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Posted by: Bridget ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 10:22AM

"I don't want to see a high quality person like you give up on the church."

My immediate reaction is I really don't have an answer, because the church itself to me is just that, it's just a church, a building, a place, and so it's kind of like saying to me: "I think you're a swell athlete, but don't want to see you give up on Gold's Gym." (assuming there are no other quality places out there to work out )

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Giving it a bit more thought, I suppose my answer is this. It has origins and doctrines that are very offensive to me (that JS, a philandering man with a reputation as a con artist would be selected as God's chosen prophet), its doctrines don't make sense (lacking in logic), and what's more, it it is focused on dumbing a person down, rather than expanding their horizons and their intellect, and provides very little opportunity for women and girls to grow and progress in any way beyond become spouses and mothers--which of course, they can do without"the church."

I feel Mormonism is a sect, not a true Christian church, that teaches bits and pieces of Christianity, mingled with gnosticism and Freemasonry, and its legalistic, Old Testament methodology is actually oppressive and repressive, rather than life-affirming, and it leads its members into a judgmental framework (us against them) wherein it ends up fragmenting, rather than strengthening families, particularly when there is one or more family members who don't believe or who question any of it.

And there is a lot to question, if one steps outside of the box for a little and looks at the origins, history and doctrines practically and realistically. IMO, if it were really God's true church (assuming there even is a God, and He/she were a loving power/personality), it would then harmonize and strengthen famlies, regardless of their level of belief.

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Posted by: Flat Lander ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 10:24AM


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Posted by: CA girl ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 12:11PM

People who have too much integrity to live a lie, people who don't want to lower their standards to Mormon level, people who are too educated to believe fairy tales in place of historical accuracy, people who have the courage to take a stand. For all the reasons you mentioned in your post.

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Posted by: Anonymous User ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 12:27PM

could not fit into a mind control cult. Rational, analytic, articulate? Those qualities are not compatible with the morg.

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Posted by: Adult of god ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 12:27PM


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Posted by: SusieQ#1 ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 12:29PM

Besides: "High quality people", in my view, are willing to accept new information and change their mind if it's contrary to what they believed was true and factual.

All I need from you, is to live your own religion - particularly the 11th Article of Faith.
We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.

I'm noticed that many LDS families find this impossible to do when it's their own family member that has changed their mind about believing the claims of the LDS Church.
Most probably can't repeat it either.

Besides if you "allow" someone to do something, you don't interfere!

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Posted by: honestone ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 12:45PM

Wow Bridget, you said it all very well. Those ARE the reasons to not want to be in the Mormon cult. Well done.

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Posted by: flyfisher ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 12:53PM

Those exact words came out of my last chat (I use the word chat because if I use the term "interview" I feel it gives the some sort of delisional power) with the bishop here. He went further in stating that "I know better". He even tried to GUILT me with the passing of my late wife. He said that she knows too. I told him that, that is one point we can agree on. She does know cuz she has passed over. Please don't use her in this. Needless to say he didn't know what to say. When I asked him if he knew that Old Joe had a gun in jail with him, he didn't know that but said that he probably would have one too if he (my bishop) was in jail. He didn't even know the real reason why he was in jail. It saddens me to see how controlling it all is. Well he has yet to contact me but the SP has. Well his secretary has. I said that I was not available for a "interview" and to not contact me anymore. When I want to "chat" with the SP I will call you!

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Posted by: get her done ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 04:52PM

I must be a really low class quality person. I just can't stand to why cheat or steal, in the name of god. I could not have my name or family associated with any known cult.

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Posted by: Uncle Max ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 08:01PM

Yup and thought later that in fact I was more like a sailor, leaving the sinking ship to the rats.

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Posted by: Makurosu ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 08:51PM

Jesus hung out with the sinners. I'm trying to imagine Jesus saying something like "Well, Thomas, I hate to lose you. You're a high quality person, and a high quality person can go far in my organization. Just go the extra mile, and I could see you going down in a glorious martyrdom. Plus I need you. These low quality people who keep flocking around me are a dime a dozen. I keep having to perform miracles just to feed them. They're a bunch of freeloaders. But you, Thomas, are a high quality person. You speak well, you're educated, and you're a nice guy. I like you. Why a high quality such as yourself would have any doubts about peepstones, magic underwear and the planet Kolob is completely beyond me. Now, go repent."

My parents talk about "high quality" people with regard to Mormonism, and I don't think they're aware of how really cliquish it sounds. Even a bit bigoted.

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Posted by: baura ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 09:45PM

Them: Baura, I don't want to see a high quality person like you give up on the Church.

Baura_01: Oh, I won't be giving up on it; I'll be telling people what a load of crap it is every chance I get.

Baura_02: Gee, until now I was always called a slacker who didn't work hard enough and berated; but now you are calling me a "high quality person." I should leave the Church more often; it seems to increase my quality.

Baura_03: If you hate to see that then look the other way; you've been looking the other way about a lot of Church history and doctrine anyway so one more time won't hurt.

Baura_04: Yeah, I hear you; low-quality cults need high-quality people to make it work.

Baura_05: Well if you guys really need me I'll come back under these conditions: only half hour of church attendance on Sunday, No home teaching assignments, I get to choose my TR interview questions, and only 1% of net for tithing.

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Posted by: JoD3:360 ( )
Date: September 26, 2010 10:52PM

You hate losing a High Quality person?

When HiQs son was in deep trouble, where were you?
When HiQs MIL was sick, where were you?
When HiQs wife was a shambles from the stress where were you?

When you were my Hometeacher, you couldn't even visit us when my wifes mother lay dying.

If I was a High Quality Person, that would have to be the reason that I left...I was so out of place in your ward.

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Posted by: Athena ( )
Date: September 28, 2010 10:12AM

This sounds suspiciously like what some organizations that run on volunteer labor call "high value members" - i.e. those who contribute much more to the organization or cause than they need from it. High value members have time and money to contribute, good organizational skills, and no major personal problems that interfere with their ability to contribute to the organization.

For example, a "high value" member of the church would have money for tithing, skills the church needs, willingness and ability to work for the church in many capacities, and be unlikely to need support from the church (church welfare, etc.) In other words, someone who brings in more than they take out.

This was about the church's need for you, not the other way around.

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