Hello All! I'm back and need to vent.

My mormon coworker (gay, closeted, married, etc.) is finally admitting that he likes Romney only because he's mormon. He then said that he doesn't follow politics closely (a lie) and that mormons aren't perfect (to explain away his nonchalance at Romney's two-faces).

If my coworker wasn't so into politics, why were his feelings hurt so bad when McCain beat Romney in '08 that he was thinking about voting for Obama?

If he really likes free enterprise so badly, why did he try to sue because of his termination? Why can't he let the free enterprise system, that he preaches about so much, work itself out instead of suing to right a wrong from the free enterprise system?

Why is he accepting unemployment benefits if he's against big government (and creating more debt to give him these benefits)?

Most importantly: He's GAY! Why is he voting with a party that is anti-gay?

This guy is nutty and refuses to think for himself. With his lifestyle, employment history, sexual preference, living paycheck to paycheck, you'd think he'd be a hardcore liberal. Nope! He's as conservative as they come, with his hand out to the government for unemployment insurance and his lusting after men.

He disgusts me with his stances. He's the only mormon I know. I'm sure there are others just as screwed up as he is... standing against everything that he is, gay and barely making it yet he votes like a heterosexual millionaire bigot.

Did I tell you he's asked me for the third year in a row why we get Martin Luther King Day off? He's trying too hard to be a redneck. He can't be. Rednecks don't even like mormons.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/16/2012 01:37AM by newcomer.

I know a ton of mormons that are Rednecks. Way more than I am comfortable with. So, you're way wrong on that assumption.

You seem to know everything about this guy. Are you a psychic?

snb Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You seem to know everything about this guy. Are
> you a psychic?

I'm the IT guy... I know he had gay porn on his computers. A huge stash.

Haha, ok, fair enough. Well played sir, well played. You would know quite a bit about the poor chap. :)

You mentioned that this guy was married and poor. Is he married to a man whether legal or not? If so, he isn't hiding much of what he is at least in terms of sexual orientation. As far as these other issues go, (the hypocritical ones) you should ask him exactly as you have here. Say you are talking to him and say these things......
"why did you try to sue because of your termination? Why can't you let the free enterprise system, that you preach about so much, work itself out instead of suing to right a wrong from the free enterprise system?

Why are you accepting unemployment benefits if you're against big government since you are creating more debt by receiving these benefits)?

Maybe he doesn't realize how contradictory he sounds. Worth a try.

B/c or how difficult to strictly live by TBM rules, I have noticed many TBMs who are not measuring up to those strict standards seem to be forecd into being hypocrites just to save their repupations endlessly while they try to get all of the things the church wants them to do done. I honestly believe that some TBMs would prefer to have reputation as a hypocrite than a bad Mormon. The guy sounds real unhappy.

Is he attending TSCC with a male spouse? How is the RS and bishop prick taking that?

enoughenoch19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You mentioned that this guy was married and poor.
> Is he married to a man whether legal or not? If
> so, he isn't hiding much of what he is at least in
> terms of sexual orientation. As far as these other
> issues go, (the hypocritical ones) you should ask
> him exactly as you have here. Say you are talking
> to him and say these things......
> "why did you try to sue because of your
> termination? Why can't you let the free enterprise
> system, that you preach about so much, work itself
> out instead of suing to right a wrong from the
> free enterprise system?
>
> Why are you accepting unemployment benefits if
> you're against big government since you are
> creating more debt by receiving these benefits)?
>
> Maybe he doesn't realize how contradictory he
> sounds. Worth a try.
>
> B/c or how difficult to strictly live by TBM
> rules, I have noticed many TBMs who are not
> measuring up to those strict standards seem to be
> forecd into being hypocrites just to save their
> repupations endlessly while they try to get all of
> the things the church wants them to do done. I
> honestly believe that some TBMs would prefer to
> have reputation as a hypocrite than a bad Mormon.
> The guy sounds real unhappy.
>
> Is he attending TSCC with a male spouse? How is
> the RS and bishop prick taking that?


He has a wife and his wife knows she's gay, like the assistant coach at Syracuse's Men's Basketball team. Bernie Fine's wife knew he was gay yet she married him anyways.

He's not out. He's soft spoken and quiet like a lot of religious people. He's weird, but then again, accountants are weird people to begin with; this is why they're accountants and not in a customer service profession.

I've pushed him in the past on his hypocrisy indirectly. I gave him a film about the US' debt called "I.O.U.S.A.." His response was "yeah Bush was on the side of the rich," but that's it!

I don't talk about his sexuality, because a) it's at work, b) I think he likes me (more than friends) and c) he has a family and kids.

Not that it's my business, but I doubt he's acted on his preference. He tries to follow the scripture even when it is to his detriment, like above.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/16/2012 09:37AM by newcomer.

Mormons are not the only ones who'll vote along tribal lines. Democrats and Republicans, progressives liberals independents conservatives and libertarians, will do the same on election day. (I doubt that Independents are as independent as they are made out to be.)

You wrote:

"My mormon coworker (gay, closeted, married, etc.) is finally admitting that he likes Romney only because he's mormon."

And elsewhere this is true, too:

"My democratic coworker (anti-war, anti-1%, pro-civil liberties, etc.) is finally admitting he likes Obama only because he's a Democrat [and not a Republican]."



