In a recent thread, Jake's Sis dicussed how she and her siblings were all expected to marry fellow BICs. We have all read about that particular familial expectation numerous times here on the board.

If you were a convert to the church, what was your experience in terms of finding a marriage partner? Did you marry a BIC or a fellow convert? Were you ever rejected as a potential mate because you were a convert? If you married a BIC, how did your mate's family react to your status as a convert? Were you ever made to feel "less than" by inlaws, extended family, or church members?

I ask because my feeling is that newcomers to the church probably convert with the expectation that they will be fully accepted as equals by the church community. However we have had numerous stories shared here where that has not been the case. What was your experience?

I was a convert (age 20) and an RM (age 24). I immediately went to BYU after the military and found the field white and ready to harvest. I had no problem whatsoever finding women seeking an MRS degree at the Zoo.

Just sayin'...

Ron

I'm so grateful to God that I only went to YBU for my bachelor's degree. PPPPPPPPPPPPLLLLLLLLLLLL

I once overheard a guy (RM) saying he would never marry a convert because he couldn't handle the thought of her being with another man. Arrogance and insecurity off the wall. Note how he’s assuming being a convert means having sex prior to baptism. I’ve met others who thought this way, must be the licked cupcake lesson :)

I am now in a long-term relationship with the nonmo I didn't convert at age 20 (and I'm now 54). He said he would join the church to marry me as he felt that children should be raised by parents on the same page where religion is concerned (his parents weren't on the same page--his dad is atheist and his mother went to whatever church was the closest to walk to--didn't matter denomination--yes, went ot a mormon church for a while until they found out she wasn't a member and tried to convert her). Anyway . . .

I didn't believe he could convert or that anyone could. I thought it would take a miracle. I never believed any of my nonmo friends would convert. That it was just too far from the realm of possibility . . . that they'd believe it. UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM!

Instead of replying here, I ended up starting a new thread:

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,237100,237137#msg-237137

Thanks for your post!

When I was about 16, my TBM (convert) dad sat me down and advised me to not even think about marriage until I turned at least 25. He told me that most people have no idea who they are or what they want or what's important until at least the mid-20s. You change so much from ages 18-25, that you're probably just setting yourself up for failure, if not a heartbreaking loveless marriage.

This made sense to me. I thought it was pretty stupid to get married the minute you turned 18 because you're making a decision for eternity, not just the next 60 or 70 years. Why rush into a decision like that? Why not take my time and date around a lot and figure out who I am and what I want?

This backfired on him in a huge way, because by the time I got to age 25, I was so fiercely independent and self-sufficient that I could no longer see a need for a partner at all. I was doing just fine on my own, so I held firm on my decision to not be married.

So to answer the OP, it has been very difficult to maintain my integrity and put up with 90% of the rest of the world assuming that A) I am married, B) If I'm not, then I want to be married, and C) I am still searching for a husband. The pressure (mostly from family) is enormous and completely unnecessary. I'm usually able to blow it off, but I suspect this is a tiny glimpse of what it feels like to be gay: Most other people you meet make assumptions about things like marriage and family and if you don't fit neatly into the pigeonhole... well, people just don't know what to do with a statistical outlier. (However, unlike my GLBT friends, nobody has really attacked me for my decision. And, unlike my GLBT friends, this was a conscious decision. I was born single but decided to stay that way. I have been verbally attacked for stating that I am not interested in having children.)

I have a lovely BF. I hope we will be together for years to come. I have no illusions about finding the perfect partner for life because I have changed as a person over the years. The perfect partner for me at 20 would not be the same perfect partner for me at 40: my needs changed, my priorities changed, my goals changed, my attitudes changed. This is why I think lifetime/until eternity monogamy is mostly bunk. Some couples remain happy together for their entire lives, but for most of us... not so much. I don't think there's a damn thing wrong with serial monogamy.

All that to say: it is not everyone's goal to find someone to marry.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/07/2011 10:29AM by dogzilla.

I think you have to have a Mormon aura about you in order to date successfully at BYU. I never had that aura, and I was a lifelong Mormon. It's the same aura that gets you the leadership callings, MLM sales and so on. The women I dated at BYU wanted to PARTY, and then they were disappointed and dumped me when they realized that actually I was one of the zoobies who wanted to get married. I think I give off the wrong aura and always have. A lot of converts probably get the same thing.

