I believe there is too much danger in letting the mormoney cult, as I view it, go unchallenged. They are into money, control, and prestige no matter what. And the "no matter what" is what frightens me. Strengthening the Members Committee is not a committee to be taken lightly, nor are all the lies and manipulation sputtered by the cult. There are countless examples, but one recent one is the two lives that were needlessly lost by the Mark Hoffman incident. In my book some of the head haunchos in the cult were as guilty as Mark Hoffman and lied and lied some more to save their sagging a*^#S.
Example is the best teacher in my book, but I also feel like I do owe it to whomever I come in contact when the topic of the mormoney cult surfaces, to share some of the facts as I know them. Then the ball is in their court; they can check out the issues or not, it is up to them.
This is an incredibly deep question, actually. Kind of like the technique of the old Zen master, where the question momentarily suspends thought.
owe ō/Submit verb 1. have an obligation to pay or repay (something, esp. money) in return for something received. (online definition)
By this, technically, nothing is owed. Perhaps one may freely give. But nothing is owed. Because to owe, would imply an abdication (however slight) of control, acceded to whom one "owes."
The danger is that predatory people/institutions can be very good at identifying our finest human attributes, and then turning these against us. Being giving and overly-responsible are particularly keen vulnerabilities.
"If you go away I will cry and be sad" is actually a hostage situation, if you think about it. Adults are responsible for their own feelings. How can we "make" someone feel something? The same event can elicit different feelings from different people. But the (false) idea that you are somehow responsible for my feelings, is actually nonsense, and is used to control, so that you stay.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/14/2013 01:51AM by zenjamin.
These thoughts are a thread all of their own. I have never thought of how "predatory" institutions can use our best virtues against us. (Now "giving" members must clean toilets). Please keep sharing your thoughts on this...so important.
Thank you. You articulated that concept so beautifully. I understand more why I don't like people doing things for me, not even my parents. It always made me feel obligated and I can't stand that feeling.
So I have to go with no, we don't owe others anything (except our children) but we owe ourselves the growth that comes from at least attempting to make a difference.
Yeah, interesting. I have felt guilty for decades about not doing anything to stop my entire family except one brother, from joining this cult. Then in the interest of religious tolerance, not fighting and arguing with them over the years about their obviously fraud-based beliefs. I think they always thought that I knew they were right, but I was merely a sinner more interested in my worldly pleasure than in their message for my salvation. I don't know to this day if I owe them anything, but how do you tell an older brother, who has brought children up as mormons, with now grandchildren on a mission, and great grandchildren now coming up, that he is dead wrong and a dupe for tithing?
Actually, NO. Once you have come to the discovery of the truth for yourself, the next step will come, which is there will be opportunities to share your newly found nugget of clarity in ways you could not imagine.
Perhaps, this lifetime around, getting out of religion was the only important advent to experience. I know, for me, the peace I have at this moment is so great that I could move on to the next adventure ready for more with greater wisdom and freedom to offer to the dream of reality.
Just like I had no desire to be a member missionary, or serve a formal mission, and get people in; I have no desire to get people out. To each his own.
It's my calling in my family. I've taken the responsibility to kill the mormon branch that I have access to. So far...5 down...1 wavering and 2 to go. Great success on THIS mission.... the formal one...not so much. The church has caused so much damage to my family that to sit on the sidelines after my awakening seems dishonest to me.
Each person is different. For those who feel more of a responsibility than others, I say go for it. Be an activist. For those who don't feel that doing so is their calling in life, follow your calling. Let the Holy Ghost be your guide :)
I totally agree. I think all we can do is to provide information, and in cases where we can still influence our children's upbrining, make a change there when possible (it is particularly difficult when one of the spouses is a TBM).
ACIM: »Knowledge cannot dawn on a mind full of illusions, because truth and illusions are irreconcilable.»
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2014 12:46AM by Facing Tao.
We are all connected, this human family. We owe it to others to scream a warning and point. Chimps do that for other members of their troop--it is for the good of the tribe.
That being said, you and you are alone are the guide as to what form your interactions will take. You might write a book, or a blog, or just post on Rfm. And everything in between.
But the most important thing is to save your immediate family--your spouse, your children. No one should live a life of emotional slavery chained by fear and guilt. Your children whould be able to choose their own path in life, not follow a checklist diverting their services and their income from the family to the benefit of an impersonal corporation.
Personally, I post here and I tell anyone who brings the subject up. I don't seek Mormons out to tell them because I think it is wrong to impose my beliefs on others. In this age, anyone who has a question about the church knows perfectly well where to get impartial answers - go to mormonthink.com, or any other site the church warns you against.
Short answer is "yes", but former Mormons are the best equipped to expose the double-talk and duality. To expose the true teachings and doctrines as opposed to the PR outward facing versions.
I will also add that there seemed to be a spanking given for activism here on RfM, that this forum is somehow about recovery only. Validation and nice words for those attemptng to stay Mormon, but make it better somehow. Perhaps activism is one way Former Mormons can best recover from their Mormonism, especially those former Mormonism with a history of having been used as a took of deception whether duped or lazy. Also we are seeing individuals with personal and professional skills that have the ability to challenge powerful, wealthy institutions. Serendipity can happen through community engagement. It is enough to save yourself from Mormonism, but or some they can do more, for others they may need to do more to save themselves. Fight back, speak to power with contempt and a claim for accountability.
The Mormons are ot able to effectively dress doen well versed former Mormons, we see them for what they are and we can take them on just fine.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2014 01:14AM by gentlestrength.