Many here on RFM/ExMo are recovering from The Church and this forum helps them in processing their indignation/anger/ frustration/feelings of manipulation- you name it. Certainly they are justified in doing so, and I urge them onward.

In my attempt to evolve away from The Church I have tried to understand why its leaders believe in and promote the things they do. For many former and transitioning Mormons they are liars and cheats. Rather than use these terms, it now is more mentally pleasing for me to say “Agenda-speakers”.

Admission: I have an agenda myself. I have found that telling the truth is not always the most optimal thing to do, especially in dealing with neighbors, spouse and sometimes my boss. But I don’t consider myself a liar. “Yes, Dear….. tonight’s dinner was fantastic. I was hoping that you’d make your special tuna-patties”. “Sorry, Bob, but Judy and I have a previous engagement this coming Friday night, but we’d like to thank you for your kind invitation to come over and watch your vacation movies. “Bob, I know that that report was due on your desk first thing this morning, but my computer crashed last night, however, it’s coming out of the printer now”.

To many, telling such “facilitating” lies are anathema, and will consider me sub-human. Perhaps they are right. But I have to agree with Mr. Packer and his handlers that some truths/details don’t need to be told. Of course, Mr. Packer and I have different views about what constitutes a “facilitating” lie, or omission.

I now put Mormon Agenda Speakers in the same pot as, say Republicans and Democrats, America’s leading political parties.

Republicans are not telling lies or omitting facts, (although may be). They are just promoting their agenda.

Democrats are not telling lies or omitting facts (although they may be). They are just promoting their agenda

Mormon leaders are not telling lies. They are just promoting their agenda, despite how whacky or inconsistent it is with generally accepted facts. I don’t have to believe it.

I personally believe that Joseph Smith was America’s first Comic Book author, when he produced the Adventures of Nephi, Mormon and Moroni. But, it’s their agenda to say that Mr. Smith produced the book under the direction of God. I just don’t have to believe it.

Happily, many – like on this board – are no longer part of the Mormon agenda, and I like them very much, even though I don’t like the extreme terms they sometimes use.

Eastbourne Wrote:
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> Mormon leaders are not telling lies. They are
> just promoting their agenda, despite how whacky or
> inconsistent it is with generally accepted facts.

Well, what are they useful untruths?

> I personally believe that Joseph Smith was
> America’s first Comic Book author, when he
> produced the Adventures of Nephi, Mormon and
> Moroni. But, it’s their agenda to say that Mr.
> Smith produced the book under the direction of
> God.

More than that, they require ala 1984 that members believe The Book of Mormon was ACTUAL history!!!????#@#%

That I can't just say, well Scientologists believe that 75 million years ago things happened that didn't really happen that involved aliens.

Smith and Co say that actual people existed hundreds of years ago that didn't exist.

This is bad religion to a degree of deceit degrees of magnitude greater than looking for the lost ark (either one) because the myths involved can't actually be compared with things well within the times of reliable recorded history. The Book of Mormon is from The Golden Age of Greece to well within the Common Era.

This is what I find so maddening. As a boy I loved "The Book of Mormon Stories" and I was taught they were history.

You seem to be justifying Mormon lies by saying they are pushing an agenda. However, their agenda itself is the problem. They want more money and power, while pretending to care about the needs of their members. This is a much bigger lie than the superficial lies you cite.

Yes, telling your spouse that dinner was great could be a lie, but what is the underlying motive? To keep peace in the home and avoid an unnecessary fight. When LDS missionaries lie about the Book of Mormon, wittingly or not, they are pushing a nefarious agenda to enrich the church by robbing members of their time, energy and money.

The agenda is the lie, not just the tactical lies they tell.