I have my own list, but I'm curious as to what the Board thinks/believes. Thanks

Above all, kindness. Also, love, generosity, charity, faith, empathy, inclusiveness, service, forgiveness, hope, and humility.

I'm probably missing some, but those are the first that come to mind.

Good ones Summer. And for sure abiding by the ten commandments- and that includes respect. Of course LOVE is the main or core value. I also think of the Beatitudes when this question comes up.

My experience has been that inclusiveness in not a mainstream Christian idea.

But if you believe in a historical Jesus, he was all about inclusiveness.

John 14:6, “Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”

“Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live.”

John 6:40, “And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.”

Jesus seems to make it quite clear that if one does not believe in Jesus will be EXCLUDED. I certainly do not see threatening people in order to get them to believe in him as being "inclusive".

Yeah, Jesus talks a good story when he is telling OTHERS what to do, but by his own words, Jesus says many will not "cometh unto the Father", a clearly exclusionary stance.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2012 11:15PM by MJ.

I don't believe he was speaking from an ego state when he said that.

I was referring more to how he would hang out with people whom others dismissed as sinners.

Jesus explicitly states exclusionary policies regarding gaining the kingdom of heaven.

How he hangs out on earth does not excuse who he excludes from the kingdom of heaven.

The fact that Jesus visited a slum does not mean he isn't excluding them from the exclusive places. Yes, Jesus visited the vermin on earth, but he is excluding those that to not believe in him from his home in the kingdom of heaven.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2012 11:29PM by MJ.

Inclusiveness? What about those who rejected his talks about him being manna from heaven, etc.? Seems to me he tested people to demanded of them blind faith in him - no empathetic adapting his message to those of little faith at all. He seems to be someone who tried a lot of things, it would not surprise me much if he was the one that gave Barabas the courage and idea to kill the roman soldier, and that it actually was for that reason the romans arrested him.

That might be cynical, but unless you embrace the "value" of devaluing yourself and fellow humans, Christianity becomes rather pointless.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2012 11:32PM by Stray Mutt.

Humanity is intrinsically flawed and worthy only of damnation unless the eternal, omniscient, omnipotent entity that made it that way decides otherwise.

Love

And the communion that love engenders

"The whole concern of doctrine and its teaching must be directed to the love that never ends. Whether something is proposed for belief, for hope or for action, the love of our Lord must always be made accessible, so that anyone can see that all the works of perfect Christian virtue spring from love and have no other objective than to arrive at love."

“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

Jesus replied: “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Matthew 22:36-40, New International Version

The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree.

You and some other posters might want to look up the definition of cynical. Can we have a discussion about Christianity without all the peanut gallery comments? You think Christianity is absurd, we get it already.

And who says that the eating flesh and drinking blood thing is symbolic? Most Christians throughout the centuries have understood it in a more literal sense.

Paying particular note to:

"This site is Christian-friendly. It is not, however, Christian-safe. Do not assume that everyone here will share your beliefs; other posters can and will disagree with and challenge what you say. If you decide that you need a site that is Christian-safe as well, we can recommend some places."

But I do wonder why Christians only want to look at the positive aspects of their religion, seemingly never really wanting to weigh the positives against the negatives.

The OP specifically asked for no cynical comments. I think 'cosmic Jewish zombie' qualifies as one. Its like trying to have a conversation about economics and some obnoxius Marxist keeps butting in with rants about the evils of capitalism and the coming revolution.

I'm not looking for a safe environment. I can take care of myself intellectually. To me its more about civility.

Thought I think the description you claim as cynical is indeed accurate, just a different perspective.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2012 10:25PM by MJ.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_presence_of_Christ_in_the_Eucharist

Many, and evidently, most believe that it actually changes into the body and the blood of Christ.

IF they think they are actually eating "in a real sense the body and the blood of Christ" I would call that cannibalism as well. I believe I am being realist, not cynical in saying that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2012 10:45PM by MJ.

You're calling this definition "cynical," but you're seeking the truth about core values of Christianity? You apparently want a cleaned-up, audience-friendly, super-sanitized version of Christianity. Look at each word of that definition and see that it fits. Look at definition, not tone, or context. This is the problem with seeking "truth." The minute you don't like someone's pronunciation while delivering it, you write it off as "cynical."

guynoirprivateeye Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have my own list, but I'm curious as to what the
> Board thinks/believes. Thanks

Your subject line is extremely cynical on the face of it. The fact that you acknowledge the negatives, and ask they be excluded, is cynical.

I won't judge you (Jebus forbid!), but no doubt god will judge you, as he has stated in Christian scriptures that he lives to do just that.

Theocracy. Hypocrisy. Bigotry. Blind faith. Conservatism in the extreme. Taking honor for stolen ideas. Sacrificing individuals and groups.

Well, I guess some of those values could be interpreted as cynical, but then I beg your forgiveness!

I have to ask, why is that?

Stop arguing or you'll get the thread shut down!
Guy asked for the basic tenants of Christianity in an honest & open way, acknowledging that there are those among us who disagree with theism & religion entirely. However, he specified that he would like to hear from those who do believe.
Being antagonistic and derogatory to those who believe isn't going to answer his genuine question. If you're not a Christian, then keep out of it, since this thread is directed specifically towards believing Christians, out of his curiosity.
And no, civilty isn't asking too much. Enciting arguments is uncivil.

Core values of Jesus Christ:

The kingdom of heaven is within. Literally not figuratively.

Love one another.


All of the cynical ones are what people like JS, Jerry Falwell and others made of an enlightened, positive message. And, as you can see reading many of these comments, JS and his ilk co-opted successfully.

the JST (joseph smith translation) alters this.

If I can't be cynical, then I am not commenting.

Gawd is a jealous dictator.

The whole idea of the fall is cynical, and the nonsensical "logic" of needing a savior is cynical, because it creates a scapegoat. Actual wrongdoers are not punished, but an alleged innocent is, and then the supposed wrongdoers are told they have no choice but to follow a certain path, live life a certain way, and be grateful for being told what to do, because they were born evil, and need this great gift of salvation. As a reward you get eternal life singing praises to, and serving the dictator, who you should call father.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2012 11:22PM by atheist&happy:-).

The core value of Christianity is this:

Albert Schweitzer,the great humanitarian who devoted much of life as a medical missionary to Africa, is in HELL, because he never accepted Jesus as being a god.

From his book, The Quest: "The Jesus of Nazareth who came forward publicly as the Messiah, who preached the ethic of the kingdom of God, who founded the kingdom of heaven upon earth and died to give his work its final consecration never existed."

Ted Bundy, who murdered at least 30 young women, and who confessed his sins to Jesus before being executed, is in HEAVEN.

What can be more "core" this perfect example of the breathtaking immorality of the Christian salvation doctrine?

you picked a cynical version of christianity to comment on.

I thought Jesus said (if he existed) that heaven is here and now - within. Then again, I'm not sure if Christianity has much of anything to do with the purported teachings of Jesus, so I guess I'm off on a tangent.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/10/2012 01:57AM by thingsithink.

You've hit on perhaps the essential problem with the Jesus mythology, thingsIthink.

There ARE teachings attributed directly to Jesus in the Bible. But these teachings are not entirely consistent, one to another. Add to this the body of second-hand folklore gathered around the Jesus character by the various "authors" of the New Testament canon, and the teachings become a mishmash of contradictions.

Kinda like the proverbial elephant examined by 6 blind men. They each come away with a different version of the elephant.
So it's really hard to come up with a body of core Christian teachings that describe any internal consistency.