Recovery Board  : RfM
Recovery from Mormonism (RfM) discussion forum. 
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In
Posted by: schrodingerscat ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 02:36PM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: slskipper ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 02:40PM

The fact is that I don't care. I have more important things to worry about.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/14/2023 02:40PM by slskipper.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Soft Machine ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 03:55AM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: schrodingerscat ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 02:48PM

I believe in a higher power, nature.
Not God or any kind of anthropomorphic deities.

I believe nature is a higher power. Nature, with its vast and intricate systems, can evoke a sense of awe, wonder, and reverence. The beauty, complexity, balance and harmony found in the natural world has led me to consider it a higher power or a divine force.

Nature can be seen as a source of logic, genius, wisdom, guidance, and spiritual connection. It is a powerful and life-sustaining force that operates beyond human control and comprehension. Nature is associated with concepts such as balance, cycles, renewal, and interconnectedness, which can be seen as expressions of a higher power.

However, as with any belief, the perception of nature as a higher power is subjective and varies among individuals. Some may align their higher power with religious deities, spiritual beings, the universe, or other sources of divine presence. Ultimately, the interpretation of a higher power is a personal and individual choice.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 03:39PM

>I believe nature is a higher power. Nature, with its vast and intricate systems, can evoke a sense of awe, wonder, and reverence.

Dear God, please make it stop. [the preceding reference is the extent of my belief in a higher power. BTW, I fully expect said higher power to fail to make it stop]


>Nature can be seen as a source of logic, genius, wisdom, guidance, and spiritual connection. It is a powerful and life-sustaining force that operates beyond human control and comprehension.

There is much about nature that humans cannot control, but there is obviously much that they can control, modify, or use to their own advantage or detriment.

As for humans not being able to comprehend nature, we comprehend quite a lot. Just because there are still unanswered questions does not mean we comprehend nothing. I expect there will always be unanswered questions because new answers tend to generate new questions.


>Nature is associated with concepts such as balance, cycles, renewal, and interconnectedness, which can be seen as expressions of a higher power.

It can be seen as the expression of a higher power. It can also be seen as simply the way the world works.

In the abstract world of integers, it turns out that they are very handy for counting things. The fact that there are prime numbers and that trait is very useful for doing things like reducing fractions to lowest terms, does not indicate that some higher power created prime numbers. That is just the way numbers work.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 08:38PM

> I believe in a higher power,
> nature. Not God or any kind
> of anthropomorphic deities.
> Not God or any kind of an-
> thropomorphic deities.

So...a smoke and mirrors ghawd?  A ghawd or ghawds who cannot be trusted to come through for you in a pinch?  A ghawd or ghawds who leave you hung out to dry on whichever 9/11 is your favorite?


> I believe nature is a higher
> power.  Nature, with its vast
> and intricate systems, can
> evoke a sense of awe, wonder,
> and reverence.  The beauty,
> complexity, balance and harmony
> found in the natural world has
> led me to consider it a higher
> power or a divine force.

            <barf>


> Nature can be seen as a source
> of logic, genius, wisdom, guidance,
> and spiritual connection.

Depending on who one is trying to impress or irritate, "... nature can be seen..." as whatever you need it to be, from one end of the spectrum to the other, from very good to very bad.  It all depends on who you're trying to impress or piss off.


> Ultimately, the interpretation
> of a higher power is a personal
> and individual choice.

It seems that if you actually believed each of us is entitled to a personal choice, you wouldn't be constantly harping on what YOU believe.  This is RfM, not FTC, wherever he may lead us.

But I have faith that nothing will change.  Seeking disciples is what humans do when they can't handle loneliness.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Roy G Biv ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 11:09AM

>> Nature is associated with concepts such as balance <<

You're out of balance on this subject as you are too fixated on it.

>> cycles <<

Your constant cycle of posting this is tiresome.

>> renewal <<

Renewing the topic as you do doesn't make it any more interesting.

>> and interconnectedness <<

Repeating this as you do doesn't connect us, in fact, it does the opposite.

>> which can be seen as expressions of a higher power. <<

Or just how things work.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: squirrely ( )
Date: September 16, 2023 09:21PM

Me too. Gaia is real and its obvious that there is organization in the universe.

Big Bang, Elements, Stars, Planets (earth), oceans, life, atmos - humans.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: cl2 ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 02:48PM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Rubicon ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 03:22PM

I don’t know. I’m happily agnostic. I’m perfectly fine with not knowing.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: CrispingPin ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 10:00PM

If there is a god, he/she/it isn’t represented by any religion that I have encountered, and they certainly don’t want us to know about them.

If there is one god, and one correct way to worship said deity, any sincere individual seeking the truth would come to the same conclusion.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Humberto ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 10:56PM

Do skiers believe in a higher powder?

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 01:03AM

Yes, and they worship it fervently--even the Lamanite skiers do.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: CrispingPin ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 07:14AM

There are some lamanite skiers, but the powder is always white and delightsome.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Greyfort ( )
Date: September 14, 2023 11:35PM

If you ask me, "Do you believe in God?" I would have to say, "No, I don't have such a belief." That makes me an atheist.

But if you ask me, "Does God exist," then I'd have to say, "I've no idea. I doubt it, but I don't know."

The simplest way for me to put it would be that the only real truth is that we just don't know.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: summer ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 07:28AM

I'm with you. I don't know, and I'm not particularly concerned about it. I suppose that makes me an agnostic, but I'm not fond of labels. It seems to me that it's the religious people who want to slap labels on everyone.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Greyfort ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 09:35AM

summer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm with you. I don't know, and I'm not
> particularly concerned about it. I suppose that
> makes me an agnostic, but I'm not fond of labels.
> It seems to me that it's the religious people who
> want to slap labels on everyone.