As ex-mormons we see the limitations and abuses of the tribalism of which we once belonged. As ex-mormons the next step is to see how tribalism on a larger scale, in politics say, is even more limiting and abusive. As ex-mormons we have an advantage over many of our fellow citizens precisely because we once belonged to a tribe and then left the tribe. We can see tribalism for what it is.

One of the most dangerous tribes in America is the MSM, not the least of which because of the bifurcated political narrative they subject Americans to. Bob Somerby at The Daily Howler has selflessly documented their tribal antics, at the peril of 'truth, justice and the american way', since 1998:

http://dailyhowler.blogspot.com/

The incomparable archives:

http://www.dailyhowler.com/

Bob Somerby has done for the critique of the Mainstream Media (MSM) what Richard Packham has done for the critique of Mormonism.



A recent example of media tribalism came at the expense of Glenn Greenwald (nothing new) and this entry at Salon.com:

http://www.salon.com/2011/12/31/progressives_and_the_ron_paul_fallacies/singleton/

Greenwald discusses the tribal imperative that came after him here:

http://www.salon.com/2012/01/05/democratic_party_priorities/singleton/

and here:

http://www.salon.com/2012/01/08/the_evils_of_indefinite_detention_and_those_wanting_to_de_prioritze_them/singleton/

Bob Somerby draws attention to the MSM tribal attacks on Greenwald and says this:

"…we strongly recommend Greenwald’s recent struggles concerning this topic. The call of the tribe is very strong. Indeed, it’s one of the strongest of all pre-human imperatives."

http://dailyhowler.blogspot.com/2012/01/glenn-greenwald-call-of-tribe.html



There's an important 'recovery from mormonism' aspect to all of this. Since it is overwhelmingly human to want to belong somewhere, the temptation to jump from the tribe of mormonism to yet another tribe is at the very least clear and present. But we don't have to. We can use the same skills that got us out of the mormon tribe to spot and assess the various other tribes that are out there and the apologists who advocate for them. I'm not saying that since we left the mormon tribe we must therefore go through the rest of our life tribe-less. No. But we can and should be weary of the various tribes that want our attention etc., and we can and should be more aware of the shortcomings etc. of the tribes in which we do belong.

Human

Human Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Mormons are not the only ones who'll vote along
> tribal lines. Democrats and Republicans,
> progressives liberals independents conservatives
> and libertarians, will do the same on election
> day. (I doubt that Independents are as
> independent as they are made out to be.)
>
> You wrote:
>
> "My mormon coworker (gay, closeted, married, etc.)
> is finally admitting that he likes Romney only
> because he's mormon."
>
> And elsewhere this is true, too:
>
> "My democratic coworker (anti-war, anti-1%,
> pro-civil liberties, etc.) is finally admitting he
> likes Obama only because he's a Democrat ."
>
>
>
> As ex-mormons we see the limitations and abuses of
> the tribalism of which we once belonged. As
> ex-mormons the next step is to see how tribalism
> on a larger scale, in politics say, is even more
> limiting and abusive. As ex-mormons we have an
> advantage over many of our fellow citizens
> precisely because we once belonged to a tribe and
> then left the tribe. We can see tribalism for
> what it is.
>
> One of the most dangerous tribes in America is the
> MSM, not the least of which because of the
> bifurcated political narrative they subject
> Americans to. Bob Somerby at The Daily Howler has
> selflessly documented their tribal antics, at the
> peril of 'truth, justice and the american way',
> since 1998:
>
> http://dailyhowler.blogspot.com/
>
> The incomparable archives:
>
> http://www.dailyhowler.com/
>
> Bob Somerby has done for the critique of the
> Mainstream Media (MSM) what Richard Packham has
> done for the critique of Mormonism.
>
>
>
> A recent example of media tribalism came at the
> expense of Glenn Greenwald (nothing new) and this
> entry at Salon.com:
>
> http://www.salon.com/2011/12/31/progressives_and_t
> he_ron_paul_fallacies/singleton/
>
> Greenwald discusses the tribal imperative that
> came after him here:
>
> http://www.salon.com/2012/01/05/democratic_party_p
> riorities/singleton/
>
> and here:
>
> http://www.salon.com/2012/01/08/the_evils_of_indef
> inite_detention_and_those_wanting_to_de_prioritze_
> them/singleton/
>
> Bob Somerby draws attention to the MSM tribal
> attacks on Greenwald and says this:
>
> "…we strongly recommend Greenwald’s recent
> struggles concerning this topic. The call of the
> tribe is very strong. Indeed, it’s one of the
> strongest of all pre-human imperatives."
>
> http://dailyhowler.blogspot.com/2012/01/glenn-gree
> nwald-call-of-tribe.html
>
>
>
> There's an important 'recovery from mormonism'
> aspect to all of this. Since it is overwhelmingly
> human to want to belong somewhere, the temptation
> to jump from the tribe of mormonism to yet another
> tribe is at the very least clear and present. But
> we don't have to. We can use the same skills that
> got us out of the mormon tribe to spot and assess
> the various other tribes that are out there and
> the apologists who advocate for them. I'm not
> saying that since we left the mormon tribe we must
> therefore go through the rest of our life
> tribe-less. No. But we can and should be weary
> of the various tribes that want our attention
> etc., and we can and should be more aware of the
> shortcomings etc. of the tribes in which we do
> belong.
>
> Human


I'm calling BS to you "democratic friend."

And yes, it is human to want to belong to a group. But, not, when that group is bigoted to you to the point that you have to hide your sexuality with wife, children and a bigoted voting record.