This story will "out" me to those who know me. Ldscam's story was painful to read...and it brought up feeling I strive to repress.

My ex-wife is TBM. When we met she was inactive. We met at one of my keg-parties. Long story made short, she felt guilty and started going to church, and convinced me to go along. I was duped and joined. We went through all kinds of crap and married in the temple. I felt like a caged animal and started drinking later on. She has a dependent personality and followed my lead. She started drinking as well. She got out of control, but our divorce was based on other matters. After I left her, she spiraled out of control. I would show up at daycare to pick him up knowing that she would try to pick him up drunk. I always told her that I would drive her anywhere if she needed a ride.

Anyway, she told her parents she needed help. They loved to pretend shit away and blamed me for it.

She drove drunk one morning and killed the other driver.

Her parents blame me, and in a way, I blame myself.

She only started drinking because of me...

A day doesn't go by without me thinking about it. They all use it as an example of the word of wisdom.

I constantly wonder if I hadn't started drinking, would the victim still be alive.

I know the LDS church isn't true, but I feel
Guilt anyway...

She served time in prison, and it has affected my son...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2011 09:41AM by Lost Mystic.

Damn that's heavy.

Slippery slope thinking can make you blame yourself for anything. Don't go down that path. You didn't choose to drink and drive she did. Mormons card stack everything in their favor. Breaking the word of wisdom could just as easily save a life. A tired truck driver doesn't fall asleep at the wheel. Life saved by coffee. Just as possible and likely happens more often.

You may have set events in motion with her problem but ultimately she was the one who made a bad choice. You didn't put her behind that wheel. She did.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2011 12:21AM by The Man in Black.

The Man in Black Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> You may have set events in motion with her problem
> but ultimately she was the one who made a bad
> choice. You didn't put her behind that wheel. She
> did.

It's the setting things in motion thing that gets me. Yes, she made the choice, but I have some responsibility for getting the ball rolling. I can't deny that my actions played a role in events that took a life and caused grief to countless others...

To go back to where the ball first started rolling, you could look at your parents. If you were never born, you wouldn't have met your ex-wife, and started her drinking. Do your parents thus share some of the blame?

People who drink make their own decisions - some decide to drive drunk and some don't. 'Summer' is right: "no one forced her to get behind the wheel while drunk."

I was tired and worded that poorly.

Yes you may have introduced her to alcohol, one of the elements of what happened, but that is not the cause of what she did. Your introducing her to alcohol leading to her decision to drink and drive is slippery slope logic. You can easily blame yourself for almost anything if you do this. With this logic, her parents are just as culpable, having given birth to her. After all, if they hadn't had sex that night the victim (good call editing out the name) would also still be alive.

The Mormons may blame you but you are not to blame.

Please don't blame yourself for this. She was an adult that chose to drink and DRIVE. Everyone that drinks does it for their own reasons, not because someone *makes* them drink or influenced them to be drinkers. People that drink and drive make that terrible decision(to get behind the wheel) all on their own.

Lost Mystic Wrote:

She has a
> dependent personality
. . . . . . . . . . .
>
> She only started drinking because of me...

Lost Mystic, these two sentences struck me. Do you see the contradiction between them that I do?

I'm sorry you're burdened with this. I've found guilt is often a wish for control over things that happened. I do it to myself, too. It's painful.

Robert

She's an adult and she made her own decisions. No one forced her to drink alcohol; no one forced her to get behind the wheel while drunk.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2011 09:24AM by summer.

Just like quitting drinking has to be a person's own decision, and no one else's, starting to drink is also their own decision.

Lost Mystic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My ex-wife is TBM. When we met she was inactive.
> We met at one of my keg-parties.

She was drinking before you met if she came to one of your keg-parties. You have no way of knowing if your actions changed the outcome of her life. She could very well have ended up in the same place with or without you.

I am a recovering alcoholic, ex-Mormon. My husband is an active alcoholic, inactive Mormon.

The dynamics of our drinking history together are twisted, intertwined, co-dependent. But during my recovery, I've learned that I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR MY HUSBAND'S CHOICES OR ACTIONS. I am only responsible for my own sobriety.

Alcoholism in others: I didn't cause it; I can't control it; I can't cure it.

I've asked my husband dozens of times not to drive drunk, but to call somebody in the family (or a taxi) for a ride home. He's never called - do you know why? Because at that level of intoxication his brain cannot reason. He doesn't know he's drunk. He doesn't recognize that he's impaired. He has zero cause-effect thinking capabilities. Therefore he doesn't understand the possible catastrophic outcomes of his choices.

Same with your ex-wife.

Alcoholism is a progressive disease that your ex was probably already working on *before* you met her.

It's not your fault. My best healing wishes to you and your son.

I am so very sorry Lost Mystic. Alcoholism is a terrible disease with even more terrible consequences.

With that said, my husband's father was a severe non-functioning alcoholic and although my husband enjoys an alcoholic beverage a few times per month, he's far from being an alcoholic himself. With your argument, because his father drank daily and there was always a variety of available alcohol, my husband should be an alcoholic too.

Additionally, if my husband started to do Meth for example, I still would choose to never partake myself. Period, no exceptions! In Mormon world, wouldn't the crazy term "Free Agency" apply to your wife?

Mormons feel that by having women dress in modest clothing, men won't have impure sexual thoughts. Mmmm...Why are porn subscriptions in Utah among the highest in the nation? Mormons feel that putting up a literal iron curtain in restaurants so children don't ever see alcoholic beverages being served will prevent alcoholism. Bull! This method never works because certain people tend to want what they have been forbidden to have. My point is, you absolutely did not cause your wife's alcohol problem. With or without you, she would have found her way there on her own.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2011 12:50PM by christieja.

You were divorced when she was involved in the accident, correct? I think that is a key factor, wherein you cannot underscore the importance. If you would have tried to intervene, control, or influence her post divorce - you would have been considered a control freak by her parents. There wasn't much you could do post divorce. I don't think you are responsible for her poor behavior. Her parents could have helped her more. As an ex-husband there's not much you can do. My ex is very very promiscuous (spell?). I still have multiple teen girls living with her as the primary parent. Even though my ex still considers herself a TBM and goes to church every Sunday, she has sex with almost every guy she meets on a popular on-line dating site. I wish she wouldn't set such a poor example to my teen girls - but there is not a damn thing I can do about it. I suppose I could blame myself for divorcing her, "gosh, if I hadn't divorced her, this wouldn't be happening, she had emotional problems, I should have stayed to help her." I don't blame myself for her poor behavior. Don't you blame yourself either.

I appreciate your responses. I see I have faulty logic leading to feelings of guilt...

Makes sense in my head, but it may take a while for it to sink in. Who knows, I've been holding onto the pain for so long, perhaps it's just become a habit...

to take even that first drink. You are not responsible for her choices. She drove the car drunk, not you.

Why are you looking for reasons to blame yourself for what someone else did?
I'd suggest you get some good counseling on how to handle this kind of guilt and misplaced blame.

I was trying to come up with something like that but was having trouble.

By either direct input or by their general demeanour they made it very clear to her that they blamed YOU for her lifestyle choices.

That was actually them giving her the go-ahead for drink driving. Why? Because, damn, it, she could not control herself! It was all her evil ex-husband's fault!

They took her ability to control herself away from her. They infantalised her thus they put a dangerous, drunken little girl behind the wheel of a car. Well done, mom! Well done, dad! But don't you go taking any of that responsibility, will you? Just dump it all on the doorstep of that evul ex-Mormon!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2011 04:21PM by matt.