I was taking an interactive online geography quiz last week with increasingly obscure locations to place on a map. Good old Moroni, Comoros was one of the questions. "Ah, well, being a good exmo, I know it's here in the Indian Ocean, sort of northwest of Madagascar."

But I keep Burundi and Brunei confused. Maybe if there were a connection to Mormonism.

Joseph Smith was a poor, humble, illiterate farm boy. He wouldn't have any access to an atlas in upstate NY in the early 19th century! Africa was unknown at that time. Silly exmormon!

I read somewhere about an atlas that was in the nearby public library during the 1820s. If I remember correctly, it showed the town of Moroni located in the Comorah (not Comoros) Islands.

I actually think this is the best evidence against the Book of Mormon that exists. I don't know anyone can look at this and not understand that somebody was making it all up. My only question is whether it was Joseph Smith or Solomon Spalding.

I assume your reply is tongue-in-cheek.

But let's take it at face value as something a "defender of the faith" might say.

Then the question is, "how do you know that there is no way Joseph Smith could have heard about Comoros and Moroni?" Just because we don't know of a definite connection doesn't mean that there is none. Remember there only has to be one!

Let me suggest the following as just one possibility:

After Joseph's leg operation he was sent to recover with relatives in Salem, Massachusetts. Salem is a port city and ships from all over the world docked there. Ships from both the "East India Company" and the "Old China Trade" among others regularly docked at Salem.

Is it possible that Joseph Smith sat and heard sailors tell of their travels and adventures around the world? Is it possible that the port of Moroni in the Comora islands was mentioned or figured prominently in some of those stories?

Also Joseph Smith and his family were involved in money digging in the upper New York area. That is precisely the area that many rumors had that Captain Kidd's treasure was buried. Many money diggers were hoping to find Captain Kidd's treasure. One would assume then that there was some awareness of Captain Kidd's adventures. One of the turning points in Kidd's career was when he was docked at the Comoro Islands for ship repairs and one-third of his crew died of cholera.

Could THIS story have been told by a local sailor-story-teller in giving background to the interest in Kidd's treasure?

Just because there was no map available in the Wayne Country Library that had Comoros and Moroni on it doesn't mean that Joseph Smith couldn't have heard of them.

Much of Mormon apologetics consists of bold, unsupported statements that "there is no way Joseph Smith could have known that." To which I have to ask, "how do you know there is no way Joseph Smith could have known that?"

So how does it benefit the mormon perspective if he didn't know?

Off the top, I can't see how sourcing the similar names shows any verity to the book.

Quoting Stan (from South Park)... "no, it proves that it isn't true!"

jpt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So how does it benefit the mormon perspective if
> he didn't know?
>

The claim is that the similarity is just an amazing coincidence and you can't use the similarity to say that Joseph Smith lifted the two names from his prior knowledge.

For this to be believable they have to say that the place names "Moroni" and "Comoro" (sometimes in the past spelled "Camora") could not have been part of Joseph Smith's prior knowledge. I contend that it very easily could have been.

Sporcle.com is a great site for learning geography and other lists. I now actually can name all 196 countries and about half their capitals. And all of the elements in the periodical table.

I do so much better at Jeopardy. I hope to find a better use for it all someday!

The fact his parents rented their farm in NY back from a man

named Lemuel Dufree is also a big ass coincidence.

Luman Walter (sometimes spelled "Laman") who just happened to be in the vicinity of Palmyra New York in the early 1820s and just happened to be a specialist in the occult and who just happened to hire himself out as a "seer" to help people find buried treasure....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luman_Walter#cite_note-3

Joseph Smith, Jr. must have pissed his pants in amazement when he saw those names Laman and Lemuel coming through the peepstone! Of all the names to be found in the early pages of an ancient book of scripture! What an inspirational coinkidingk! ;o)

Holy pooperdink! I never knew that the BOM names Laman and Lemuel had local sources in Josephs time. Thought I'd heard bout all of it. Man, it just never gets better for church history does it?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/02/2011 01:21AM by AmIDarkNow?.

Joseph Smith had to look no further than the Bible for the orgins of the vast majority of the names that he used:

LABAN is an actual biblical name as is LEMUEL. The name LAMAN is simply the name LABAN with the letter M substituted for the
letter B. LAMAN could also be formed by using the biblical name LAMA and simply adding the letter N on the end.


LABAN
Person, 1 Nephi 4:1
BIBLICAL NAME name: from LABAN, Genesis 31:1-2

LAMAN
Eldest son of Lehi, 1 Nephi 2:5
Lamanite king, Mosiah 7:21
Son of Laman, Mosiah 6:10
Nephite soldier, Alma 55:4
City, 3 Nephi 9:10
River, 1 Nephi 2:6-9
BIBLICAL ROOT: from LAMA, Matthew 27:46, LABAN, Genesis 24:29

LEMUEL
Second son of Lehi, 1 Nephi 2:5
Lamanite city, Alma 23:12-13
Valley, 1 Nephi 2:10
BIBLICAL NAME: from LEMUEL, Proverbs 31:1

Poor Lemuel died in the very year that the Book of Mormon translation was completed. I wonder if he ever got to see his name immortalized as the "Lemuel" half of the evil dynamic duo known as "Laman and Lemuel."

http://wayne.nygenweb.net/cemeteries/durfee.html

Poor little Joseph - such a tiny little world he lived in (in those limited travel days). No wonder his imagination ran amok.

Briggy

Moroni, Comoros--coincidence? "There's no way he could have known." (oh, really?).

Nahom--coincidence? "There's no way he could have known." (Right there on that altar--it's there! oh, really?).