I was a convert at 14. It took me 5 post-mission years to find a mormon girl that I could tolerate for more than 2 dates. Her entire family converted when she was 8. So she was essentially raised in the church, but not completely. Her dad has never been TBM, her mom is full-on. So I and her family(at least her dad and I) were kind of a match in that way.

As a convert teenager, one of the older HPs in the ward took me under his wing as a sort of surrogate mormon dad. We were home-teaching partners, and he gave me rides to youth activities, even when I didn't want to go to the youth activities. Afterwards, i was always glad i went. So, in a way, I was gratefel for his influence(at least while I was still a believer). He was a cousin to one of the GAs. I heard he moved to SLC, so looked him up when I started attending school there. He invited me over for dinner. I came by myself. He said the next time he saw me, he wanted to see the girl that I would marry. Well, like I said, it took me a few years to find the one. So I never called the guy again. I guess it slipped my mind when the time came, and I also forgot to send him a wedding announcement. I do remember thinking at one point that it was kind of odd that he would make our friendship contingent on my finding a mate. Oh well, his loss.

Where I am from, most of the Mo guys want to date converts because they have more "experience"

summer Wrote:
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> If you married a BIC, how did your
> mate's family react to your status as a convert?
> Were you ever made to feel "less than" by inlaws?
>
Yes, oh yes, oh Dear Gawd, YES!! Just one outrageous example:

My in-laws flew out to Florida for our sealing to each other and our babies. They stayed in our home a few days. I am a convert, from the South, and at that point had never even visited Utah . . . so I was really not up on TBM/Mormon Royalty culture. (Although I'd been an active member for a decade).

MIL spent most of the trip trying to get me to quit my Diet Coke habit, and went ballistic when I allowed my toddler to have Sprite for lunch in a restaurant.

My husband was a total JackMo (lucky she didn't see him drink any beer!), so I had fallen into the habit of initiating family prayer, scripture study, FHE, etc. Or it would have never gotten done!!

Well, during their visit, I guess the Wicked Witch of the West decided I didn't know my place and was usurping her son's Priesthood authority. Gasp!

So when she got home to Utah, she sent my CATHOLIC parents a 4-page letter detailing my faults and failings as a Mormon wife and mother. It appeared that she wanted them to straighten me out somehow because I was defective.

My parents didn't know what to make of it all, as I was a GREAT mom and loving wife. They just had these WTF? looks on their faces when they shared the letter with me. They didn't know what to do, so they just ignored it.

MIL was like that - always "teaching" and "correcting" me on proper Mormon behavior. I tried so hard, I really did. But there were so many freakin' RULES (church and cultural). I just couldn't absorb it all and transform myself into the BIC Molly Mo they wanted for a DIL.

A few years later, a family trip to Happy Valley to visit the in-laws finally put the nail in my coffin. They were so incredibly offensive to me that I started researching the LDS church online as soon as I got home. I lost my testimony in less than a week.

We eventually resigned from the church as a family (except for JackMo hubby - he's still hedging his bets by straddling the fence).

So, basically, my in-laws destroyed their own eternal family with their rude behavior and unrealistic expectations. Sad.

;o)

I converted at 18. Not because of a guy. I'd told God whoever gets me first the Pentecosts or the Mormons.

That was where I was at 18.

I worked a year after HS then went to Ricks College. There were four girls to every guy. The girls were really silly, they would spend two hours to get all dolled up just to go get a soda at the local 7-11 two blocks away!

The guys were on their way out the door to go on missions and were major skirt chasing boys.

I thought it was because they had been BIC so they hadn't 'seen the light' and that's why they were so 'worldly'.

I was looking for that ideal guy who prized virtue (just as my dewy-eyed 40+ aged Institute teachers spoke of) [I didn't know men change what they value about age 40]
I also noticed a lot of the guys were tough Alpha male types who would be pushing me around if we ever married. NONE of them even gave me a first glance let alone ask me out!
Which was fine with me... arrogant stuffed shirts!

In fact it was very strange to be at Ricks college. For the first time in my life I was invisible to the guys! I'd been beating them off with a stick since I was seven years old!

I married an effeminate guy....that's a whole another painful story.. So much I didn't know .... and should have known... or been told by the TSCC.....

He was from an odd branch of an old Mormon family (one of his distant cousins whose family doesn't recognize his family) has a building on BYU Provo named after him.

