https://apnews.com/article/Mormon-church-sexual-abuse-investigation-e0e39cf9aa4fbe0d8c1442033b894660

From the very lengthy, gut wrenching story:

"Very few of the scores of lawsuits against The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints mention the help line, in part because details of its operations have been a closely guarded secret. The documents in the sealed court records show how it works."

“The help line is certainly there to help — to help the church keep its secrets and to cover up abuse,” said [C... V...], an Idaho attorney who has filed several sex abuse lawsuits against the church."

"The sealed records say calls to the help line are answered by social workers or professional counselors who determine whether the information they receive is serious enough to be referred to an attorney with [K....M...], a Salt Lake City firm that represents the church."

Thank you for this, auntsukey. I saw it late last night and found it heartbreaking.

It is, from our perspective, the smoking gun. In short, the church's abuse hotline is *not* intended to help bishops decide how best to handle ongoing child molestation cases: its purpose is to discourage cooperation with the authorities that may ultimately lead to legal action against the church. It is about as cynical a system as one can imagine.

The story hits me hard because it shows that the church actively, intentionally, and for many years, blocked any attempt to protect little girls from abuse it knew was continuing. How can the bishops sleep at night knowing what they are abetting? Is it that easy to override their consciences?

"Just following orders."

This is why I think that there needs to be laws in place that mandate reporting of child abuse, and child sexual abuse, by any church employee or official. They're not special. There are already plenty of mandated reporters, including teachers.

Sometimes people and organizations need legal "encouragement" to do the right thing.

Summer, I think there are such laws in many jurisdictions. I'm filling in for an organist in a mainline Protestant church for eight Sunday services over the next five months. I'm only doing it because the church has one of the finest pipe organs on the west coast. I would pay THEM for the privilege of playing it, though I didn't tell them that, and they are actually paying me $300 a service.

In any event, I have to take the church's AB-506-compliant mandated reporter training,as well as go through finger printing and background clearance once again, just to fill in as an organist for those eight services even though, as a licensed physician/surgeon, the training I've already taken far exceeds anything that will be presented in their video sessions and quizzes. Anyone paid by them (custodians or yard maintenance workers are exempt if the church contracts with a licensed service and the service is provided when no children are on the premises) including musicians, pastoral staff, secretarial staff) plus any volunteer who works even incidentally with children, is considered a mandated reporter. As far as I can tell, my duties will not in any way involve contact with children, but that is just how seriously the law and its implementation are taken here.

Yes, some church denominations do the right thing. I wish they all would.

I'm not sure how much stronger the legal mandate is here, though I'm sure it's stronger. Also, insurance carriers won't cover churches that aren't AB 506-compliant.

The last church we attended didn't even just settle for the training. They required background checks on anyone who wanted to volunteer with the youth. The church administrator said you'd be shocked at how many people refuse to submit to a background check!

She also said that the perpetrator types would also try to skirt the process, by slowly "just hanging around." Or not "working with the youth," but just "helping out." Or they'd hang around before and/or after youth events, being "friendly" with kids who might be waiting on parents, a ride, or some other activity. Or even just going to use the restroom. The church had to watch and guard the kids vigilantly.

As thoroughly as the state vets medical practitioners, I'm still required to pay once again for fingerprinting and a background check. It seems a little silly, but if the rules allow anyone to skirt the process, eventually someone who actually has a history of CSA will be allowed to bypass the system and will gain access to children through their church. I have to respect them for being sticklers.

The same for people who coach children's sports. It's a pain in the backside and absolutely worth the trouble.

Yes, it is!

It's the same for teachers and other school employees. My district also background checks volunteers.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/2022 01:19AM by summer.

Yep. And anyone who wants the privilege of teaching, coaching, babysitting, or otherwise interacting with children should pay for the privilege by going through the vetting process.

The joys entirely outweigh the frankly minuscule inconvenience of providing some fingerprints and answering some questions.

I had a nearly full-time volunteer my last couple of years in the classroom. I was so grateful that she took the trouble to go through the background check in order to volunteer her time (the district paid the fee.) She made what had become a very tough job for me bearable -- she did all my paper copying, filing, and graded any assignment that was a simple correct/incorrect. She did anything I asked her to do, and in time, she handled most of the copying for all of the teachers. Because of her I could walk out of school just after the kids each day, and not have to stay for hours afterward completing these tasks.

That was very good of her.

Who are these snowflakes coming down, coming down, like mental brains abused by darkened eyes.

Who are your alleged snowflakes in this scenario? Not the abused, I hope.

Yes, the abused. The song from Saturday's warrior has us as raindrops. People and many from the church don't acknowledge it's abuse. We become frozen and they see us as not getting over it. Their darkened eyes come from their gods darkened skies.

Elder Berry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, the abused. The song from Saturday's warrior
> has us as raindrops. People and many from the
> church don't acknowledge it's abuse. We become
> frozen and they see us as not getting over it.
> Their darkened eyes come from their gods darkened
> skies.

Got it.

It does explain why the church was so interested in getting a third-party liability release from all sexual abuse suits included in the Boy Scout case.

