[Inspired by RfM poster, suzanne's thread: http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,825819 ]


"1. We don't worship Jesus
"2. We aren't Christian.
"3. Satan was the literal brother of Jesus
"4. Mormons are polygamous
"5. Mormons believe they will be Gods (capital G)
"6. We don't accept the Bible or we only accept the Book of Mormon.
"7. We are a cult
"8. We reject all and any considerations of the trinity
"9. LDS women are brainwashed Stepford Wives. (yea...right!)
"10. Joseph Smith was a _____________ (fill in the blank)"

http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/42542-the-ten-biggest-lies-about-mormonism/


How many problems can you find with this list?



[Subject title edited]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/15/2013 03:26PM by Fetal Deity.

Fetal Deity Wrote:
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> "1. We don't worship Jesus

I'd say they like Jesus fine ... when they think about him, that is.

> "2. We aren't Christian.

Not traditional Christians - that's the whole point of Mormonism isn't it? To break away from traditional Christianity and clean things up? They used to be proud of this.

> "3. Satan was the literal brother of Jesus

I was a Mormon for 30 years. I was taught this growing up.

> "4. Mormons are polygamous

Some are, some arent'.

> "5. Mormons believe they will be Gods (capital G)\

I was also taught this growing up.

> "6. We don't accept the Bible or we only accept
> the Book of Mormon.

They accept the bible, they just think it's a second rate scripture compared to the BoM.

> "7. We are a cult

Does this person know the characteristics of a cult?

> "8. We reject all and any considerations of the
> trinity

Their trinity isn't the traditional trinity.

> "9. LDS women are brainwashed Stepford Wives. (yea...right!)

I'm sorry - I attended BYU and lived in the Salt Lake Valley for several years after I got married. They are most decidedly Stepford Wives and if they don't knuckle under, they will be DISCUSSED!

> "10. Joseph Smith was a _____________ (fill in the
> blank)"

I'll be you a rum and coke that whoever wrote this doesn't even know JS was a polygamist since they seem woefully informed about things that I was taught in Sunday School and at BYU in the 80s.

>
> http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/42542-the-ten-
> biggest-lies-about-mormonism/

> "1. We don't worship Jesus

They don't have crappy "rock bands" singing his praises, so I have to go with a no.

> "2. We aren't Christian.

This seems to be based on popularity. And survey says, "Wah wah."

> "3. Satan was the literal brother of Jesus

Yes. And Elohim is the literal father of Jesus. Really gave Mother Mary the best 2 and 1/2 minutes of her life. She also got cab fare back to Nazereth because he's classy like that.

Didn't call the next day though. In fact. He doesn't show up until Jesus is baptized. And that's the first praise Jesus gets from his real father.

Maybe having Darth Vader as your father isn't so bad.

> "4. Mormons are polygamous

In their sexual fantasies the men are. In their household chore fantasies the women are.

> "5. Mormons believe they will be Gods (capital G)

Why else would you pay so much money? To be an angel that not even Apocalypse would experiment on?

Lame!

> "6. We don't accept the Bible or we only accept
> the Book of Mormon.

We only accept the scriptures we like. And most scriptures don't mean what they say they mean. Pretty much like every other religion here.

> "7. We are a cult

Please don't look closely into our missionary program and mission rules.

> "8. We reject all and any considerations of the
> trinity

The gods are ONE in purpose!!! Why can't you stupid antimormons get that!!!

> "9. LDS women are brainwashed Stepford Wives.
> (yea...right!)

Not true. Now where the shit is my dinner? Slut better not have her worldly shoulders bare again.

> "10. Joseph Smith was a _____________ (fill in the
> blank)"

Loving husband and father.

Oh oops. We were talking about lies.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/15/2013 01:17PM by Raptor Jesus.

This may be the hardest you have ever made me laugh---at the truth.

