When I first started to visit RfM, I was a little offended by all the references to tscc as a cult even though by that time I had pretty significant doubts about the church.

The first time I realized tscc just might be a cult was when I told a few close family members that I no longer believed the church to be true. I was surprised at how my family members would recoil at the mention of any facts that didn't portray tscc in a positive light. I then realized that only a cult could convince members of an organization to reject the truth so that they could maintain the false reality created by the organization. It made me feel sorry for those still ensnared by tscc's flaxen cords, and certainly convinced me that tscc was a cult.

Once I realized that my family would put the church before me. The church came first. Considering I left the mold and no longer wanted to be part of it, I was no longer a priority. Just an afterthought.

Also the fact that the lds members usually will never read literature pertaining to their religion unless it was their own.

I was relieved when the family who brought me into the church, 18 years later told me that they learned it's all a lie. I was relieved of all the issues I'd put on a shelf, all the questions & skepticisms I had at church but knew better not to ask, all of the church history that troubled my mind, the way the "scriptures" constantly contradict themselves, etc. Relieved and FREE now. Cleared off that shelf and threw everything away.

Wow Lenina that is great that they came to you with the truth so you no longer had to fake a sincere association with the Mormons. Those are some fine people. Congrats.

November, 1978 -- when I was reading about Joe Smith with
his multitude of followers hold up at Far West, Missouri,
ready to die en masse, resisting the surrounding forces
of the Missouri militia.

At the same time that I was re-reading this unpleasant
latter day history, the TV newcast was showing the bodies
of Jim Jones' fanatical, kool-aid drinking dead followers.

I pondered that juxtapositioning of images -- wondering if
the Jewish mass suicide at Massada fit either picture.
My mind's eye drew a spectrum, in which the People's Temple
dupes were at one end, and the Jewish martyrs were at the
other end. Where along that continuum did the Far West
Mormons of 1838 best fit?

Right alongside the Jim Jones fanatics, I concluded.

That is not to say that every single Mormon acts the part
of a cultist every single day of his life. The LDS overlap
into cultism without being a cult in every way.

But the overlap is undeniably real.

And, come to think of it, those old Jews at Massada really
weren't all that different either.

UD

Arbitrary spectrum. They're all fanatics, and all cults.

when I was in the temple with my hands over my head chanting pay laY ale.

"Now look here," said the Prophet. "I reckon I done got these damned fools eatin' out o' my hands." He takes another swig from the jug. "They'll do what ever silly thing I tell 'em. I got this whole ceremony rigged up that I got from the Masons -- 'cept I done put some extra re-ligious stuff in it." A wide, silly boyish grin appears on the Prophet's face. "They're chantin' up and down like crazy and I got 'em paying my drinkin' money and they don't even know it..."

"Not ta menshun, Emma don't e'en know I'm a bangin the maid and all her frens, too".

When I learned about the magic rock and the magic hat.

When I realized and faced the fact that the church did not want its members to ask questions or think, only to follow and obey. The statement that was given that when a prophet speaks, the thinking has been done for the members made me so angry and put the nail in the coffin for me. Only a cult would operate like that.

Sadly, when I first heard that the discussion was over when the prophet spoke, it sounded reasonable to me. In retrospect, it should have been a huge red flag when we were taught to let the prophet do the thinking for us.

The day I was asked to pass my thumb across my throat.

Jesus.

Even though I denied my thoughts and feelings, my first step into the Temple as a youth and seeing Oxen holding up a Baptism Pool and then performing baptisms for people who were dead. Creepy! Making out with the girls on the bus ride was much more fun.

When I went to the temple the first time.

And again when I recognized the masonic connection.

Many years after I left the church, just after Jonestown, I had a flashback to conversations in the family about their willingness to drop everything on a moments notice and march to Missouri.

I realized that they would do anything--ANYTHING--the prophet asked.

Because I left when there was no internet, and I knew of no supposedly anti mormon materials to read, I left on a gut feeling that Spencer W. was a dangerous a33hole, not a prophet.

So I knew nothing about the real problems of the church until I found RFM, Richard Packham,and Steve Benson's posts, and then read a few books, and realized how truly controlling and life-sucking the cult is.

It is a CULT. A cult that destroys families.

When I saw a child get up during F and T meeting and bear testimony with a parent whispering in their ear.
And also the first time I heard primary sing "Follow the Prophet". (I was a convert).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2013 12:39PM by dogeatdog.

I had my suspicions but about 2 years after I was out, SIL got remarried to a guy who was totally into some self-improvement program where you pay to advance in "knowledge" levels. DH and I got worried it was some weird cult (even though the new hubby was LDS too) and started researching some of the sites I'd seen mentioned here that talked about the qualities of a cult. Even though I suspected Mormonism was cultish, seeing those characteristics spelled out in black and white by experts was really something.

One thing I learned is that cults are dangerous because they are a mind-control situation. I see people on this board talking about how all religion is bad and Mormonism is just more proof of this. Think what you like about religion but what makes Mormonism so much more toxic than most other faiths is that element of mind-control. Other belief systems may teach myths and may not help certain people, may not be a good fit for other people. But not all of them have the elements of mind-control Mormonism and other cults exhibit. It's a distinction that exmos should not take lightly. Dislike the concept of church and religion all you want but the mind-control religions, as explained on cult watch websites, are far worse.

