that we "believe" the Church is true, Js is a Prophet, & etc.

Instead we were to say that we "KNOW" the church is true, JS is a Prophet, & etc.

Anyone else remember this? Can't remember when exactly it was. I'm thinking it was the 70's.

Yeah I remember this but it was more recent unless they had to do it again as a refresher course about what you are supposed to say. I just try not to snore to loud during the whole thing it makes the wife upset when I snore.

By the time I came on the scene I was told that I "knew" it was true, or at least that's what my mom and the primary teachers kept whispering in my ear...

Yeah, when they did the entire 'a valid testimony consists of these 3 points (BoM, JS and the church being true) I was all but what about Christ? Shouldn't any testimony be founded on the person who paid for my sins, not his mortal mouth pieces?

You'll be happy to know that Jesus is now sharing the glove on the testimony glove. Of course Joseph Smith takes the central position on the big middle finger of the glove. But Jesus is right there as his right hand man, so to speak. Or should that be "right finger man"?

http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=21bc9fbee98db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&locale=0&sourceId=1d2791ddb6b9c110VgnVCM100000176f620a____

http://nowscape.com/mormon/Testimony_Glove.htm

IDK, seems like the middle finger is just about right for JS.

Went from "Teach me all that I must know..." to "Teach me all that I must do..."

Obey OBey OBEy OBEY OBEY!

They had to know what they were doing in the brainwashing department with that one.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2011 08:34PM by steve benson.

How creepy. But of course, the Morg teaches members must "do" callings, etc. to get their eternal reward. Much different than most mainstream Christian churches who teach salvation by grace through faith in JC. Oh, no! We can't teach that salvation is FREE!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/2011 08:01AM by FreeRose.

None of this wimpy, mealy-mouthed "I believe the Church is true" stuff. Mormon Man of the Year Orrin Hatch demonstrates how to bear the steadfast and correct testimony . . .

In another thread, RfM poster "sonoma' writes:

"I was a kid when the Cult leadership instructed us that we were no longer to say when bearing our testimonies that we 'believe' the Church is true, Joseph Smith is a Prophet, & etc.

"Instead we were to say that we 'KNOW' the Church is true, Jospeh Smith is a Prophet, & etc.

"Anyone else remember this? Can't remember when exactly it was. I'm thinking it was the 70's."
_____


Here's what I remember, thank you Mega-Mormon Brother/Utah Senator Orrin Hatch:

On CBS's "60 Minutes" program, broadcast on 7 April 1996, Mike Wallace explained to a national audience Mormonism's tall tale of the First Vision--and then asked Hatch what he thought of the whole thing:

Mike Wallace: "[The Mormon] church says God and Jesus spoke with [its] founder Joseph Smith back in eighteen hundred and twenty and told him to start this church. . . .

"He was 14 years old . . . a backwoods farm boy . . . in New York State. . . .

"Fourteen years old, and God and Jesus come to see him? . . .

[Voiceover with footage of Hatch on U.S. Senate floor]

". . . [T]he senior US Senator from Utah, Orrin Hatch, a Mormon, believes it . . .

[cut to Wallace interview with Hatch]

Orrin Hatch: "We believe that we know that this happened."
_____


Uh? Rewind the tape.

Orrin Hatch: "We believe that we know that this happened."

"WE BELIEVE THAT WE KNOW THAT THIS HAPPENED?"

Lordy, it doesn't get much stronger than that.

In the name of Jesus Christ. Amen, sort of, I think.

an Orrin Hatch descendant and produce a child of sorts. It will be a Mormon politician and will bear it's testimony:

"There are things that we know, we know. That is to say there are known knowns. And there are things that we know that we don't know or known unknowns, as well as things that we don't know we don't know, or unknown unknowns. But as for the truthfulness of the Church and its divine origins, as well as the divine mission of Joseph Smith, I believe that I know it after the manner of a known known, to the full extent that it does not constitute an unknown unknown, which I do not believe is the case. Or rather I do not not believe that it is the case. In any case I believe that I know that it is not a known unknown."

I never take a testimony seriously until I hear it sealed up with the fiber-and-bean confirmation. If you're not willing to put the fibers of your bean on the line, you're not really committed to what you're saying.

perhaps THAT'S why the GA's are such old GAS BAGS!

"Or rather I do not not believe that it is NOT the case...."

I don't want to be guilty of misquoting a future Rumsfeldian Hatched politician. ;o)

Gorspel Dacktrin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> an Orrin Hatch descendant and produce a child of
> sorts. It will be a Mormon politician and will
> bear it's testimony:
>
> "There are things that we know, we know. That is
> to say there are known knowns. And there are
> things that we know that we don't know or known
> unknowns, as well as things that we don't know we
> don't know, or unknown unknowns. But as for the
> truthfulness of the Church and its divine origins,
> as well as the divine mission of Joseph Smith, I
> believe that I know it after the manner of a known
> known, to the full extent that it does not
> constitute an unknown unknown, which I do not
> believe is the case. Or rather I do not not
> believe that it is the case. In any case I believe
> that I know that it is not a known unknown."
-----------

...but an unhelpful known which is better left unknown.

Anagrammy



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2011 10:47PM by anagrammy.

You must have been using a peepstone. ;o)

I think there's a granite monument somewhere in Salt Lake City just waiting for this to be inscribed on it:



"There are things that we know, we know. That is to say there are known knowns. And there are things that we know that we don't know or known unknowns, as well as things that we don't know we don't know, or unknown unknowns. But as for the truthfulness of the Church and its divine origins, as well as the divine mission of Joseph Smith, I believe that I know it after the manner of a known known, to the full extent that it does not constitute an unknown unknown, which I do not believe is the case. Or rather I do not not believe that it is not the case. In any case I believe that I know that it is not a known unknown but is an unhelpful known which is better left unknown."

It sometimes sounds like he's saying something important, but when you go back and review what he said, it just makes your head hurt.

Hinckley and Rumsfeld probably went to the same special academy for bloviational speakers.