The Salt Lake Tribune ran the same story but also ran this

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/local/2022/08/04/sex-abuse-lds-church-help-line-4/

The best lines IMO:

"Judge Wallace Hoggatt called the abuse endured by MJ and her younger sister “one of the most horrendous cases of child molestation” he had ever encountered"

and particularly this one:

“I just think that the Mormon church really sucks. Seriously sucks,” MJ told the AP. “They are just the worst type of people, from what I’ve experienced and what other people have experienced.”

Agreed.

When I saw the article last night, I was appalled. This shows the LDS church in the worst possible light.

And it is the correct light.

This is exactly what happened in my ward growing up in the 70’s, when a pedophile (known only to the Bishop) was made Scout Leader for our scout troop for four years, over which time he went on to abuse nearly our entire scout troop, one by one.
When one of the victims spoke up, 4 yrs later, he was quietly removed, no disciplinary action was taken, authorities were not notified, out of interest to “protect the Good Name of the Church’, instead, victims got blamed, and the predator went free to go on and abuse many more children, until he abused a non-Mormon child and the kids parents had no problem reporting him to the police and sending him to jail, where he belonged in the first place.
As a result, my friends joined up and sued the abusive CULT and were awarded millions each in settlements, but the all had to sign NDA’s so they could never breath a word of it all to the media.
There was so much manipulation, intimidation of victims and cover ups and victim blaming that took place it made it impossible for me to continue allowing my children to participate in the abusive lying CULT ever again.
And it’s still going on.
Mormons will lie through their teeth to protect pedophile penis holder abusers and blame the victims.

To understand the church's law firm just go back to 1994 when Byron Lloyd Poelman was a representative for the church on a Utah state task force for child sexual abuse. He represented the church in numerous cases, he was one of the three founding partners of the law firm. Poelman's brother was a general authority. Poelman was not only a lawyer for the church, he had been a mission president and was a Stake President. He was performing a task for both the governor of Utah and the church at the same time. His task was a blue ribbon committee on child sexual abuse.

He was 60 years old and was arrested for solicitation. The 19 year old young woman he paid was younger than his children, younger than his son who had died barely three years earlier. Think about that. She had been a 16 year old minor child when Poleman's own son had died. Three years later Poleman was sodomizing her. Think about that. This is the law firm that knew what these children in this story were suffering, and instructed the Bishop to not report it.

The church's hotline began in 1995.

This is so sickening. That poor little girl.

It's tragic. Almost unbelievable. :(

The hotline has never had anything to do with helping victims. It is all about covering the corporate ass. It looks good when they get sued, lets them know about trouble coming, and they can "manage" the fallout from the beginning. They are trying to pull this slimy move with the Boy Scouts case because now everyone KNOWS they are sitting on BILLIONS of dollars in just one slush fund. In the past they have paid big bucks, no doubt in the millions, so they would not have to open their books to the court. The court wants to make punitive damages HURT. In the past, they could claim a few million hurt, that argument no longer holds water.

If LDSInc really gave a crap about kids/women they would have taken basic measures to protect them YEARS ago. Just look at the "Indian Placement Program". They didn't care who they placed those poor kids with. Closed door bish meetings about your sex life would have gone decades ago. If they can track you ward to ward, state to state they sure as hell could have tracked known predators.

Bottom line, they don't give a crap. They never have given a crap. They never will give a crap until it hits their bottom line.

Sometimes the truth is brutal. . .

I don't understand why they don't put stricter measures in place. All I can think is they think they will lose the trust of their hoi polloi.

Now that Sam Young has been proven right, will he be reinstated in his church calling?

It's not just Mormons, but all churches are magnets for predators. Wolves in sheep's clothing. Would you spot a sick psychopath dressed up in their Sunday best? Sure, just use The Spirit. The HG would never steer you wrong.

I don't like church people because their ditzy cult-think enables these unconscionable monsters and then people get hurt. Harmed for life. For what? In the case of Mormonism, the bottom line.

I have watched "leave no trace behind" it is about the pedophiles in the boyscout program.

Here is the link

https://youtu.be/T1wyl76qr2g

So some adult leaders got caught in one troop doing bad things to scouts so they went over state line to another troop and did it again. That movie was heartbreaking to watch. The BAS had something called "perversion files" but they did not go to the police with it.

I think it would be VERY interesting to know how many of these abusers have been turned over to civil authorities.

Why do I suspect that the number is infinitesimally small?

https://kutv.com/news/local/helpline-the-church-of-jesus-christ-of-latter-day-saints-responds-ap-associated-press-report-local-leaders-bishops-abuse-confessions

sickening

One of the most poignant points for me was this question asked at the end, by Gerard Moretz, a seasoned child sex abuse investigator, Pima County, Arizona:

“What aspect of your religious practice are you advancing if you don’t report something like this?”

Gordon B. Stinky Wrote:
-----------------------

> One of the most poignant points
> for me was this question asked
> at the end, by Gerard Moretz, a
> seasoned child sex abuse inves-
> tigator, Pima County, Arizona:
>
> “What aspect of your religious
> practice are you advancing if
> you don’t report something like
> this?”


THAT IT'S ALL ABOUT THE MONEY . . .