Raptor Jesus Wrote:
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> > "3. Satan was the literal brother of Jesus
>
> Yes. And Elohim is the literal father of Jesus.
> Really gave Mother Mary the best 2 and 1/2 minutes
> of her life. She also got cab fare back to
> Nazereth because he's classy like that.

I remember being taught that God doesn't measure time the way we do - that's why he could create the earth in seven days. That a day in God's time is like 1000 years in human time. If that's true, Mary could have had one hell of a weekend.

That's funny, Raptor.

Number 11: We worship Joseph Smith.

"....cab fare back....because he's classy like that...."

I literally snorted.

BTW, Russel Nelson is a polygamist...he is sealed to his dead first wife and sealed to his live second wife. He believes he is sealed to both women, and that dead or alive, he is just on the eternal continuum. Sooooo, that makes him a practicing polygamist.

Satan is Jesus literal brother. Yes.

God was Jesus father, God was also Adam, that made Him Jesus Great,Great,Great, Great,GReat, Great, Great Grandfather also--as he would also be for Mary, with whom he had his son and greatest grandson Jesus, but did not make an honest woman of her. I think God was also Michael, or was that Jesus? Then with Noah sleeping with his daughters, or was that Lot? Or both? And some fallen angels sleeping with everybody you really don't know for sure who is family to whom?

Once you get into it, you really have to go with the RLDS after all as the ones who got it right when continuing the grand tradition.

Mormons are spiritual polygamists.

is hilarious coming from people who call almost all mormon males over the age of 18 "Brother"!

1. We don't worship Jesus
-- Technically, according to Mormon mythology, you aren't SUPPOSED to worship Jesus. Jesus said that he would go down, be the savior, give man free-will, and the glory would go to Elohim. That said, Mormons DO worship Jesus but they tend to put Joseph Smith up there with him.

2. We aren't Christian.
-- That really depends on your definition. Most fundamentalists think this means you have to believe in the Trinity which Mormons don't. However, the literal definition is that you believe in Christ as your savior. Mormons most certainly DO believe that.

3. Satan was the literal brother of Jesus
-- A someone else said, I was always taught this growing up. And I grew up in the church in the 80s and 90s so I'm not that far removed.

4. Mormons are polygamous
-- They really aren't though they believe in polygamy in heaven.

5. Mormons believe they will be Gods (capital G)
-- Again, I was always taught this. It was the entire point of Mormonism - to become Gods and bang our harem of Goddess wives.

6. We don't accept the Bible or we only accept the Book of Mormon.
-- They do accept it, but only with the stupid JST footnotes. Also, even with that, it's still considered second banana to the Book of Mormon.

7. We are a cult
-- If it acts like a cult, sounds like a cult, and looks like a cult, it's probably a cult. I'd consider it a cult with better PR and lawyers.

8. We reject all and any considerations of the trinity
-- Basically, yes. They believe that God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are separate beings which is what believing in the Trinity is all about. Not that I would consider this a bad thing. The Trinity doctrine of Christianity was made up hundreds of years after Christ supposedly died and makes exactly ZERO logical sense. Jesus talks to God a LOT in the Bible. What, is he talking to himself?

9. LDS women are brainwashed Stepford Wives. (yea...right!)
-- This is a matter of opinion but yes, they tend to all look, act, and dress the same. I'll just leave it at that.

10. Joseph Smith was a _____________ (fill in the blank)
-- Why doesn't the poster fill in the blank? You could fill that in with "prophet of God" or "con man" so... some more guidance is needed on this one. Personally, I'd fill it in with some words that I probably shouldn't use on this board :D



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/15/2013 02:16PM by cecil0812.

"1. We don't worship Jesus"

Mormon Jesus requires me to work for my repentance. Mormon Jesus' grace is not sufficient.

"2. We aren't Christian."

Can a Christian call herself Mormon? Only Mormons can define who's Mormon and only Christians can define who's Christian.

"3. Satan was the literal brother of Jesus."

