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Posted by: squeebee ( )
Date: April 27, 2013 11:42PM

A TBM relative just posted that bit of drivel on Facebook. Why doesn't anyone see that a constant need for indoctrination against a world that knows better as a sign that you may be wrong?

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Posted by: Mr. Neutron ( )
Date: April 27, 2013 11:50PM

Because these people believe in Satan and his legion of angels. I believed that they existed until I was 38 years old. If children are not indoctrinated in truth, then Satan is free to convince them to let go of the iron rod so that they will wander in the mists of darkness, go into the great and spacious building, or drown in the river of fabulous gay sex. That is what they believe, and many of us believed it.

It was only when I stumbled on contrary information via the Internet that I was able to see how ridiculous it is. But prior to that, it was very, very real. Worse still, the culture's acceptance of things that are opposite to church doctrine simply proves the reality of Satan to these people. It's the filter that I was born with. It is very powerful. It is also very sad.

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Posted by: Thomas Jefferson (non-Christian) ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 03:51AM

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Posted by: squeebee ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 03:53AM

Actually, at worst the world will not teach them to, most of the world really doesn't care one way or the other as long as you keep it to yourself.

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Posted by: Thomas Jefferson (non-Christian) ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 03:57AM

"Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned. What has been the effect of this coercion? To make one half the world fools and the other half hypocrites,"

And you can quote me on that.

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Posted by: Thomas Jefferson (non-Christian) ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 03:58AM

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Posted by: sherlock ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 01:55PM

What does it even really mean to follow Christ? Live an honourable life, showing kindness to one's neighbours etc?

I know many non-members that epitomise this, many much more so than some of the gossipy, two-faced and judgemental TBMs that I've known.

TBMs seem to have a world view that aligns 'following Christ' with attending the temple, doing your home teaching, paying tithing, attending meetings ad cleaning toilets.

Wrong. This is simply following the LDS church's mantra. But in fairness I suppose the example has been set by church headquarters - they had multiple $billions available to really make a significant difference to the lives of the poor & meek and yet they choose to invest it in a high end shopping mall.

Following Christ? My arse!

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Posted by: donbagley ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 06:37PM

Why is Satan the default position?

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Posted by: nickname ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 07:15PM

That's just the way god made us! :p

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Posted by: minor2nd ( )
Date: April 29, 2013 03:13PM

Mormonism leads to black and white thinking. THere is little room for a nuanced approach. Most Mormons have a hard time with ambiguity and paradox. It just doesn't compute. (I'm saying this in all humility, because I was prone to the exact idiocy for a very long time.)

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Posted by: memyself ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 07:48PM

I believe and always have, as the less than 2 yrs on and off in the cult didn't really change me...Do onto others as you would have done unto yourself, don't judge, do your best..just the obvious things any decent person would do. They sure are hypocrites..I have never in all my life met such gossiping, judgmental poor excuse of human beings!

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Posted by: Stray Mutt ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 08:02PM

Oh, but wait, Mormons whine when Christians claim Mormons aren't Christians. It's so confusing.

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Posted by: memyself ( )
Date: April 28, 2013 08:04PM

and the call the catholic chrch..the church of all whoredoms..lmao...they sure talk alot about porn and whores!...cracks me up

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Posted by: nilla ( )
Date: April 29, 2013 11:08AM

A little OT but:

My dad posted that on FB shortly after I told him how I felt about the church (in a friendly and non-aggressive way). That was a couple of months ago and he hasn't responded to me. I don't know what to do I'm very disappointed. I guess he doesn't want to have a relationship with me anymore. Which is sad but with him being severely brainwashed and so deep into TSCC I guess there's not much I can do.

I have sent him friendly messages every now and then and have tried calling him but no response.

Right now I am just over it. Sick of caring. I feel like he doesn't deserve me trying anymore.

It would be nice to have a good respone to this! Maybe "If we don't teach or children to think for themselves, TSCC will teach them not to."

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Posted by: anagrammy ( )
Date: April 29, 2013 01:07PM

I'm so sorry about your Dad. Our parents are the people we always thought loved us unconditionally. To find we can lose their love by "being bad" takes us to grapple with fundamental issues of abandonment.

It helps to think of him as a victim of mental illness.

Being brainwashed by a cult to feel a constant anxiety and unworthiness is creating an unhealthy mental state. If you look at the diagnostic criteria mental health professionals use, many of them are manifestations of prolonged anxiety - panic attacks, hearing voices, sleep disorders, cutting, anorexia, on and on.

You are a decent, loving son who is choosing to lead his own life on his own terms. You continue to extend the hand of friendship and love in the face of his rejection. I don't even know you are a fine person.

Why don't you take another tack? Send your Dad an email thanking him for the values he taught you. Mention one in particular that has meant a lot to you and how your father taught you that value.

You can write to him about shared interests and ask a question, like on gardening or cooking or bike riding or mechanics. Something other than church, if you have one.

Underneath the church-planted fears of separation from you in eternity is the fear that he didn't do a good job as a father. It is completely within your power to alleviate that fear and reassure him that even if you have left Mormonism, you are still a good legacy.



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Posted by: rainwriter ( )
Date: April 29, 2013 12:02PM

How is it that TBMs believe Satan has power over people? That's something I've never understood. If we have to choose to follow Christ and make a continuous effort to follow Him, how can Satan be powerful enough that we follow him with out even thinking about it?

And really, what's the big deal about not following Christ anyhow? We can be moral people with out that.

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Posted by: elciz ( )
Date: April 29, 2013 12:30PM

Morality is not the exclusive domain of church goers. In fact, I now find myself doing "good things" because that is "who I am", not because I am supposed to do something. I get the arguement alot that my kids would be drug users, etc., without the church. I am more confident now that they would actually be BETTER if we did not have to spend our time in church activities. I could see us doing things together as a family that are good things, things I wouldn't ever do as a Mormon.

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Posted by: squeebee ( )
Date: April 29, 2013 12:39PM

Or as the Christmas carol says, "be good for goodness sake" which I interpret as doing good because it is good, not because of fear of punishment or a lack of blessings.

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Posted by: quebec ( )
Date: April 29, 2013 01:19PM

I was listening to a song by Claire Pelletier called “Le maître et l’esclave” (The Master and the Slave).

It tells the story of a man in a distant land living as an artist with wife and child. Then the “Master of the World” comes and tells him that now the man belongs to the Master and now all the man’s work will be for the Master and will belong to the Master. At one point the Master tells the man, take all your things and now come follow me. At that moment the man becomes slave to the Master.

I suddenly flashed back to the ‘hymn’ Come Follow Me and realized that all the time I was told to follow Christ, it did end up meaning being a slave. Because, in either case (let’s suppose they do exist one second) whether it is Satan or Christ, if you follow one of them, you are not following your own path.

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Posted by: luckychucky ( )
Date: April 29, 2013 01:23PM

My concern is the opposite. I try to lead my children away from the idea of Christ and religious belief while concerning myself with the ever present religious dogma and ignorance constantly being thrown oround in the world at large.

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