So having learned that he was CIA kind of really bothers me. Especially if he was involved in MK Ultra. Those folks were loading up johns in San Francisco with pcp and sending them into the streets. How messed up is that? It does not mean that Neal was doing that, but there was some messed up stuff done to people and the mind control experiments would be unbecoming a Mormon as I was raised understanding the term. Any other apostles have that kind of background?

The CIA is a huge organization, and only a small fraction of their members were ever involved in stuff like MK Ultra.

The vast majority of people in the CIA or any other government job are good men and women, who work hard, and provide a valuable service to their country.

BTW, how do you know Maxwell was CIA? What are your sources on that? For every guy that was CIA, or a Green Beret, or SEAL, there are something like three guys claiming to have been one, so I need more then just his word on it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2013 07:01PM by forbiddencokedrinker.

Yeah, first I have heard of this. Prove it.

It always gets on my nerves when people start denigrating people just because they were associated at some time in their life with the CIA. I used to live in a neighborhood where many of the people were employees/contractors for the CIA and these people basically are a cross-section of America, except they are perhaps much smarter and more educated than average. For obvious reasons the CIA really can't do much to defend themselves because Intelligence work is supposed to be secret. For example, the Americans/British deceived the Axis Powers into believing in 1943 that the allies were going to open a front in Yugoslavia, instead of Sicily which is what they actually did. That right there was a good example of an Intel operation that worked because it was kept secret. The next year they did the same type of deception with the Normandy landings and Operation Fortitude. One of the reason why General Patton became so beloved was because of how much publicity he generated while engaged as the Supreme Commander of Fortitude - a non-existent operation that the Nazis believed was the real deal for D-Day and thus they were badly deceived. The OSS (now called CIA) was heavily involved in the planning and execution of these deceptions. And you do a disservice to the S2, G2, A2, N2, J2, etc. staffs in the military units for all the work they do in conjunction with the CIA. I'm not saying that every operation that the CIA does is wonderful and I'll be the last one to defend any evils that happen. But I wish people would actually look at the big picture and all the facts honestly.

No one ever works for the CIA. They "work for the government." When asked exactly what they do, they reply, "oh you know, just another bureaucrat." Everyone knows, but officially, no one knows. Every now and then a government agent will come around and ask probing questions about your neighbor/friend/acquaintance. That is a signal to all concerned that yet another security clearance is in the offing.

NSA people will tell you where they work, but not what they do. But it's usually not that hard to figure out.

Well, one does wonder about the close ties between Mormonismand the U.S. government, and perhaps some sort of connectionbetween gathering names and data on ever person on the planet through genealogical research. Does Mormonism work hand in hand with various governments to keep records of people?

I believe that is paranoia. The truth of the matter is, that while the CIA, FBI, and for that matter any government office, keeps records on people, they normally only do so when they have an invested interest in doing so. You can have too much intel, when it is in the form of useless information that is of little to no use.

The CIA actually had key Intel on the location of Osama Bin Laden for years, but it was buried with so many other leads, that it took them a very long time to realize what they had. Same with the FBI and the 9-11 hijackers taking flight lessons. It got buried under garbage. Creating a file on every American, would just be a big pile of garbage.

The simple truth is, you are not important, so no one in either the CIA or the FBI probably gives a rats behind about you.

Now, if you really want to worry about a government agency that has detailed records on you, look at the Social Security guys or the IRS.

Who's to say LDS Inc. doesn't supply IRS or someother governmentagency with names and numbers, not the CIA???

What years was he in the CIA? Was he part of Air America, the CIA's air cargo company used to get tons of drugs out of Vietnam, away from our troops and safely onto the streets of America? Or did he help overthrow governments around the world to install US-friendly yes-men? Did he have a hand in assassinating John Lennon or other counterculture figures? Did he help smuggle weapons to Latin American death squads?

Most employees of the CIA don't do the dirty work. But if you're a sociopath bordering on criminally insane, boy do they have a job for you!

The CIA wants people who can keep a secret, don't ask questions, and don't even think to ask questions. In other words, your average Mormon.

You're confusing some things. The CIA drug smuggling was in the 1980s as part of a really bad plan to gain intel on the drug cartels. In that regard, it was like the reverse of the ATF's Project Gun Walker, except that most of the drugs coming into America went into warehouses, and not the streets.

Air America, was Vietnam era, but it rarely operated, if ever, in Vietnam. It focused on Laos and Cambodia, and was about getting guns and supplies to Hmong tribals who were fighting the North Vietnamese Army who were operating in their country. Technically they were there illegally, but then so were the North Vietnamese army guys. Some crooked CIA officials may have been involved with heroin smuggling, but that wasn't Air America's mission.

I'm sorry, but from a wife of someone who worked with Air America, I must say you are wrong. Yes, they took guns and supplies over, but they also brought drugs back. My DH says it was every trip that he took, not just occasionally.

Some of us have more knowledge than others regarding this sort of employment. I'd say I need proof that he ever went near the door of the place.

I know a little about maxwells,
Could you post anything to link him to the CIA ?

I don't know, CIA or selling women cold cream and mascara.

Both fields would seem to have their weaknesses as spiritual leaders go.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/14/2013 09:03PM by lulu.