My TBM brother is in town with his son visiting my kids and family. Today he told me he was downloading a free version of Starcraft 2 for those of u that are familiar with video games. It is mildly violent. I sat down on the couch and flipped on the tv and the xbox to call of duty to shoot up some zombies.

My TBM bro got nervous and said that it is too violent for his 8 year old. I let my 2 eight year olds play it with me on split screen. At any rate, where does on dry the line in the sand between too violent a video game and one that is appropriately violent?

I told him, "hey, just imagine that I am one of the stripling warriors fending off the evil laminites and that its by the faith of my mother that I stand tall against these mildly violent creatures. LOL.

One other funny thing happened. I discretely asked him today if he knew when the next time the LDS church would display the actual papyri on temple square. He looked at me funny. I said, "you heard that they were found in 1966 in a museum in NY?" He said "No". I said "ya the church displayed it along with the pepperbox gun that Joseph used to fend off the angry mob in his final hour. He still looked perplexed. I dropped it for the moment and asked him an hour later "so David, you mean to tell me you never heard about the papyri being found and it was confirmed by Hugh Nibly etc..." I also asked him if his wife knew and he said he didn't know (she ready to allow him to practice polygamy due to her strong faith, she cries when she confesses this fact and bears her testamony about the true and everlasting covenent).

My brother finalized his comment on the subject by saying that he has heard some stuff on the POGP and the papyri but he has never been interested in such things.

How the heck can you not be interested in seeing the actual papyri that Joseph claims he translated into the POGP and has taught us so many wonderful things about the gospel? LOL I wonder if he was really trying to avoid the conversation with me?

*where does one draw the line in the sand between too violent a video game and one that is appropriately violent?

Call me evil if you want, buy when my son was 5 he watched me play COD modern warfare 2, and I would occasionally let him sit in my lap while I controlled the character and he would pull the trigger.

And I told him about the BoA during a conversation he brought up about not thinking JS was a prophet.

I agree that your brother's lack of curiosity about the papyri is not only perplexing, but kind of sad, and maybe a bit alarming.

Of course, if he follows the party line of not searching for information outside of that provided by the church, perhaps he has reached a point where all curiosity has been snuffed. Church manuals are so deadly dull, and information is so stilted that maybe he just doesn't care.

I didn't know that they had been discovered until I started visiting this site. 50 years in TSCC and never heard a peep about it...

As a TBM I had no interest in researching church history at all. Sunday School bored the bejesus out of me and suckrament meeting and priesthood were even worse. The idea of looking up church crap on my own time would have been rejected as a total non-starter.

It should have interested me. I'm not arguing that point. At the time I took it for granted that the church was true and it was all I could do to "endure to the end".

I don't think many mormons today would even be able to tell you what doctrine is in the POGP, so why would they care to see the scrolls. Now if it was the Gold Plates!!!!! you'd have people lining up around the corner for those.

Speaking for myself here, I grew up in the 80's and I never knew the story of Mr. Chandler selling the mummies and scrolls to Joseph. I never realized the importance of the POGP until I went to the temple and in the waiting chapel found skinny POGPs in the song book holders of the benches. I think that once the scrolls were found and investigated, the church began to pull back from the POGP especially the book of abraham. I also think that at some time in the future, the facsimile drawings will simply disappear from the book during a new edition print.

I do have to say, smooth move on setting up the question to your brother and also mentioning the pepperbox gun of J.S.

Someone who likes to be told "this is what you believe." Someone who thinks if they cross all the t's and dot all the i's the way the Profit says they will make it to the CK.

When they get there Joe will be guarding the gate and review their life.
1. Worshiped me? Check
2. Obeyed the living profit? Check
3. Payed tithing? Check
4. Did everything and every job the bishop asked? Check
5. Didn't ever read or listen to any anti material? Check
6. Remember the secret handshake? Check

After running through dozens of items on the check list Joe says, "Good job! Here's the address of the solar system where you get your own planet. Based on your faithfulness I think you deserve six new wives to help start populating your planet. Line forms to the right where your six new wives will be assigned to you. Don't forget to send your weekly tithe of your profits back to this planet."

This one issue was the smoking gun for me. My limited knowledge of polygamy was disturbing but I was satisfied knowing it was kind of shelved. The Book of Mormon didn't seem all that historical but it wasn't enough to push me over the edge. Book of Abraham?? Holy $hit!! We have that? I was floored. Why haven't I ever heard this news? Why wasn't my Mission President telling me about this? My Parents? My Bishop? My seminary teachers? The general authority that married my wife and I?

Oh that's right... its all B.S. "Never you mind that whole Papyri stuff. The Lord works in mysterious ways." Yes he does. The invisible and the non-existent work in the EXACT same way.

Ditto.

I can't understand why my parents never told me about it. (I can really...) They were members when this would have been global news! I expect 90% of active Mormons at the time would have heard something about this. Yet now, those who still believe at least, are strangely silent.

How can anybody still believe if they know that Joseph Smith MADE UP the BoA? How can even the most gullible continue to believe JS translated the BoM if he screwed up so monumentally with the BoA?

This comment is more to the violent video game. I played sports as a kid so i didn't play alot of videogames. As an exmo single adult in the late 90's, i was shocked by the events at columbine high school. Reading up on the story ,i saw where the 2 killers played the video game Doom compulsivley. Curious i purchased a copy of the game and guess what, that shit be addicting. After a few weeks of compulsive playing, i realized that to someone with a damaged psyche, this game would not be theraputic. My 9 y.o. nephew played it constantly and he's now a college student. I think for well adjusted supervised kids, it's harmless fun

When my TBM bro got into town, we stayed up a little watching t.v. and talking whatever about politics, investing, the economy etc... During that conversation while watching Jay Leno, (I live in Colorado not far from Columbine H.S.), they played the "I am a Mormon Commercials at least 8 times in 1 hour. I noticed how every person was minority. My bro turns to me and says "its sad that it has to come to this". I said "what do you mean?" He said, "That we have to show commercials of us so that ppl think we are really human and not animals". I laughed. I just didn't have the heart last night to tell him the real reason.

It looks like the morg is trying to recruit minorities. That is pretty affirmative active of them LOLOLOL!!! What a joke.

This whole experience has been really eye opening for me. In fact, scary. The extremism in his position is strong and almost homocidal. He is a very passive church boy whose wife wears the pants and doesn't let him sit idle for a minute when he is around the house, so he plans a quick father son trip to visit the cousins just so he can play some video games and watch some racey shows on FX and Sci Fi channel.

He took his kid and my kids to the movies tonight and he was very careful to make sure the rating was very age appropriate. LOL

Its sad though. My word, like its said in this thread, if it was the golden plates, holy cow!!! But since its the papyri, "ah that ain't no big deal". Gimmie a break!! Wake the F___ Up!

I am being suttle with him in my approach. Tomorrow I am gonna ask him if he has heard of Mary Rollins Lightner to see if he heard about her profound mission in the church.

I could mention the GA who quoted Whitmer as describing JS using a seer stone in a hat to translate the BoM rather than the Urim and Thummin. "Hey Bro, was the BoM translated by a stone in a hat or a Urim and Thummin?"

What do you think?