I was recently at a government agency meeting where I am working as a contractor.

The last part of the meeting was quite hilarious. We are going to be in Wyoming next week and laying over in Salt Lake City Thursday night on the way home. One member of the team had been to SLC before and said we all have to visit the Mormon temple and started laughing. He then apparently realized it may of been an inappropriate comment in front of the group and meekly asked, "Are any of you Mormons?" Everyone just shook their heads and smiled. He then said, "Well OK then, be sure to visit the Mormon temple, but if you see a couple of pretty girls with name tags coming at you, run the other way."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2012 09:54AM by Eric K.

Interesting story Eric. But my real reason for posting is that you triggered a thought I have been having on what I think is the most effective way to get to TBMs so they will start thinking. It's about hitting their reputation in the gut with the truth.

"The LDS church has a reputation of not being honest and straightforward with even their members and as a result its very rare for honest people to join/stay in the church."

If we repeat that phrase over and over again everywhere online it will have an impact on many TBMs. Suppose the following conversation.

TBM: I know the church is true and led by a true prophet.
Exmo: I know the church's missionary work is suffering because the church has a reputation of being blatantly dishonest with its membership.
TBM: Do you have any evidence of this?
Exmo: Yes indeed. Would you like to know more?
TBM: No I don't need to because I feel good in my beliefs.
Exmo: So you're saying that as a member-missionary and parent that it doesn't bother you at all that the Brethren purposely deceive and that anyone who you bring into the church you're knowingly deceiving?



Of course not all or even most TBMs will be impacted anytime soon. But this is a battle that has legs. As we raise public consciousness that they're liars it'll stick, especially as long as Mitt Romney is in the public limelight.

Eric, you are so right. It was shocking for me to learn that the church was lying to me (about the first vision) because it never occurred to me that they might be lying to me. But it was almost as shocking to find out what my non-LDS friends really thought of Mormons and Mormonism. I'm talking about friends I've had since I was a small child - people I consider family. Once they found out I wasn't LDS anymore, it was like a dam burst and they could tell me what they'd really been thinking about the church all along. They had kept it to themselves because they loved me and they always told me "You aren't like other Mormons." That should have been a red flag right there. One friend I'd known casually for almost 10 years noticeably loosened up around me. We are much more relaxed and talk much more openly now. Now that I'm not going to try to convert or judge her.

Mormons think everyone looks up to them for an example. The YW theme for this year is Rise and Shine and Be a Light to Others. They really think they have a responsibility to set a good example of what the church is to non-believers because everyone is looking at them to set a standard. The YW leader came by and wanted my daughter to write on a piece of paper how she was going to Rise and Shine this year. It was going to be displayed at Standards Night, where the Young Women display all their accomplishments for everyone to admire. I wanted her to write "I will find out what people really think of Mormons before I presume to set an example for them." DD wanted to write "I will do good works in secret like the Lord commanded, rather than brag about them openly."

We ended up throwing the paper away and staying home that night to watch videos.

Certainly it was more productive than playing Mormon games. ;)

I love what your daughter wanted to write. Very cool.

Eric, if you go to temple square, please return and report. I'm interested in your view as an exmo as well as what your companions may have to say about it.

Someday when I get back to SLC I plan to visit temple square and other mormon sites. I'll make sure that I'm armed with some good questions for the mishies and tour guides. Could be interesting.

TG

I grew up in Indiana, and being a Mormon was never "cool" at any time. I learned to keep it to myself and avoid conversations about it, because saying you're a Mormon tends to evoke a lot of laughter and difficult questions. Then I went to BYU for school, and I experienced the opposite culture where if you're not a Mormon then you must be evil or untrustworthy or whatever. I couldn't take that attitude seriously, and I grew to be very annoyed by the whole Utah subculture.

I find now that people have a hard time understanding the concept of "former" Mormon. They think I'm still a Mormon and want to treat me like one. I really just prefer not to talk about it at all.

Mormons are not respected. They are tolerated because a majority of them are honest, and polite, and good employees/co-workers at some jobs.

When I broke the news that I'd left the mormon church to a few classmates at my last high school reunion, it went through the crowd in about 5 minutes. People who had never really talked to me in high school suddenly wanted to come over and talk to me. It was very interesting.

I was chatting with a group of about 6 former classmates and made the observation that I really did not know what church they went to in our town...didn't really care, I guess. But I mused that they all knew what church I went to and they all agreed, because they thought we were stuck up.

that was a great reunion, I have to tell ya!

It's funny, Eric, that yesterday I was trying to think of one word to describe Mormons and Mormonism. And the best word I came up with was "dishonest." Mormons are professional liars. Many of of them lie and cheat with MLM schemes and bogus products like the washing machine balls.

I feel that it's important for me to get the word out that deception is the cornerstone of that odious religion.

Washing machine balls? Is that like dishpan hands?

Is that what you mean, Don?

I had to google washing machine balls:
http://www.skepdic.com/refuge/laundry.html

Have not seen them in the antipodes yet. We must be a dirty bunch.

I am going to try the essential dishonesty of Mormonism approach with the family. And as suggested, if they deny this, i will ask for comment on a few issues. At present, if I mention certain topics my mother either develops crippling joint pain requiring her to take to her bed, or simply takes off and, leaving the bedroom door open, starts a prolonged prayer session on her knees in the bedroom.

Bit of a conversation killer.