Exactly. On the Catholic side of things, Pope Francis had been far more interesting in forgiveness for the "sinners" (the child sex abusers,) than he has been in protecting children.

That's because the "sinners" and their protectors surround the pope in the Vatican.

The same may well be true of the LDS church. If child abuse has been occurring for generations, and leaders have been sweeping it under the rug, then pulling the loose threads will unravel the entire fabric.

The churches' actions speak louder than words.

USA Today picked up the story:

https://www.usatoday.com/videos/news/nation/2022/08/04/how-mormon-church-help-line-hid-child-sex-abuse/10232999002/

Also reporting on the sex abuse story:

ABC News, Yahoo, The New York Post, MSN, US News, AOL, and numerous other national and local outlets.

If you look at the "hot line" worksheet it pretty much tells the whole story. It's all about determining the level of liability for LDSInc. The fact that those records are DESTROYED every single day says a lot.

https://youtu.be/cPCsbV16Qb0

This video shows clear what the helpline is for to protect the lds church and not the victims.

Excellent clip.

“What aspect of your religious practice are you advancing if you don’t report something like this?” he asked.

I wish Jesus was real so he could ask them that.

“Disciplinary proceedings are subject to the highest confidentiality possible,” said Rytting. “If members had any concerns that their disciplinary files could be read by a secular judge or attorneys or be presented to a jury as evidence in a public trial, their willingness to confess and repent and for their souls to be saved would be seriously compromised.”

I thought part of the repentance process was accepting your secular consequences.

There are no "god men", just god damn men. What a joke, a bunch of guys thinking they have powers of discernment or whatever and some pretend priestcraft bs and it's all fantasy. All play acting. "I had a revelation today!" Yeah, that you're delusional. Cowards.

Both Bishops are as guilty as the child rapist. They protected him and allowed the rapes to go on for years.

Why hasn't someone hanged these co-Abusers?

Most abusers are known by family, friends and/or neighbors - and they contribute to the abuse by their inaction, failure to turn these dirtbags in to the police.

https://mobile.twitter.com/KatieLudlowRich/status/1556087764164087809?s=20&t=3a3CqpWMoxjWxntziuOzeA

More and more stuff is coming to light.

So one of the principals of the church's own lawn firm, the same law firm which renders judgement on child sex abuse cases, was himself arrested and tried for soliciting a teenager for oral sex? Wow.

https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRybbBxd/

In this video one suggestion is to have husband and wife both have the priesthood and both be bishops together. Interesting idea. Growing up in the lds church I never questioned why only men could be bishops that just how it was.

By their fruits ye shall know them

Hateful cowards.

https://www.facebook.com/1733836613347274/posts/pfbid02FTHy1SV3pfnPYu3Ra8XT5PackkbzpK8fv8Hb22CaYTozd3br9VtPYoqMwgPtyVWLl/?sfnsn=mo

The "helpline" is getting bad press.

That puts the Bat Phone in perspective, doesn't it.

Thank heaven this stuff is finally getting some disinfectant-of-daylight attention.

Holy cow! The attorney in the video who is breaking down the issues deserves a listen.

See this from the DN

https://www.deseret.com/2022/8/21/23313518/the-vandals-who-desecrated-latter-day-saint-buildings-are-wrong-associated-press-vandalism

A bunch of weaseliness

The worst part:

"It’s also well-known that the church funds a 24/7 help line staffed by legal and clinical professionals with decades of experience and expertise in handling child abuse cases. From our experience, the women and men who work on the help line are people of integrity whose chief concern is the safety and welfare of victims of abuse.

When a help line call is answered, the conversation focuses on safety first. If there is any indication that a child is, or may be, in imminent danger, authorities are notified immediately — regardless of whether a report is mandatory under applicable law. Those who work on the help line also advise lay leaders on other steps that may be taken to help ensure continued safety and provide appropriate support to the victim, their family and others impacted by the abuse."

If the chief concerns were safety and welfare of victims, the only response from a call to the help line would be to immediately contact law enforcement.

In fact, if that were the primary concern, there wouldn't need to be a help line. Every bishop upon being set apart would be given a copy of the church handbook of instructions with the section on child abuse permanently marked and told to read it.

That section would say that the only priority is protection of the victim and any other possible victims, and, therefore, the bishop should *immediately* contact the appropriate LE agency.
Period.

Alas, no comments accepted.

Who would have thought?

The point of this column that child abuse isn't tolerated in the mormon church is belied by the facts of the Arizona case where it was tolerated for years.


I most certainly don't condone vandalism, but this is a feeble response to the underlying issue.

I thought it was even weaker than that.

The topic was ostensibly the vandalism of LDS chapels, but the writers immediately veered off into a defense of the church's anti-molestation credentials. Then they veered off course again, this time into a defense of the hotline, which is ultimately about the Arizona affair.

That puts everything in context, doesn't it? The article was not about vandalism, not even about the church's position on child abuse. It was about Arizona and the hotline.

That tells us what the church is really worried about.

The church has bad publicity and it will not go away. Sam Young is still going strong with "protect every child".

https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRfUuQHQ/

That helpline is outed.