The LDS church has downplayed this so much that people don't even know that it was ever taught. All it takes is a little investigation to find it. I would start with "Mormon Doctrine" by Bruce R. McConkie (A Mormon)

"4. Mormons are polygamous"

Polygamy is not practiced on this earth by the main body of the LDS church, but it is practiced in eternities. Cases in point, My grandfather was sealed to his first wife, she died, he remarried and got sealed to his 2nd wife - he's sealed to both. There are also a couple of apostles that are sealed to their widows and their current wives.

"5. Mormons believe they will be Gods (capital G)"

True! Lorenzo Snow said, "As man is, God once was. As God is, man can become." Look it up.

"6. We don't accept the Bible or we only accept the Book of Mormon."

Mormons accept the Bible only as far as it's translated correctly.


"7. We are a cult"

Cults control what you can eat (Word of Wisdom), what you can wear (garments), who you can associate with (Do you support, affiliate with or agree with any group or individuals whose teaching or practices are contrary.... This is a temple interview question). Require you to pay lots of money to them. (Can't go to temple if you don't pay tithing, may also not be able to get church welfare)

"8. We reject all and any considerations of the trinity."

Heavenly Father, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are taught to be 3 separate beings in Mormonism. In traditional Christianity they're all the same God, just three different manifestations of the same God (like ice, water, and steam are 3 different manifestations of H2O)

"9. LDS women are brainwashed Stepford Wives. (yea...right!)"

I think there's mind control issues and a lot of misogyny in the church, but that's probably the case outside of the LDS faith too. I don't think the LDS faith either fosters this environment or dissuades it.

"10. Joseph Smith was a _____________ (fill in the blank)"

Was a what? I can't really address this claim if you aren't more specific. Was a pedofile? (He was.) Was polyandrous? (He was.) Was a fraud? (He was.) Was a prophet of God? (He most definitely was not!)

In fact any list that doesn't include some "official" commentary sanctioned by Monson, Monson & his Henry/Dietr, or the FP/12 combined is frankly a total waste of time. Groups like FAIR, Maxwell house, DCP's new outfit, and other apologetics groups have no standing. We need the truth, period, and anything less than the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth from the Big 15 is a total waste of our time. Any list not addressing the Book of Abraham, Lamanite/DNA issue, other BoM historicity issues, deceit over polygamy history, MMM, and Kinderhook Plates is a waste of time.

About number 10, fill in the blank---I have heard it said many times that Joseph Smith was a "charlatan" and Mormons would think this is a lie.

Charlatan : a flamboyant deceiver who falsely makes elaborate and fraudulent claims to sell something to unwary customers

Synonyms: fraud, phony, fake, quack, imposter, swindler

How could anyone say THAT about Joseph Smith? I mean, Really!

Right? LOL

#1 really I would love an example of how jesus is worshipped, I never witnessed that. Ever. Just go stare at the house where joseph smith died and cry already. He is your true jesus and we all know it.

#2 is subjective depending greatly on who you ask, the perception in general when I was a kid in the 80s and 90s in Louisiana was most definitely that Mormons were not Christian. It seems the mormons have tried to change that perception which seems pointless if you are Christian.

#4 to me if you think your going to have wives on your own god planet, if you are going to have sister wives on your husbands god planet, you would be an earthly polygamist if it wasnt illegal or posed no threat to your church standing.....you believe in polygamy so your a polygamist. Just stand behind what you believe at least that has some measure of respectability.

#5 see number 4.

#7 you are in a cult, get over it.

#9 really lol

#10 factually he was a lot of things, I just wish he would have been imprisoned in new york for money digging or being a mystic or whatever then we wouldn't even have to have this discussion.

The rest of it is either someone ignorant to their belief system, has spent every sunday in the nursery singing I am a child of god, or they just wont admit the truth.