My husband had specifically sought out a girl who wasn't from Utah. He was disappointed to find out my raven hair was Welsh/Irish in stead of Indian even though I was from Alaska! (what is it with stateside people anyway? Don't they know Alaska is a state and has white people living there too? I wonder what my fellow Alaskans of Asian descent get asked?)

So I hung out with converts at Ricks and married a BIC who wasn't a pushy mother. I didn't have enough maturity or faith in myself to distinguish someone who was pushed around by their parents wanted someone to mother them and not 'lead' a family.

I really didn't like a lot of the mormon BICs I thought they were too 'worldly' I hadn't figured out Mormons are NOT special even when they have the gospul! And the church is not what it claims to be......

So as a convert, I was never asked out by the BICs and I wouldn't have liked them much anyway. I just didn't fit their mold. Either I was too prim and proper and scared them off. Or dressed like a sister Missionary (I really wanted to go on a mission I was so starry eyed!) and the regular guys would have been put off by me too.

Because being modest meant drab. And I'd have never worn any short skirts, cleavage and etc!(Like I did before I joined the church!)

I also was a little too independent and a trifle outspoken for the guys in general.Even though I tried to tone myself down a lot at the time.

Mormon Observer Wrote:
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> Because being modest meant drab. And I'd have never worn any short skirts, cleavage and etc!(Like I did before I joined the church!)

An acquintance of mine teaches at USU. She's said that the Mormon girls there dress a lot more provacatively than you would think, including short skirts, plunging necklines, etc. She said that it changes once they marry, but while they are on the hunt, they do what they need to do to attract a guy.

Hmm - I never thought of it before. In high school, my boyfriend was BIC and I married a descendant of pioneers but in between, pretty much every guy I was even a little serious about was a convert too. I think that Peter priesthood type turned me off even though I was told that was what I should aspire to. So I subconsciously avoided the type of guy I thought I was consciously looking for. Being a convert, especially one who was primarily located in California (only went to BYU for 4 years for a degree) I didn't realize there was anything special about being BIC. In fact, there was almost a feeling that converts, who cared enough to disdain the worldly ways and convert, were in some ways more faithful Because they chose the right instead of being born into it. I really had no idea BIC was supposed to be better and when confronted by the idea for the first time about a decade ago, I just laughed and couldn't believe they were serious. Because this is such a Utah mindset and the California mindset is that Utah is a bit countrified and that the people don't live the gospel as well because they take it for granted. So having always looked down a bit on Utah Mormons, the whole idea that having deluded pioneer ancestors made you special was ridiculous. It didn't hold water.

It still doesn't.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/07/2011 01:58PM by CA girl.

I was a convert in my teens and never once in 14 years heard anyone express a desire to marry a BIC member vs a convert.

Why would they care? From my experience, [active] converts are usually more passionately involved and have stronger testimonies than BIC members.

For myself, when looking for a spouse, I just wanted someone who fit that description, whether BIC or Convert.

I never found anyone to marry, but then again I am one of those "sweet spirits." I'm also pretty independent and keep my own counsel about things. Not that I might not ask for advice, but the end decision is mine.

Susan

I joined the church in the MidWest as a teenager. When I came out to BYU, I encountered two different reactions when people learned I was a convert: "Oh! Converts are SO special because you found the truth, had to deal with the objections of family, the world, etc.!"

OR:

I'd get asked by parents of freinds and boyfreinds about my church ancestry and connections. Apparently, they wanted their sons to marry fellow BICs from a pedigree Mormon background.

I'm really glad I married a fellow convert. Now, if I could just get him to leave the church with me. . . .

I was working in a high-pay occupation, It was all Downhill!

I always got more attention from Mormon boys than I ever did outside of the fold. I think it's because I was always pretty effeminate in appearance and speech, but as far as interests and behavior I like nerdy, guy-type things. A lot of LDS boys are straight up geeks, and it always seemed to fascinate them when a semi-attractive girl would ask to play D&D or skateboard with them. It worked in my favor. They didn't seem to mind that I was a convert.

I also didn't act like an idiot, nor did I "chase" the boys. A lot of Molly's seem pretty clueless about how to attract guys. There are way more girls than guys, so LDS dudes are used to being prowled after.

I never had inlaw trouble due to being a convert. My inlaws kind of adopted me and nurtured me actually. They were wonderful people, we had a great relationship until I left the church and their son. They were even present at my wedding to my current husband, and stood up with the rest of my parents : )