I apologize up front for so much personal, selfish dram posting here. I guess I need other perspectives. Previously I had posted about breaking up with a GF who I felt was not very giving and seemed to even be playing at covert aggressiveness (playing games).

I'm confused now, after self-evaluation at a couple of CODA meetings, finding that I exhibit unhealthy self-defeating patterns. I realized that because she had very clearly, strongly professed her love to me a couple weeks ago when I spent the weekend caring for her while she was sick, that I panicked at the thought of feeling this deeply for someone and that they returned the feelings. I've not been here in many years and have closed off my heart after a bitter divorce. I believe (suspect) now that I may have set up a standard for her to purposely push her away because I couldn't accept love. I might even have deep self-esteem problems making it difficult for me, out of fear of serious rejection down the road and going through the pain I felt in the divorce.

However, I have positives. I am a very caring, pleasing person. I give of myself. I can communicate openly and honestly. When I began fearing, I closed off open communication and reverted back to covert or passive engagement.

After breaking up, she expressed some strong disappointment (expected) and then we opened up a dialogue about why I had broken it off. That's when I realized that I probably set up the impossible (passive/manipulative) test so that when she failed, I could justify escaping the fear of ultimate rejection.

Several here told me to break off all communication with her. Perhaps I should, but I think I misjudged her now. I believe that the problems are more me than her. Or perhaps I am being blinded again. She says she wants to be friends and support me to improve. She says that she beleives I am not as flawed as I am feeling right now. She has a lot of encouraging things to say. Maybe it's flattery, or maybe she really cares and still loves me.

Are you happy with her? It is easy and natural, or is it a lot of work? Does she make you want to be a better person?

Dont consider the things that you give or do for her or whether or not she loves you and needs you. The real question is whether or not she is good for you.

Why don't you stop worrying about the relationship bit and instead, focus on the internal work you're doing with yourself?

There's nothing wrong with remaining friends with this woman while you go through the process. If it is you and not so much her, then doing this work will make you a much better partner for her, don't you think? If it turns out it's her and not so much you, then doing this work will make you a much better partner for someone else... don't you think?

Quit worrying about if you did the "right" thing with this chick. There are no right or wrongs here. Just keep doing what you're doing.

I recommend that you go directly to www.shrink4men.com. Read the blog and consider joining the forum. You can ask questions there of other men who really have been "hoovered" (sucked back in) to a relationship.

As for my own thoughts on this, it sounds like you're willing to do a lot of self-examination, which is an encouraging thing. I don't know about the woman you broke up with. If you were unhappy, though, there must have been a good reason. Sometimes people get caught up in destructive cycles with others when there's a crisis and one person decides they want to break things off. The other party changes and there's a honeymoon period. Then, once the relationship is going again, things go back to the way they were before.

Did you really just not see the good things in your ex girlfriend before? Or has she "changed". If she's changed, I'd proceed with caution, because it's likely the change will be temporary until you're entrenched in the relationship again. Without knowing her, I can't tell you if she's being manipulative, but again... if there were problems before and she's now cleaning up her act because you want to break it off, I'd be suspicious. People who change under those conditions rarely maintain the changes for good.

Suzanne wrote:
>The real question is whether or not she is good for you.

Good question. I find that I often feel inadequate with her because she is a perfectionist, is very neat and tidy and precise with her language. She is smart. I'm intelligent. She is neat. I'm creative. The differences can make me feel inadequate and want to try harder. But I am also a little embarrassed on some of my failings.

Compared with previous relationships, I have some where I never felt inadequate. I felt at ease. But that often accompanied feeling a little bored and unchallenged in the relationship.