When I read something like that list put out by a TBM, or TBM author. I just think to myself, Mormons just want to feel good. They don't actually care what is actually true or to take the time to actually find something out for themselves. They just want a sense of security and to feel good about themselves. It is unreal.

Mormonism claims a crapload of stuff about itself that just isn't true.

That's exactly what I was thinking. The lies/misstatements from the inside are far more egregious and misleading than the occasional technical lie (usually based on a misunderstanding of an actual teaching of Mormonism) that comes from without.

Treasure digger! No, that one's true. Polygamist! No, that one's true as well. Liar! Oops, I guess I have to admit he did that a few times. Adulterer! Well, perhaps some people might point out the illegality of his plural marriages. Tyrant! Does the Nauvoo Expositor really count? Traitor! The State of Illinois wasn't worthy of his allegiance anyway, and you can't prove he sent Porter Rockwell. Fraud! None of it means he was a fraud!

Belief in Mormonism is easy when your main "prophet" guy says, "That which is wrong under one circumstance, may be, and often is, right under another." Mormon leaders are able to claim a lot of wiggle room with quotes like that.

1. We are mainstream Christians
2. The Church cares about its gay members
3. We are largely a charitable organization
4. We don't claim that we'll become gods
5. No Mormons are polygamous
6. Family always comes first
7. The priesthood is not mandatory for males
8. Mormon women are equal to men
9. Tithing is a donation
10. We respect other religions

Upping this....

Uh, quite a few. Literally just referencing issues in the original post. I'll put my knowledge of Mormon Doctrine up against just about anyone and this list is a joke. Whoever put it up obviously hasn't done any real reading & research. Even when I was TBM I knew the answers to much of this stuff, although I had justifications to fall back to. Pathetic.


"1. We don't worship Jesus
(no, Mormon's worship God the Father, Jesus is not supposed to be worshiped, he is the Elder Brother and Savior).

"2. We aren't Christian.
(Yes, Mormons are Christian, they don't accept the trilogy though.)

"3. Satan was the literal brother of Jesus
(Well, according to Mormon Doctrine, he was, spiritually but doesn't have a physical body, so can't be physically.)

"4. Mormons are polygamous
(Well, most of them are not, Now! The LDS church has a strong tradition of polygamy and polyandry, well documented, though.)

"5. Mormons believe they will be Gods (capital G);
(Yes, LDS doctrine teaches that is a possibility if members are faithful.)

"6. We don't accept the Bible or we only accept the Book of Mormon.
(They - Mormons - accept both the Bible - as far as it is translated correctly - and the B of M, as well as other revelatory scriptures.)

"7. We are a cult
(LDS People don't believe this, but they ARE a cult; check out this totally random website - I just googled "signs of a Cult" and see what you come up with.)

"8. We reject all and any considerations of the trinity
(they do.)

"9. LDS women are brainwashed Stepford Wives. (yea...right!)

(Having been one, yes, LDS women are brainwashed Stepford Wives. It's not empowering & it's not pretty but it's real).

"10. Joseph Smith was a _____________ (fill in the blank)"

(oh, this is far too easy. "polygamist, felon, child-molester, adulterer, con-man, Liar, Ponzi Scheme author, just to name a few.)

2. We aren't Christian.
This depends on your definition of "Christian." Most Christians would say that you aren't Christians. But if you go with the definition of a Christian being anyone who believes Jesus is divine, then yeah, I'll give you that one.

4. Mormons are polygamous
This depends on your definition of "Mormons." Most Mormons would say that polygamists aren't Mormons. But if you go with the definition of a Mormon being anyone who believes the Book of Mormon is divine, then no, you fail on that one.

7. We are a cult
This depends on your definition of "cult." Most people would say that Mormons are a cult. But if you go with some definition of "cult" that specifically excludes religious organizations that have two-year-long brainwashing programs that isolates young people from their friends and families, secret handshakes in their secret ceremonies, excludes family members from their wedding services, and wears magic underwear... nope, not going to give you that one! Your a cult!