a broad question. I have been reading about this and trying to get it from many sources. Some are political so choose your own fruit. Go to your search of choice and put in something like study shows religious brain less flexible

I do understand some of this is linked to physical brain damage but it makes me wonder about how the brain, as an organ, can become less flexible. That religion is linked to specific parts of the physical brain. No matter your take I think it is worth a few reads.

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Posted by: Lafayette ( )
Date: January 05, 2020 11:02AM

Personally I think that most of the systems are something people find themselves living in. Plain and simple. Somewhere in life grown ups sense something is terribly wrong. Maturity and life-experience peel away "certain" things in life.

In my context I see parts of my family walking longer and longer into an endless maze. They are intelligent but they try to navigate something that is irrational and unitelligent.

They throw out everything and try to control things that are not controllable.

We have been tricked. One demon at the, deal with the demon and there are hundreds more waiting. So the walk longer into the maze seem to be more pleasant.

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Posted by: macaRomney ( )
Date: January 05, 2020 11:24AM

"Jesus did it all. Do not spend your time to prove it in the community. He just did it on Calvary." That sounds right to me, and I think that is what Paul was trying to say in the NT. The thing about the topic of salvation is that it's really complicated, plain and simple. Wars have been fought over this, Nations destroyed. America was founded partly over this issue in that the puritans had a different idea of loyalty to the King (more particularly the King's advisers), they hated the corruption of the day, they tore down the stain glass windows, the idols, Mary and the apostles, the priesthood. They believed in the dignity of having an individual relationship with Christ. That the church had gone astray.

I'm reading a book right now about all of this, and am at the part where the magistrates demand every citizen to do a day of prayer and fasting to look inwardly for what sins are preventing the prospering of the colony of Massachusetts. And in this holy act that everyone has to obey, Roger Williams comes up with a whole long list of things that he disagrees with that have to do with King Charles, and decides to call the King to repentance. Of course this didn't go over well with the big hats in Boston. They got pissed!

But salvation is not easy topic. And anyone who says it is, or just screams Jebus! (the baptists) hasn't studied it, They don't know what they are talking about. There is a lot to this.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: January 05, 2020 03:41PM

Disputes about doctrine probably go back to the early days of Christianity. The more conservative Christians (the evangelicals and fundies) will be the most rigid when it comes to doctrine.

I have an evangelical friend whom I like quite well. I was telling her about my interpretation of a bible verse. She got quite offended, telling me that my interpretation was incorrect. I responded that I was quite well aware of the traditional interpretation, but chose to also interpret it my own way. She was unamused, lol.

It's probably for the best if I don't get into theological debates with her.

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