I love Sotomayor's statement. Roberts statement seems applicable to the Mormon church. Every member a missionary, and a lay clergy where all members are expected to "teach the doctrines." I like the last statement too.

There was an interesting response that said that if the woman was a minister then she should be able to take the tax exemptions, if she can't she is not a minister. So can all Mormons claim to be ministers on their tax forms? Can Bishops? At what level can members claim to be ministers? Only when they are receiving a living stipend?

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Will it open a legal crack for prosecuting religions whose practices violate federal law?

http://www.npr.org/2011/10/05/141089062/high-court-considers-disabilities-act-dispute
"Under church doctrine, ministers are required to resolve all disputes within the church. Thus, the church argues that Perich is exempt from the provisions of the Americans with Disabilities Act and has no right to go to court to win back her job."

""Justice Sonia Sotomayor then turned the questioning to whether religious institutions are immune from lawsuits when they fire a person on the basis of a pretext, asking, "How about a teacher who reports sexual abuse to the government and is fired because of that reporting?" Doesn't society have a right to say certain conduct is unacceptable even when it occurs in a religious institution, she asked.""

"Roberts did not relent, noting that some churches view all its members as ministers."

"That prompted Justice Scalia to ask how a minister should be defined. A person is a minister, Laycock replied, if it is "per your job responsibilities to teach the doctrines of the faith.""

"When a religious organization enters the public arena, as it does when it sets up schools, it is involved with government rules, and those rules have to be applied with neutrality. In other words, there is no automatic exemption for those the church dubs ministers."

I wonder whether that will shape their views of the situation.

My personal view is that just because an institution is a religion, it doesn't mean they can do whatever they want. For example, the government would step in if a religion were sacrificing humans, or even just causing physical harm. So where is the magic line between that sort of mistreatment and hiring/firing policies? Why does being employed or ordained take away your civil rights? Does the church then own you?

of a business. Which they are...they provide services of a dubious nature, but it's buyer beware, right?

I see religion as a service industry. Churches should not receive tax exemptions just for existing, IMO.

They also went after Jim Jones. It is clear that there are circumstance where the government feels justified in going after a church or its leaders.

I agree that churches should be treated like a service industry. Religions should not be allowed to abuse their members just because they teach mythology.

As I recall, when I first went through the temple, I was taught that a minister was someone who was paid by Satan to deceive the children of God. I wonder if Satan is required to follow the ADA.

So what is the supreme court's definition of a priest ?

Of interest is Utah Code as to who legally can perform marriages in the state:

UC30-1-6. Who may solemnize marriages --
(1) Marriages may be solemnized by the following persons only:
(a) ministers, rabbis, or priests of any religious denomination who are:
(i) in regular communion with any religious society; and
(ii) 18 years of age or older;........

(4) Notwithstanding any other provision in law, no person authorized under Subsection (1) to solemnize a marriage may delegate or deputize another person to perform the function of solemnizing a marriage........

I always wondered if Monson is the head "minister" or "priest" of the church then his authorizing Temple Presidents to do marriages seems to be in violation of Utah law??!!

And how will the Fed Supreme Court's opinion effect this law??

From the link above "The case before the court began when Cheryl Perich, a tenured teacher at a parochial school, took disability leave after she was diagnosed with narcolepsy. When her doctor certified that she was ready to return to work, the school asked her to resign, and when she threatened to sue under the Americans with Disabilities Act, she was fired."

....so I had bad cases of narcolepsy almost every sacrament meeting, do I get some disability payment?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/08/2011 08:56PM by jw the inquizzinator.