Yeah, I usually just say, "I'm not religious."

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: swordsman ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 04:26AM

Yes, I believe in God, more so than less important things. I feel happier for it than I was while an angry atheist.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Soft Machine ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 05:17AM

Good for you. I'm an atheist, but I'm not angry...

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 05:20AM

You are a very sweet atheist, one that a woman (or man!) could safely take home to meet mum.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: moehoward ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 09:18AM

I believe in Bacchus, the Roman god of wine.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 09:39AM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Done & Done ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 10:37AM

Who cares?

Claiming you know when you only believe is lying.

Belief is a dishonest substitute for not knowing.

Knowing you don't know is a valuable asset.


But geez Louise, Calling Nature god is needy.

It was a relief to have no reason to believe in a God.

It was a bigger relief to realize those speaking for him weren't speaking out their mouths, if you know what I mean. Wink wink nudge nudge.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: bradley ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 11:11AM

I believe in my imaginary friends. Sometimes they come through for me and sometimes they don't. I think that's evidence enough that they exist.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Happy_Heretic ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 11:29AM

I believe in 30 amps. 15 and 20 amps are just balderdash. So I believe in a higher power.


HH =)

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Humberto ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 04:31PM

I've been looking for a higher power and may have found it. The new BMW M1000R is just bonkers. One just might end up in my garage so that my invisible dragon has a place to sit.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: schrodingerscat ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 08:24PM

I don’t know either.
Neither do you.
Ultimately we are all agnostic, since nobody knows.
That’s why I asked what you believe, not what you know.
Most of you said you either don’t know and/or don’t care.
I get that.
But it is the ultimate question,

What created us?

I believe it was a ‘higher power’ (aka ‘God’ which, to me, is just short for “God Particle” since it’s more of a universal creative field than it is a particle.)
It is only an excitation of the field that collapses the wave function that creates sub-atomic particles, or the wave slows down to the point it takes on mass from the drag of the Higgs Boson (God Particle) like a bullet spinning through water and slowing down because of the drag.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 08:34PM

This was for all the new people.

The rest of us already knew
The Cat's feelings on this
issue, since he's been kind
enough to mention it once or
twice during his time here.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: bradley ( )
Date: September 15, 2023 10:38PM

But was it posted by the live cat or the dead cat?

"Time is the thing that keeps everything from happening all at once" - Steven Wright

What is time but the macroscopic effect of cascading wave function collapse? It does make for a nice word salad. Croutons?

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: September 16, 2023 10:05PM

I anxiously started a lengthy exposition of my views on the topic but then went out to Chuck-E-Cheese with my grandkids confident that if the thread closed before I could post, there'd be another opportunity tomorrow.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: September 16, 2023 11:31PM

No God in my life. Nature is all encompassing.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: September 17, 2023 12:56AM

Does God believe in us? He never calls, he never writes…

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: alsd ( )
Date: September 17, 2023 07:36AM

No.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: heartbroken ( )
Date: September 17, 2023 07:20PM

If there is a God/higher power, do I get brownie points for believing in it? Will I be punished for not believing in it? Will it matter at all if I do or don't believe in it? What is the benefit in believing?

Why would a higher power create human life just to see who does or does not believe a higher power exists? It seems a lot of effort just for that.

I've decided not to worry about the existence of a God/higher power or life after death. I guess they're connected. If there is a creator, fine. If not it doesn't really matter because when I die my brain will cease to function and I won't be able to worry about anything.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: ciena ( )
Date: September 17, 2023 09:18PM

Sounds as if you may almost know what you believe.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: schrodingerscat ( )
Date: September 17, 2023 11:08PM

I think I know what I believe,
I believe nature is our creator and meets all of the criteria of a god. The God Particle alone meets the requirement of being omnipresent and omnipotent.
Not to mention the Great Attractor and Lambda, the Cosmological Constant, Lambda.
God could be the fine structure constant 1/137, that keeps electrons spinning around the nuclei of atoms making atoms.
All of those qualify as a higher power, but not higher than nature.
Because Nothing is.
Except perhaps the singularity.
Where space and time go to die.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: September 18, 2023 12:55AM

I think you've written over half the opera, but it's going to need some more pizzazz, maybe some showgirls, to establish the point that a lower power is also important.

At least we know not to expect a Deus ex Machina; that would be cheating yourself.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: September 18, 2023 01:23AM

What about a God Particle ex Machina? Would not that meet all requirements?

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: bradley ( )
Date: September 18, 2023 03:40AM

It's the Great Attractor, Charlie Brown.

Weren't you just going on about wave function collapse? Is the part before quantum superposition of possible realities becomes physicality considered nature? Or is it precursor to the natural world?

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: bradley ( )
Date: September 17, 2023 09:27PM

What if God is real and I am the illusion?

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: donbagley ( )
Date: September 20, 2023 04:40AM

Like your name god will always be real or not real until the box is open, which may never happen.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: lapsed2 ( )
Date: September 25, 2023 08:43PM

Nope

Options: ReplyQuote
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In


Screen Name: 
Your Email (optional): 
Subject: 
Spam prevention:
Please, enter the code that you see below in the input field. This is for blocking bots that try to post this form automatically.
 **     **  **    **        **  **     **  ******** 
 **     **  ***   **        **  ***   ***  **    ** 
 **     **  ****  **        **  **** ****      **   
 **     **  ** ** **        **  ** *** **     **    
 **     **  **  ****  **    **  **     **    **     
 **     **  **   ***  **    **  **     **    **     
  *******   **    **   ******   **     **    **