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Posted by: jdawg333 ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 03:41AM

Back when I was a believer, I never stopped to question how this works.

Our Heavenly Father and all of the Eternal Mothers have physical exalted bodies. When they reproduce, no physical offspring is born. Just a spirit. Does the spirit take 9 months to emerge? Is it born in the same way as a mortal baby? Did we spring forth fully formed from the heads of our Heavenly Parents? Why wouldn't we have the same type of body as our parents?

Meanwhile, when Heavenly Father impregnated Mary, a mortal child was born in the manner of mortals. Jesus reportedly had some traits of the divine, but in any case his body was more substantial having a mortal parent with a physical body and an exalted parent with a physical body than anybody born of two exalted parents with physical bodies.

Things get even more confusing when you consider that Adam and Eve didn't even have parents for their bodies.

So to summarize:

Two exalted parents --> spirit baby

One exalted parent, one mortal parent --> mostly mortal baby with some Divine attributes

Two mortal parents --> fully mortal baby

No parents --> fully mortal adults


I feel like there are a lot of details that were never properly explained in Sunday school.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/12/2023 03:42AM by jdawg333.

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 07:19AM

That is not essential to your salvation.

Now put a cork in it, run along, get a college degree (male) or a ring on your finger (female) and get a good job (male) or mediocre job (female) and start sending us your 10%+ (both). And have lots of future tithers. That is the fulness of The Gospel™, the law and the prophets, and the only thing you (or we, for that matter) need to worry about.

inthenameofcheeseandriceamen

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Posted by: jdawg333 ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 09:42AM

Ugh. This is always the answer to the interesting questions. So boring and unsatisfying.

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Posted by: CrispingPin ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 08:27AM

There are videos that explain celestial reproduction. Go to any adult video site and use the search term “Mormon.”

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Posted by: jdawg333 ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 09:40AM

Lol I've known about the Mormon videos on gay sites for years, but if you're being technical they don't answer my question about reproduction since I was wondering about the babies produced from man-woman unions. It never occurred to me that all this time the answer could have been on the straight sites.

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Posted by: GNPE ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 11:11AM

IF we're resurrected persons in the ck, wouldn't we give birth to whole persons ???

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Posted by: Dallin Ox ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 11:22AM

"when you consider that Adam and Eve didn't even have parents for their bodies"

According to Brigham Young, they did. Young taught that A&E were born to human parents on another planet and were later transported to earth.

"Though we have it in history that our father Adam was made of the dust of this earth, and that he knew nothing about his God previous to being made here, yet it is not so; and when we learn the truth we shall see and understand that he helped to make this world, and was the chief manager in that operation.

"He was the person who brought the animals and the seeds from other planets to this world, and brought a wife with him and stayed here. You may read and believe what you please as to what is found written in the Bible. Adam was made from the dust of an earth, but not from the dust of this earth. He was made as you and I are made, and no person was ever made upon any other principle." (JOD 3:319, 4/20/1856)

https://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/digital/collection/JournalOfDiscourses3/id/56

"Mankind are here because they are the offspring of parents who were first brought here from another planet, and power was given them to propagate their species…" (JOD 7:285, 10/9/1856)

https://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/digital/collection/JournalOfDiscourses3/id/2859

Young was also the guy who believed and taught that the earth was created near Kolob and transported through space to its present location when A&E "fell." So I guess A&E only moved down the street at the very beginning, before they were evicted from the neighborhood.

"When the earth was framed and brought into existence and man was placed upon it, it was near the throne of our Father in heaven. And when man fell – though that was designed in the economy, there was nothing about it mysterious or unknown to the Gods, they understood it all, it was all planned – but when man fell, the earth fell into space, and took up its abode in this planetary system, and the sun became our light." (JOD 17:143, 7/19/1874)

https://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/digital/collection/JournalOfDiscourses3/id/6616

And to think the mormons' flagship *university* is actually named after this person…

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Posted by: jdawg333 ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 12:18PM

This is all new information to me. Kinda fascinating in a bizarre sort of way. I should read the journal of discourses one of these days and see what else is in there.

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Posted by: GNPE ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 12:28PM

BY was an off-the-rails wacko, but it took ChurchCo a while to become aware…

Speaking As A Man soon followed.

Q: If the JoD wasn’t accurate, why did ChurchCo publish it???

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Posted by: CrispingPin ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 01:13PM

“If the JoD wasn’t accurate, why did ChurchCo publish it???”

When I was a teen (in the 70s) it was a status symbol among Mormons to have the JoD. When I visited the home of a stake leader or bishop, it was common to see it on the bookshelf.

