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Posted by: ontheDownLow ( )
Date: January 17, 2012 11:17AM

When I was discovering the fraud of the lds church last year at this time, i noticed the ward going into full help mode for me and my family. They sent the missionaries over to give us a pep talk.

They asked us if we had a testimony of prayer in which for the first time I actually could say yes, as a non-believer although I take an atheist position now.

40 years growing up in the church, I could never understand ppl who had stories about the power of prayer. Even on my mission, I felt like there was something seriously wrong with me. Why did I always feel like I was talking to the wall when I was praying? Moreover, I never wanted a patriarch blessing. In fact, everyone in the MTC made fun of me cuz I didn't have one. I used to look at others like my investigators when they said their prayers were answered to look in their eyes and see how. I just couldn't understand how God was talking to them and not me. Why?

Of course now, I think the lds church is lying and its all a fraud. However, during my discovery of it, I gave out an extreme heart felt prayer pleading for an answer to the BOM. The next morning, I began studying the scriptures when I stumbled upon an epiphony while reading chapter 13:4-8 of 1 Corinthians. Compare this to Moroni 7:45

I always read Moroni 7 all my life to cheer me up, and I also recognized the part about the parable of the good vs. a bad fountain being vaguely familiar with Matthew 7 and Christs' parable of the good tree bad tree, but I figured it was another prophet putting it in his own words.

How ironic that my prayer was answered upon my exit.

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Posted by: imaworkinonit ( )
Date: January 17, 2012 12:05PM

It just took me well over two decades to figure it out.

Interestingly, Carl Sagan was the guy who helped me out on that one. His discussion of "reproducible results"in his book, "Demon Haunted World", made a lot of sense to me.

I had been reading and praying about the B of M since I was 8, with the same result: NO ANSWER. Of course I realized that Carl Sagan was talking about science, and I was dealing with religion. But it made me think. Why wouldn't God WANT to give me an answer? Why would I need to jump through the hoops of faith for so long? And even if I got an answer, just ONCE, how would that outweigh the many times I had gotten NOTHING? How would I know it wasn't just a fluke, like cold fusion, or a mood or something? Why wouldn't the Holy Ghost bear witness to me ANYTIME I needed reassurance? Why NOT reproducible results????

I realized the whole situation--me groveling for answers and God not keeping promises (Moroni 10:4) was WRONG.

I DESERVED to know the truth. I had done what was asked of me, and I wasn't getting the promised blessings. That's when I decided that I would PROVE things with my intellect. I would find the best archaeological and other evidence for the B of M and reinforce my beliefs THAT way.

That didn't give me the result I hoped for ;-) but I'm glad I pursued it and got out.

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Posted by: kimball ( )
Date: January 17, 2012 12:16PM

I had always gotten a good feeling while praying about the church, though now I attribute it to my mind's ability to reassure itself - a skill I still utilize with great results.

One of the most troubling experiences of my mission occurred when I was stopping people in a park to talk to them. I had posters up with church information, and was trying to talk to every living soul who walked by. Most people avoided us or turned us down, but that never daunted me.

One guy willingly approached us and wanted to talk, which was nice, so I of course obliged. He then told me about how Joseph Smith was a con-man and the Book of Mormon a work of fiction. I felt a really dark spirit and grew very uncomfortable, but knew that I could find strength in the spirit. So I asked him if he had read the Book of Mormon. He had. So I asked him if he had prayed about the Book of Mormon. He had. I asked him if he had gotten an answer. Indeed he had, and the answer was that the Book of Mormon was a fraud. I asked him how he knew that the answer was from God, and he said that it was through the spirit, which he had sought for earnestly, and which had always led him to good results.

This did not fit with my theology, so I assumed that he was holding back the fact that he was an evil sinner inside, and I moved on to the next person.

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Posted by: RPackham ( )
Date: January 17, 2012 02:18PM

There's a great line in a play about a man who came to believe that he was God.

Someone asks him, "When did you realize that you were God?"

He replies, "Well, I was fervently praying to God, and suddenly I realized that I was talking to myself!"

"The Ruling Class" by Peter Barnes

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Posted by: Mia ( )
Date: January 17, 2012 02:37PM

Sounds like the secret to obtaining priesthood power has been told.

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: January 17, 2012 02:20PM

I much prefer the power of reason.

It is way more powerfull !

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