Ask a Christian or Muslim a hard questions about their religion and you will see the mind-control come out. Many of them are dependent on the story of Jesus Christ or Mohammad for their identity.

I agree that Mormonism is more controlling then the general population of either of these religions as a whole. Some of the sects and leaders are far worse then Mormonism.

Yes, there are some groups that are as bad or worse than Mormonism. But there is a difference between mind control and just defending something you love. If I verbally attacked your partner because I didn't like certain elements of their personality, I expect you would rush to their defense. Not because you were in a mind-control relationship but because people defend what they love. It may be similar to certain aspects of mind-control but it's very different in the intensity. Like most people have narcissistic characteristics in their normal personality but it's a big difference from having diagnosable Narcissistic Personality Disorder. To compare a normal person with a true Narcissist is unfair to both and takes down the seriousness of the diagnosed person.

But you are right -there is a spectrum and different belief systems, even political and self-improvement groups, fall along that spectrum. It's when things cross the line, like Mormonism has, that the real problems begin.

Shortly after my shelf collapsed and I knew it wasnt true..... my first instinct was, 'well its still a good church that teaches and does a lot of good.' Then I realized how horrible the doctrine of forever families really is. Just a threat tactic to keep you in line.....then I started to see how they use all these psychological tricks in every aspect. It became more and more clear how disturbingly cultish the church really is. I think once those original blinders come off, this line of thinking naturally follows.

It took me far too long, even after realizing the church wasn't true, to conclude that TSCC was a cult. I suppose its because I never really thought about what a "cult" really means. In my mind it was some small group of blind fanatics who do believe really weird things or blindly follow dangerous leaders like Charles Manson or Jim Jones. When you grow up Mormon, everything they do and believe naturally seems normal.

When you are a part of a cult you don't think of yourself being in a cult. When I was able to step back and see how TSCC operates then I was finally able to conclude it was a cult. It may not be as extreme as groups like Scientology or Jim Jones, but they definitely employ tactics that a cult uses. When an organization tries to control you as much as TSCC does and threatens you and discourages questioning and open dialogue as much as TSCC does, then THAT is a cult.

I realized the Church was not true several years ago. But I really did not consider it a cult until the Jensen/Turley-rescue-meeting here in Stockholm. They told us doubting members to eighter get out, or to stay and never speak to anyone about our questions ever. That if we choose the LDS Church we sided with Christ, and that anything else was choosing Satan.

I had no doubt it was a cult as soon as I went through the temple.

I wish I would have been honest about it then. My mom asked, "So, what did you think?"

"It was great," I said, lying.

"Oh, I'm so happy. I thought you might get freaked out like so many others!"

I wish she would have told me that before so I might have tried to be honest.

The whole time during the endowment, I kept thinking, "Oh my god, I'm in a cult! Oh my god, I'm in a cult!"

Emphasis on reading only church-approved literature.

Everything relate to Young Women's groups and to Relief Society.

Stupid men telling me what to do because being mormon gives them the right to do so.

Watching really young kids be coached through their 'testimonies' started to get to me in F&T meeting.

Once I got some information about what goes down in the temple (thanks, ex-mo dad, for pointing me to some resources!) I suddenly didn't want to marry an RM in it any more and started reading everything I could get my hands on.

That was 25 years ago. I've considered it a cult ever since.

Only cults ask their members to write Birthday Dinner invitations to people they've never met, who have never attended their church, all because at one point in time 25 years ago they used to go to their church.

I first suspected when you are told not to question church leaders and not to ask questions about things. I think that's what cults do.

When I first heard that "Brother Joseph" used his spayshul seer stones while peering into the bottom of a hat! I was like, WTF? That opened the floodgates and it didn't take long for the rest of the dominoes to fall.

When somebody said it didn't matter what Joseph Smith had done, it was all still true.

Epiphany.

http://www.memecreator.org/static/images/memes/1627988.jpg



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2013 07:26PM by crom.

A teacher in high school was about to say something about mormons but paused and asked the class if there were any mormons in it. I sheepishly raised my hand, already knowing we were a peculiar people and not really wanting to be outed as one, yet that's what you do even when there are cracks in the brainwashing already.

She said, " Isn't that a cult?"

And I spent a few minutes sheepishly defending it because I didn't know any better.
Lady had balls to say that as a teacher!
I have no idea where she was going with the whole discussion, I was completely embarrassed and forget everything but the humiliation of trying to explain something I hardly believed myself.

I'm glad she said it. I went home and told my mom that a "friend" had told me I was in a cult, expecting some kind of explanation for how we aren't really in one, but she only nodded and smiled expectantly as if I would have something more to say.
Not the answer I was looking for.

I was fully in for about 32 years. I accept that it is what it is - a cult.

But the word still jars me and feels loaded. My sweet dear family is deeply TBM and its difficult for me to consider them as members of a cult.

I am uncomfortable with the charged meaning of the word, although I fully acknowledge its by definition a cult.