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Posted by: dagny ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 11:35AM

LOL. You think too much! You must never ask where Jesus got his Y chromosome.

Maybe God has one testicle that dispenses spirit sperm and one that dispenses body sperm.

Whenever it starts to sound too crazy, you are supposed to just accept we don't know and God has it figured out.

Here's another one of the many pretzel they created: In the CK, you are supposedly going to have your kids with you. But so were your parents. So are you living with you MIL or your mom? Imagine the FHE problems. Which wife is getting more Celestial boink time? Of course no one will be jealous. After all, God himself was so jealous of other gods he made a bunch of revenge commandments about them.

Once you start actually thinking about what they have taught (not just Mormonism), you have to either accept it is simply myth type story time, or shut off part of your brain.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 12:20PM

I only know what I was taught...

There is this thing called Intelligence.   I was never told where it came from, but it exists out there in space.  It was never described in terms of height, weight, or color.  In modern parlance, it's kinda like Dark Matter.

So Intelligence sits out there in space, and it just so happens that a daddy ghawd and a mommy ghawd can do something together that neither can do alone: make a spirit baby out of Intelligence. It was never discussed whether mommy and daddy get any jollies out of doing this, but I think those who made this up were hoping "climaxes" have always and will always exist.

The spirit baby that results from mommy and daddy rolling in the Intelligence possesses a body made of a material soooooo fine that humans don't have the ability to detect it.  Not even with an electron microscope.

So Elohim and all his wives hump "Intelligently" until they have whatever the correct number of spirit babies is, and when they've all been sufficiently schooled, a big meeting is called, and the kids are all reminded of the lessons they've learned in spirit school, including spirit college (Yay, Cougars!), then a Jesus-character and Lucifer-character get up, and each lays out an agenda and then all the spirit young adults vote, and then everybody gets a body except the Lucerites, who get tossed into outer darkness, which is what we called Black Holes back in the day.

The circumstances into which a spirit being is born here on Earth depend on his GPA and his/her behavior during The Great Debate/War.


I had a couple of questions that I never got answered, back before the 1978 Black Emancipation Declaration:

1)  If an African Black baby dies before the age of accountability, does that spirit baby get the same rewards/benefits as a Utah White baby who also dies before being able to sin?

2)  Does ghawd grade on a curve, and can you get extra credit for showing up early and staying late to put away the chairs?

3)  Ghawd knows EVERYTHING, including how we're all gonna do in this 'test,' and supposedly, we get to play it all out because otherwise, we'd have trust issues, so why didn't the 1/3 of the host of heaven (as opposed to Troy McClure, the toast of heaven), get to play the game, to see if any of them would repent and prove themselves worthy?

4)  If there is a "Plan!" involving 'turtles all the way down,' don't all the 'downstream' players over the almost 14 billion years of the Universe's existence approach infinity?


We had some fabulous discussions in the Priests class during Priesthood meetings, even though we used to pretend to be totally wiped out from our strenuous Saturday nights, including wondering if ghawd ever got blue balls...

I wish I had thought of Elohim's spermatozoa having wings and being eternal back then!  They could be flying around you right now!  Maybe that's why proper young women always sit with their legs crossed?

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Posted by: dagny ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 12:40PM

elderolddog Wrote:
> I wish I had thought of Elohim's spermatozoa having wings and being eternal back then!  They could be flying around you right now!  Maybe that's why proper young women always sit with their legs crossed?

By Jove! I think you have hit upon the origin of the incubus stories!

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: April 12, 2023 05:03PM

This will not have escaped your keen powers of observation, Jesus, but Orson Pratt said (first edition of Millennial Star, JoD) that spirit is invisible but particulate. The particles are spread through the universe like atoms and clusters sort of like dust and asteroids, planets and stars.

So the earth, which we know has a spirit and groans under the iniquity of its inhabitants, has a certain density of spirit; as do animals and people. Prophets, for example, are supernovas of spiritual intelligence and, by speculative extension, black holes might be those spiritual giants who collapse in upon themselves and are consigned to eternal darkness. Thus the difference between, say, a rock and a noble Lamanite is the concentration of spirit particles in the two objects.

There were four major conflicts between Pratt and BY (Bergera, Conflict in the Quorum). BY thought that Adam was God, that Lucy Mack Smith's account of JS was wrong and should be suppressed, that God still progressed spiritually and in terms of knowledge and not just in the number of worlds and spawn he produced, and that intelligence was not particulate. Ultimately Pratt won on the first three disputes but lost on the fourth.

Which is not to say that noble Lamanites are not full of particles of one sort or another: just that they aren't particles of intelligence.

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