Does she make me happy? Often yes. Sometimes I feel slightly neurotic/anxious. There were times when I didn't hear from her one evening and I didn't know why, so I became anxious. That's unusual for me in the past. Usually, I was the one wanting to be left alone or to have a night or two in peace.


dogzilla wrote:
>Quit worrying about if you did the "right" thing with this chick. There are no right or wrongs here. Just keep doing what you're doing.<

I think this is excellent advice. I need to calm down, take the time and work on myself. I think I fear I lost something that was better than I deserve. But then, I know that it's not true. I also fear I lost something when I felt my heart open to her, and that makes me anxious that I will never feel that again. It took years for me to get to this point. But I think the best thing I can do is to improve myself.

knotheadusc wrote:
> Did you really just not see the good things in your ex girlfriend before? Or has she "changed".

Good question. I think she's making a case that I missed it from before. And I find myself agreeing somewhat. But I also feel red-flags because she reminds me a little of my ex-wife who is a master at covert-manipulation. When I start talking with the ex GF, she is very convincing and I feel my head spin that I am losing out on something very special. When I calm down and get away, I start questioning that again.

I need to step away from the whole thing and risk letting go permanently. I can't believe how neurotic I have become over this one.

You write *But I also feel red-flags because she reminds me a little of my ex-wife who is a master at covert-manipulation. When I start talking with the ex GF, she is very convincing and I feel my head spin that I am losing out on something very special. When I calm down and get away, I start questioning that again.*

That, to me, is a huge red flag. My husband's ex wife is a very manipulative person who was constantly spinning things. When I met him, she had him thinking that their relationship's demise was entirely his fault. Of course, he does share in the fact that it failed, but she did not take any responsibility for her part. She had him shouldering the whole load. The more time passed, the more he started to see the situation more rationally. He was able to think clearly and let go of some of the blame. He also realized that the relationship's failure wasn't necessarily a bad thing. Obviously, I'm delighted their marriage fell apart because it allowed him to move on to a much more successful relationship with me.

As I got to know my husband and observe his ex in action with my husband and others, I started to see that people who were around her were like giant cans of soda that were constantly on the verge of explosion and never had the chance to settle. She kept everyone on edge and uncomfortable, like they had to be very careful or risk blowing up.

When you're with someone who makes your head spin and keeps you walking on eggshells, you can't really settle down to think rationally. If your ex makes you feel this way when you're with her, you would probably do well to stay away from her. She obviously has you rattled and it sounds to me like you're more comfortable when you're away from her. However, you also seem to have formed a traumatic bond with her, which keeps you vulnerable. If I were you, I'd try going no contact for a good long time.

And really, check out www.shrink4men.com. I think it will help you immensely.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/14/2013 02:57PM by knotheadusc.

"She is smart. I'm intelligent."

What does this mean? I always thought of smart and intelligent as synonymous with each other. I use them interchangeably. I'm trying to figure out how this makes you different.

In thinking about things that you said in your previous thread, two things really stand out to me.

1) You stated or maybe implied that you were the one always making the concessions if this is true all or the majority of the time, this is a really big red flag for me. You need to look at this one closely.

2) She never told her family (?) about you in the 5 months you were dating, as some other poster put it in the last thread it certainly seems that she is hiding something.

If these are modus operandi for her then you really need to think hard about it and decide if these are acceptable behaviors before getting back into a relationship with her.

Thanks all for the thoughts. I spent hours this weekend talking with her, opening up everything, all my fears, all my thoughts. We communicated about where our communication failed. How she'd failed, how I'd failed. And when were done, I found her recognition of what I needed was attended in spades, and I felt my love for her grow.

We're back together. I'm working on not projecting the fears I have about my ex-wife onto her.

I've been with my boyfriend for 8 years and I broke up with him a few times over things I saw as extremely unfeeling. I also caught him just as he was getting divorced. I dated him at age 20 and didn't marry him because he wasn't mormon. I had been out of my marriage for 9 years when we got back together, but he was just barely going through his divorce.

I finally decided it was where I wanted to be--and instead of breaking up with him anymore, I chose my battles carefully and then I did communicate with him. He actually knows the signals now and will ask me what is wrong. I oftentimes take my time to figure out how I'm going to say it rather than just blow up (which is my tendency). Things have gone a lot better since.

So--I wish you luck. Relationships are NOT EASY.